Thread: what to do with these bergs (beginner)

I'm not sure what the going rate is but I think $120 for a matched set of Bergs in good condition is pretty good.
I would use them for general work. Don't be afraid to whack 'em with a mallet. Those handles will take a fair amount of punishment.
I can't really tell from a picture but they appear to have a decent bevel on. I would try an oil or waterstone for establishing the bevel and flattening the back rather than paste.
The main thing is to get them as sharp as you can and use 'em.
Enjoy.

Hi Kyle,
right place.

i reckon i saw you when you managed to nab them, i was at the market looking around at all the books and records and that seller is always at the markets, not often does he have complete sets of chisels or such so i noticed them, that guy tends to charge top dollar but those are a fair enough price i would think (a bit better than retail price maybe), a matching set is nice to get, i've seen em much dearer at least, if i was to put it that way...

imo they are a good general purpose chisel (some people could go their whole life and do most any job with just that set), a light duty bevel edged firmer chisel, or many guys on this forum might call em bench chisels, you could do most jobs well enough with them, cabinet joinery, some larger joinery , second fix cottage work, some heavy joinery in a pinch if your careful with em..of course you can use them as paring chisels, their not overly obese for paring still quite slender so of course you can pare with them in a limited capacity , generally a paring chisel will be much thinner again (gives greater feel and control) and much longer (greater reach), also you can use these for dovetailing joints since they have bevel edge (bevel edge is there to give you better sight lines of the tip, for all joinery work and also helps with dovetails due to the angle of the joint) although the lands/bevels dont go down to zero, for regular dovetailing they will work well enough, but some brands like Lie Nielsen and many others go down to very sharp edges which makes them quite nice for getting in the tight edges, still most of those popular (and expensive) brands are too thick for a dedicated dovetailing chisel imo, not sure why other people dont seem to notice that.

so i'd say you did well enough (one looks a tad short), a good all round chisel set made with quality steel, for specific jobs there is always a chisel more perfectly suited and designed for the job but everyone has (or should) a set like yours in their tool kit


cheers
chippy

well its good to know I didn't waste my money that's a relief!! now all I need to do is sharpen them what angle would you guys propose I sharpen them to? I think I will use them for more detailed work as they are pretty thin bevel.

I brought a sandvik back handled chisels as well only $8 to practice sharpening with. So fare I have sharpened it on a 25 deg and micro bevel of 30 on a 1000 grit water stone. This has seemed to work but I have no hard wood to test on just pine.

The reason I'm going for diamond paste is its cheap and apparently works well and can get a mirror finish so ill try that when it comes. The first thing I'll use them for is to make something to stone them in. Well once i get set up just built me a bench to work on. I use pine for the base and laminated 2 sheets (18mm) of mdf for the top just need a vice and some wood YAY.

cheers
Kyle

$20 each is not bad for Bergs. That set will last a few lifetimes if reasonably looked after. As the others have said they are a good general purpose bench chisel and will do well for most of your woodwork needs.
There is a whole lot on here and the web in general on sharpening. I cant comment on paste as I have never used it but I agree with NCArcher that the bevels look not too bad and so they should sharpen up well without too much work.
Regards
John

I think aluminium is too soft for a lapping plate. You need something hard like thick glass, polished granite or even cast iron.
Good luck, TM

cant afford a grinder? at all? crikey dont think i'd like that very much... second hand you can pick one up pretty cheap, let us know your budget and maybe some folks can help you out by pointing you in the right direction..some hand grinders can be had for $20 or more at markets, plus the cost of a new wheel in most cases, idealy imo flat grind is best which is from say a belt or specific rotary disk sander , next is 8 inch grinder, but you can get by with 6 inch grinder (heck its better than nothing) and they are very cheap, powered second hand or a manual hand grinder the cheapest options


cheers
chippy

well the aluminum is free so ill see how it goes and Ive read of mdf being used for the diamond plate I think aluminum has to be better then that.

For the grinder its more like I have to spread out my spending and I was thinking of getting the cheap carbatec $99 grinder but if you think there is something better I could get in that price range please I will take your advice!!

Oh and thanks for all your replies guys it is great to talk to others who are experienced

cheers
Kyle

IMHO at a market off what chippy describes as a dealer to get all 6 in one go well done.

Particularly because you have them in your hand!

Epay has a set of six red handled starting at 300 at the moment.

