Thread: Block plane makeover - another one

Well if you hadn't told me, I would not have recognised it as the plane I gave you. Your adjuster is a whole lot better than the original too, which was about as crude as an adjuster could be!

Not sure it would be quicker to start from scratch for something like that, but the amount of work you've put into that plane probably wouldn't be a lot less.

Looking at the pics, I reckon you could have rounded the sides of the wedge/hand grip a bit more, both for comfort & to make it look a bit more aerodynamic.....

Cheers,
Ian

Cklett,

That looks fantastic, agree the original one was looking very ordinary, your transformation will be talked about for many generations too come.

Agree with Ian, a little more rounded on the rear bun would be nice, but that’s only my opinion, also I didn’t see any Pat pending marks [emoji6].

Also Not sure if you picked up on Ian’s comments about might be easier to start from scratch, just be very careful with those sly comments.

Cheers Matt.
Can’t wait too see the next one.

Thanks. It is fairly comfortable. I didn't want to go too far with the wedge. I will leave it for a little and can still fine tune the shape a bit more.

Will see....

Sent from my SM-G781B using Tapatalk

CK, I was in a bit of a rush last night with my reply but there were a couple of other things I wanted to say.

But first, I was probably a bit harsh on my critique of the handle - it does look elegant from some angles. The sharpish edges just caught my eye, but without handling it, I shouldn't have jumped to conclusions about its hand-comfort. The distinct facets do give it eye-appeal and remind me a bit of the woodwork on the new "Ironbark" tools. So, Matt, you & I are probably just not up with modern aesthetics.

I really liked your ingenuity creating the new adjuster - if I'd been attempting a makeover on that plane I'd have tried to do something with the existing adjuster (which was as primitive as it gets!), and probably ended up with something even worse, but your solution to ditch the original entirely was far more practical. I've used both M6 & M5 for adjuster screws on small planes; M6 is more robust and I prefer to use that when the screw is exposed outside the body like this:

3.jpg 5.jpg

But with the screw 'protected' inside the works like on your plane, M5 is definitely the better choice, the difference in pitch (.8mm vs 1mm) doesn't seem a lot but it makes a difference when you are trying to make very fine adjustments.

I noticed the knurling is a bit "light" on a couple of the thumbscrews - I had that problem when I started. Sometimes the pattern formed easily but sometimes I got a shallow, half-size pattern. Obviously, it's due to a mismatch in the diameter of the work piece & the pitch of the knurling wheel, but it took me a while to stumble on the solution, which is to simply persist until eventually the diameter is reduced a little & the notches match up & form a proper pattern. With mini lathes that can't tolerate much side pressure without flexing of the cross-slide, it helps to start off with the work turning very slowly & have the knurling wheels engaging only about 2-3mm of one edge so that it requires less pressure to start the pattern, then engage the screw-feed to move the tool across the rest of the area to be knurled. Make multiple passes until you have a good knurl pattern. Squirting on a bit of cutting fluid every few passes also makes a huge difference to how quickly & cleanly the knurl pattern forms....

Cheers,

Love the transformation CK!!! I have finally got my hands on some small pieces of Hairy Oak and am now waiting for the right project to come along. "Never say never"

Nice looking block plane modification! It looks comfy and inviting to use.
Your knurling comment interested me . I was studying the three knobs before I saw your comment and wondered about the knurling tool . The rear knob has a brickwork pattern look to it but I guess that's the challenges of knurling brass hey . How did it get that? It was the same knurling tool for the three knobs wasn't it? You never know what it may end up like when learning. Ive been playing with hand knurling brass this week on the lathe. Trying for a rope knurl on a crowned turning. Getting results all over the place.
IMG_3632.jpg

Stunning result CK - you have a very lucky niece!

CK

Just superb: A remarkable transition. Are you looking for a nephew too. I am available for adoption.



Regards
Paul

Originally Posted by auscab

.... The rear knob has a brickwork pattern look to it but I guess that's the challenges of knurling brass hey . How did it get that? It was the same knurling tool for the three knobs wasn't it? You never know what it may end up like when learning. Ive been playing with hand knurling brass this week on the lathe. Trying for a rope knurl on a crowned turning. Getting results all over the place.....

