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Thread: Brace Fanatics

  1. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by pmcgee View Post
    Pictures, dammit.
    Okay, okay (I claim no prowess with a camera).

    Skinner braces seem to be nothing special - just regular workman’s quality, common-or-garden braces. If they have a weakness it’s the three pot-metal parts (the two collars and the ratchet selector). Here are my Skinner braces:

    3HL.jpg

    Three x 8” swing, and 3 x 10” swing. My memory served me poorly yesterday – it’s the 10” braces that are the basket cases. The middle one is okay; the selector on the bottom one is VERY hard to use – though once a direction is selected the ratchets work fine – and the head is seized. The ratchet on the top one has gone missing (the only non-ratchet brace I’ve picked up). These all have octagonal tapering chuck shells, I have one other with parallel octagonal shell.

    Of the 8” Skinners, the top one was in occasional use until recently when the pot-metal collar holding the side handle final shattered (it had always been loose).

    7HL.jpg

    The other two should come up fine.

    Then there are my two 12” braces.

    10HL.jpg

    The top is a JA Chapman. The bottom is a box ratchet Millers Falls – sans jaws .

    13HL.jpg

    Three more box ratchet braces. my new 10" Tough Major (according to boringgeoff) with aluminium head and handle - acquired just yesterday. Middle: a French Val d'or 10" (or is that 254mm in French ). And bottom: a PEXTO No.7010 (10").

    Cheers, Vann.
    Gatherer of rusty planes tools...
    Proud member of the Wadkin Blockhead Club .

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  3. #32
    Boringgeoff is offline Try not to be late, but never be early.
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    Opened up the Samson chuck yesterday it's got 30 x 1/8 balls.
    Vann I agree with your comments re Skinner, why they used the awful pot metal, die cast ratchet selector is beyond me. Regarding your Tough Major, (yes folks, proudly made in Belmont WA circa 1946-1966) check your handles I think you'll find they're made of steel not ally. Tough also made another series of braces, the Minor, which had Bakelite head and handle.
    10inch braces are about the most versatile size which makes them the most commonly found. As far as the 6in and smaller sizes go these dinky little braces seem to be popular with a certain type of collector and sell for more than the same brand in 10in.
    Scott you should be able to find one at any weekend market for around $20 -$30. You probably can't go past a good condition 10inch Aussie or British Stanley, and Chapman of Sheffield is also good value. Just check that all the moving parts do what they're supposed to without excessive slop. As far as auger bits are concerned if you buy a canvas or leather roll of a full set you'll pay dearly for it, much better to buy them loose and just build up a set gradually.
    There is plenty of info available on this forum about bit types and sharpening methods.
    If you catch a southbound train next week it will get you to Sydney Town just in time for the TTTG tool sale at Thornleigh on Sunday 23rd.

  4. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by Boringgeoff View Post
    Opened up the Samson chuck yesterday it's got 30 x 1/8 balls.
    Scott you should be able to find one at any weekend market for around $20 -$30. You probably can't go past a good condition 10inch Aussie or British Stanley, and Chapman of Sheffield is also good value. Just check that all the moving parts do what they're supposed to without excessive slop. As far as auger bits are concerned if you buy a canvas or leather roll of a full set you'll pay dearly for it, much better to buy them loose and just build up a set gradually.
    There is plenty of info available on this forum about bit types and sharpening methods.
    If you catch a southbound train next week it will get you to Sydney Town just in time for the TTTG tool sale at Thornleigh on Sunday 23rd.
    Don't know that i'll be catching a train to Sydney (particularly as I work for our National Carrier & can fly cheaper than a train !!) for the TTTG tool sale but I will try & get myself to some markets here in Brisbane. I'm not far from Chandler markets or even the Cleveland markets (i think Chook frequents the latter and iirc picked up a number of goodies).

    I'll let you know how I get on. I will most definately do some back reading of the forum with respect to bit sharpening as you suggest once I get a brace & some bits to sharpen.

    Thanks Geoff.

  5. #34
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    Watching the latest Woodwright's Shop episode ( http://video.pbs.org/video/2365021538/ ) and 14mins in he pulls out a brace with a 20in throw! Makes a standard 10 in brace look like a toy.
    Attached Images Attached Images

  6. #35
    Boringgeoff is offline Try not to be late, but never be early.
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    That's a serious brace! Pity St Roy doesn't give some technical details re make and model for the pedants in the audience.
    Hiroller, thanks for posting.

  7. #36
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  8. #37
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    I have a Chapman brace as in post #4 of this thread. It came in a box of other tools all generally dated around c1900 or older - and came from an old cabinet maker. While that in itself doesn't make the brace old , my Chapman brace has a registered design number on it and like the brace in post #4 is unlike any other chapman brace I have seen. The reg. Design number needs more research but the little I did seemed to find reference to a much earlier time frame than the c1930s we mostly associate with their tools. I didn't find specie details on the actual design so open to help on where I could look it up - or maybe Geoff may have some insight.

    Will post some pics- have to go dig out the brace.

  9. #38
    Boringgeoff is offline Try not to be late, but never be early.
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    That Chapman of Pauls is now in my stable, I whined and snivelled until he sold it to me. I believe that the ratchet is the one patented by Albert Goodall in the USA on Dec 27 1892 (488691).
    The two lower in the photo are the Goodall with the bottom one being the original while the one in the centre is a 1905 modification.
    Thanks to Randy Roeder at oldtoolheaven.com for his excellent resource on Millers Falls and associated companies.
    Chapmans registered design number 239718 dates from 1894 I think, is that the same number on your brace Steve?
    Cheers,
    Geoff.
    Attached Images Attached Images
    Last edited by Boringgeoff; 17th October 2015 at 11:57 AM. Reason: more info.