I suggest going back to the market and buy your grinder there. Markets near me allow electrical appliances to run to see if they work. If not bathrooms at markets usually have power points. (wouldnt try out the electric chainsaw in there though)

Alternatively do you live near another Adelaide member with a grinder who can help you out? Surely someone could offer

i'd agree pac man, that chap is on the more expensive side (and a dealer) but i reckon his cheese slipped of the cracker a bit on those chisels..strange really, unlike him to let something go cheaper...terrible story behind it all too (not for Kyleof course), it was part of a complete tool kit in a hanging wall cabinet, that looked wonderful but he didnt want to sell it complete, he broke it up (to get more money no doubt) and thinks he will get $600 or more for the cabinette alone, i reckon he should have sold it complete, it was custom made to fit each tool, anyone who wants a tool cabinet will make one to fit their own tools, or so i would assume, might be wrong though


cheers
chippy

yeah I know that cabinet was damn awesome but hell I didn't have the money to buy that thing and probably would have no idea how to use most of the tools in there. I am happy with the chisels I got tho. I just cant wait to sharpen them and use them to make something but I need to figure out how to get some wood especially since I have a Hyundai excel Oh and yes a grinder

Hi Kyle

Many believe that EA Berg made some of the best chisels and plane blades around. Berg were bought out (in the 50s?) by Sandvik, who were taken over by Bahco. The descendants of the original Berg chisels are not a patch on them, and so you now have chisels to feel proud of.

The red handled types you have are the equivalent (in Berg terms) of the Stanley yellow handles insofar as they were made to take the beating from a hammer on a job site. At least one well-known US furniture maker, Garrett Hack, has been using these same chisels for decades and writes of them with much fondness.

You need to learn to sharpen them. First you need to grind them. I would not learn grind using these as it it likely that you will burn the steel at first if you go for a bench grinder. Get a cheap(er) common chisel to practice on.

Good buy!

Regards from Perth

Derek

I will probably be trying to learn to sharpen with the diamond paste on an aluminum plate as I have already got that (well waiting on the paste I ordered). My $8 sandvik will be my test for a mirror finish using the diamond paste. maybe ill take pictures of my progress doing all this and post it on here so everyone can see my mistakes especially with the aluminum plate as it has been stated its too soft as a honing medium. Question for any who have done the diamond paste method how much does the 40 micron take of lots? can I use it to re-shape chisels as I do have some titan chisels as well that are in a desperate need of flattering all over (probably have to wait till I have a grinder).

cheers
Kyle

Kyle - eyeballing those chisels, they appear to have very steep bevels, particularly the wider ones - looks closer to 40 degrees than the 25-30 that would be preferable for general-purposse chisels. If the bevels are as steep as they seem to me to be, there will be a LOT of work to get that off by hand-power alone, & you might find that very discouraging. Like Chippy, I would be thinking of a way to get the excess metal off quickly, but if you are a newbie to sharpening, it is probably a bit deadly for your nice new chisels if you get stuck into them on any sort of grinding wheel without a bit of guidance. Contrary to what some people seem to think, it is dead easy to burn steel with a hand-cranked grinder, too, all you need is a glazed wheel and a moderately heavy hand!

I get the impression from this Forum & elsewhere, that many people have very low opinions of powered grinders, possibly because of bad experiences, but used properly, they are quite safe & far & away the most efficient way to do the grunt work in sharpening tools. If you use an appropriate grit size (coarse is usually better than fine and preferbly in a soft-bond matrix like the "white" wheels), clean the wheels with a star-wheel or diamond dresser prior to starting (& every few minutes during use), and grind in a series of passes with a light touch. Just keep the steel on the wheel gently & firmly, a properly dressed wheel cuts with little presure required. Keep a finger on the metal up near the end being ground (on top of the tool, not anywhere near the spinning wheel ), and as soon as it gets a bit hot, dunk it in water to cool it. It's when you are nearly there that it gets tricky - the thin end heats & blues very quickly if you are careless, so pay special attention at that stage. As Derk advised, it would be a very good idea to get yourself a clunker and use that for practice, before getting stuck into your more precious lot....

Cheers,

Hi Kyle,

I am throwing in my 2c worth as someone who is not all that far from you as a beginner to hand-tools and woodwork.

I didn't see those bevels the same way Ian did/does (see previous sentence) ... but whatever the angle they look pretty nice to me.
I think you could profitably start by keeping those bevels unchanged and learning to sharpen them as-is first.

But definitely got all-out on some non- or less-valuable chisels ... flatten the backs, hone the edges ... figure out what sharp means.

BTW ... Supercheap have a 6" grinder at $35 down from $50 ... a reasonable starter tool, and don't sweat the wheel-type.
Rockwell Bench Grinder - 150mm - Supercheap Auto Australia

I'd figure a year for learning to grind somewhat reasonably ... I made some gemstone-like multi-bevels trying to learn to grind initially
Carbatec had a cheap ($20?) grinder rest that allowed me to get my first ever nice bevel off the grinder.

More cheap suggestions ... perhaps try learning to sharpen freehand ... at least for the primary bevel.
I think you'll appreciate it down the track.
If you want you can then use an eclipse-style honing guide (also cheap) to do the secondary bevel.

Finally - congrats. It seems likely to me that you had done some homework, and were prepared to take advantage of the opportunity - when it came up - to buy those chisels even if you weren't 300% sure it was going to turn out to be a good move.

Good luck with it,
Paul

How about that ... Bunnies have ...
Stone Sharpening Norton 200x50x25 B/cmb S/crb Be173274

for $26 (I bet even they don't know what "b/cmb s/crb" although I acn guess) and $70 for an EZE-Lap 600 diamond plate.

(Not saying they are the best supplier - just surprised they have anything)