Rob, I'm 99% certain it's because the diameter of the rod is not an exact multiple of the interval between the teeth of the knurling tool. The last cut ends up close to the first one, but not right on it, so the next tooth hits the work between the first two indentations and proceeds around the diameter making a new set of teeth between the first set. Sometimes this will go on for quite a while & even form a tolerable but shallow knurl that is finer than it should be. But if you persist (with a solidly mounted tool ), it will gradually form the 'proper' pattern. For quite some time after I got my knurling tool I didn't appreciate its workings properly & could not fathom why some knurls came out perfect & some with a pitch that was about half what it should be. Eventually it dawned on my dull brain that some diameters would knurl quickly & easily consistently, while others consistently gave that 'half' pattern. So I tried just keeping on working at the 'wrong' pattern & bingo, the full pattern eventually emerged.

This is one of the few instances where you can keep on doing the same thing & eventually you do get a different result..

However, I have not yet tried hand-held knurlong, so all bets are off there. I would assume that the same principle applies, but because you can't hold the tool as rigidly as one boltred in a tool post, it's going to be more difficult to play 'catch-up' & get the teeth to match. I found the very coarse straight wheels (after much searching). I haven't yet had a crack at a 'rope knurl' but it looks like I'm in for some fun & games....

Cheers,
Ian

Yes Ian I know what you mean by the diameter and the bite of the knurling tool and it getting better with pressure and coming good.
I have experienced that on Steel. My first trials on steel were all over the place and but I soon got that worked out by going harder.
For a while I thought there may have to be some complex working out of diameter and knurl type or knurl teeth.

With Brass though it seems there is less malleability for the swaging of a knurl pattern . You have mentioned different brass types and their working . I wonder if annealing for a brass knurl improves it?

What I see in this rear knob of the block plane is a strange brick pattern. It looks good. Its a bit hard to see and maybe its a trick of the camera ,or maybe its the tool pressure or alignment. That is what I was asking about though. With my trials so far some strange patterns have shown up . Its all good fun though.

Enlarged a little. It looks a bit like my drawing on the right. Which is why I wondered if it was the same tool.
How does a diamond knurl tool do that when there are two wheels with opposing angled lines . None of them vertical?

2aa1d941ec869fdfc829abb66fe95487 a.jpg Untitledaza.png

Ian is right. The adjuster screw was the first knurl I did after one trial. All screws are done with the same tool and should have the same pattern. I only realised with the other screws step by step how the pattern should have looked like. As Ian said I only needed to keep going until the patterns line up and fall into place.

With the adjuster screw I thought that is what it is. I bought a scissors type knurling tool. That presses from two sides so I could reduce the side forces on my tiny tiny lathe. But I did not know what the resulting knurl should look like.

But I thought the knurl on the adjuster still looks OK and does the job. So I kept it. I did not want to waste material nor do I know how I could put it back in the lathe to go over it again.

I am hoping my niece will not scrutinise it as much as you lot [emoji6]

Sent from my SM-G781B using Tapatalk

Rob, as CK says, it was simply because he stopped too soon, the "bricks" are simply due to the two intersecting lines from the two wheels - they look like rhomboids to me, which is what I'd expect from shallow cuts.

It's ok, CK, I'm not rubbishing your work, I made quite a few knurls like yours when I started out. AS you say, it does the job (much better than a smooth surface! ) and there are many styles of knurl, so who's to say yours is 'wrong'?

BTW, it is possible to re-mount the thumbscrew on a mandrel after you've parted it off & re-do the knurling, I have done just that to fix a couple of my early attempts (which were even lighter than yours). But you have to be creative how you support the free end - typical tailstock centres will get in the way of the tool on a short mandrel so you need to make it long enough to get the tool on the work piece, which means a lot of flexing with my knurler (it's the Y-shaped type). The type you have should be much better because the pressure of each wheel is opposing)...

Cheers,

Originally Posted by IanW

It's ok, CK, I'm not rubbishing your work, I made quite a few knurls like yours when I started out. AS you say, it does the job (much better than a smooth surface! ) and there are many styles of knurl, so who's to say yours is 'wrong'?

Don't worry, I am not taking it that way. I like the feedback and different views and discussion. In the end, it is all a matter of taste.

Originally Posted by IanW

BTW, it is possible to re-mount the thumbscrew on a mandrel after you've parted it off & re-do the knurling, I have done just that to fix a couple of my early attempts (which were even lighter than yours). But you have to be creative how you support the free end - typical tailstock centres will get in the way of the tool on a short mandrel so you need to make it long enough to get the tool on the work piece, which means a lot of flexing with my knurler (it's the Y-shaped type). The type you have should be much better because the pressure of each wheel is opposing)...

Cheers,

I might give that a go. Got to do a few things first.

Sent from my SM-G781B using Tapatalk