  10. #39
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    hi Geoff,

    Yep thats the design number (239718). basically similar to the top most brace as you have pictured. does yours have the reg design number? I can see on yours that the screw at the back of the chuck protrudes slightly - mine is flush, and the little curved lever has a small larger diameter boss at its base - otherwise yours is very similar to mine.

    so any idea on actual production date? seems much earlier than most other Chapman tools.

  11. #40
    Boringgeoff is offline Try not to be late, but never be early.
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    I've got a number of braces various brands, including Marples, Mathieson, Rob't Sorby, Geo Musgrave and Lewis & Co, seen a Preston, with that registered design number on them. As far as I can determine they were made by Chapmans for them rather than under license by them.
    I would have thought that a manufacturer as important to the British tool manufacturing scene in the late 19th /early 20th century as James A Chapman would be well documented but it's like drawing teeth.
    For instance a lot of the braces have no info except STEEL 10 IN (or whatever sweep may be) on the frame, a characteristic found on a lot of Chapmans, Skinners and unbranded examples. Was this a British Government requirement or is it evidence that Chapmans put that on them voluntarily and therefore the link can be made that all braces displaying the mark STEEL 10 IN were made by Chapmans?
    In fact I'm almost prepared to go out on a limb and suggest that Skinners were a part of the Chapman empire. What supporting evidence do I have for that bold statement? None whatsoever.
    Some Chapmans are unnumbered, some have the trademark entwined initials JAC,
    I was sent a copy of a Chapman catalogue owned by the Hawley Trust a couple of years ago and the correspondent said he didn't know what year it was from, but when I down loaded it it was dated 1931. That has braces listed with the Registered Design Number 239718 on them as their A Grade and has been a very useful publication. It doesn't list the brace with the small lever ratchet selector, so I can only assume that it was out of production by then. If the Reg No is from 1894 why were they still referring to it 37 years later, or is the date on the download info an error? My correspondent at the time also said "if it looks like a Chapman it probably is"
    if this was an American manufacturer of equal importance we'd be drowning in information.
    Geoff.

  12. #41
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    Hello Brace-o-holics!
    Looking through your posts I can see the combined knowledge and maybe you can help me. A while back at work I was speaking to a guy who laid floors in the railways in the old days. Reckons they had a brace that you stood with, and cranked leaning over it. Apparently it was all metal (no wooden handles) and had some fixtures down low to attach weights, which he said were signal weights or something! This added downward force. They drilled holes for screws with an integral countersink, and then drove the screws. I have searched but can't find any reference to such a beast! It all sounds feasible though...
    Any leads welcome.

    Cheers,
    Andy Mac
    Change is inevitable, growth is optional.

  13. #42
    Boringgeoff is offline Try not to be late, but never be early.
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    Hi Andy,
    Bits with attached or integral countersinker are relatively common and I've never seen as many blacksmith made all metal braces as I did in Queensland, so put the two together and perhaps you've got what your mate was talking about.
    The ones I've got were made to turn eye augers and are either single crank or double crank "wimble" braces.
    Here in the West those big Wimbles were called jiggers and were quite common on the railways, but more for boring dog-spike holes in sleepers also for use in bridge building and the like.
    I've attached a couple of photos, one of some wimbles on my wall and three countersinking bits. One is a gimlet or nail bit with integral countersink and the other two are adjustable countersinks.
    Geoff.
    Attached Images Attached Images

  14. #43
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    Bridge City Toolworks for you, Geoff.

    bctw brace.jpg

  15. #44
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    This (non-ratching) 12" throw Millers Falls is my favourite ..



    At the other extreme, my smallest has a 5" throw ...



    I did manage to get one of my own on the cover of AWR ...





    Lots of bits ..







    10" and 8" Bell System ...





    Regards from Perth

    Derek
    Visit www.inthewoodshop.com for tutorials on constructing handtools, handtool reviews, and my trials and tribulations with furniture builds.

  16. #45
    Boringgeoff is offline Try not to be late, but never be early.
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    Paul, what can I say? The gulf between your Bridge City Toolworks brace and Derek's favourite brace (DFB) is astronomical. I love the DFB which is a tool of beauty and functionality.

    If you go to www.sydnassloot.com click on Brace collection scroll down to historical overview and click on that it will bring up a Taxonomic chart of chuck types authored by Jim Price. This chart shows that the DFB fits into type 2 which is called by Mr Price a "shoulder lock chuck" and also falls into the category of my favourite style of chuck.
    "Why?" I hear you gasp. The answer is simple, the number 2 chuck is designed solely to hold bits with the square tapered drive tang. They are unable to grasp and rotate round, hex' or Morse taper.
    Since my collecting includes any tool with the square tapered tang to the exclusion of any other shape tang, you will understand why type 2 gets a Guernsey and why braces of the later number 4 type chuck (starting from William Barber in 1864) fall into my "jack of all trades master of none" category.
    There is a seventh chuck style which Mr price has omitted and that is the square friction fit that doesn't have any sort of locking or retaining device.

    Please don't let my opinion of your glitzy blingy monstrosity dishearten you Paul, I value your friendship and your (usually) valuable contributions to this forum are appreciated.

    Derek, your favourite brace is one I'm still looking for, I've got a later model and also an extension with the Rose chuck but yours is the classic example.

    Cheers,
    Geoff.

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