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  1. #16
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    Default Brand New Saw Handle

    I really enjoyed this post and the end result
    is stunning . It will look great on the Docking saw.

    Martin.

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  3. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bushmiller View Post
    ....
    The wheat "carving" probably took less than an hour including marking out, cutting with the carving "vee" gouge and "milling" the leaves.......

    ....The technique I use is to bring the handle to the cutter from behind. I rest my elbows on the drill press table and that steadys up the operation.......
    I should try it sometime, just for curiosity's sake. Trouble is, I've never been fond of the pattern; for some reason I can't explain I took a dislike to it the first time I saw a "wheat-carved" handle. Doesn't stop me from admiring your effort, and I still think it'd take me at least a day (to do one side!)....

    Quote Originally Posted by Bushmiller View Post
    ......On the subject of lamb's tongues I have found that it is best to concentrate on the curved part of the cheek and then the LT just becomes whatever it is. The first time I attempted this style I concentrated on the tongue and it just did not look right......
    Yep, agree. Cut the curve first to blend the "return" piece into the cheek, then shape the protruding "tongue part using the groove as your guide. With softer woods like Beech or Myrtle, it only takes two whacks of a gouge to cut a good "vee", but I usually do two cuts down each side, one to establish the groove, then a light cut to give a clean surface to each side. However, for She-oak, make that "many cuts each side"!

    I don't worry too much about wearing out my Liogiers, they are there to do the job & they make it far easier & more pleasant. I've probably shaped a few more handles than you & yes, they aren't quite as keen as they were when new, but they still cut very well and I reckon there are more handles left in them than I've got time or inclination for..

    WRT cutting the blade slot - the one good thing about having too many saws is that with the variations in plate thickness & set I can usually find one that will make very close to the right width of kerf for the plate I'm going to install. To get the kerf to the exact width, & to cut out the curved bit at the back, I have made several "knife" saws from scraps of each of the plate thicknesses I've used to date. The saws have no set & cut on the "pull" stroke & as long as they are really sharp they will cut their way nicely down a tight kerf if allowed to cut freely & not forced: Knife saw 1.jpg

    Quote Originally Posted by Bushmiller View Post
    ....Lastly, apologies for the long grass outside the front of my shed. Leanne took a fall about a month ago and sustained multiple fractures of the patella (sounds a bit like a Spanish dish): She does all our mowing!....
    Cor, some blokes have all the luck! The least you could do would be to get the poor girl a ride-on.....

    Cheers,
    IW

  4. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by IanW View Post
    I should try it sometime, just for curiosity's sake. Trouble is, I've never been fond of the pattern; for some reason I can't explain I took a dislike to it the first time I saw a "wheat-carved" handle. Doesn't stop me from admiring your effort, and I still think it'd take me at least a day (to do one side!)....


    Cor, some blokes have all the luck! The least you could do would be to get the poor girl a ride-on.....

    Cheers,
    Ian

    For some reason, I have never worked out, there is only ever wheat carving ( or floral embossing in the case of E.C. Atkins for a few years) on one side of the handle. perhaps it is because left handers did not exist in those days.

    Of course there is always an exception to prove the rule and that is the revered Panther Head saw made by Woodrough & McParlin. It had an identical carving, complete with the panther head, on both sides, but not wheat: At least usually not wheat.

    panther head saw left.jpgpanther head saw right.jpg

    Regards
    Paul
    Bushmiller;

    "Power tends to corrupt. Absolute power corrupts, absolutely!"

  5. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by IanW View Post


    Cor, some blokes have all the luck! The least you could do would be to get the poor girl a ride-on.....

    Cheers,
    She has a zero turn mower.



    Regards
    Paul
    Bushmiller;

    "Power tends to corrupt. Absolute power corrupts, absolutely!"

  6. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bushmiller View Post
    She has a zero turn mower. ....
    Yeah, but someone has to push it around, don't they - the type I'm recommending, like mine, is all hand-operated, so there'd be no excuse....

    Actually, you have my sympathy, my better half has had some pretty brutal surgery on feet & then her left leg earlier in the year & hasn't been able to drive since February. So apart from other extra duties I've been her chauffeur for 8 months. I don't mind helping out, but it does eat into shed time!

    Cheers,
    Ian
    IW

  7. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by IanW View Post

    Actually, you have my sympathy, my better half has had some pretty brutal surgery on feet & then her left leg earlier in the year & hasn't been able to drive since February. So apart from other extra duties I've been her chauffeur for 8 months. I don't mind helping out, but it does eat into shed time!

    Cheers,
    Ian
    Ian

    Sorry to hear that. Both you and the better half have my sympathies. I was the full time carer for about a fortnight and although those duties are now much less, I am still the chauffeur (I have a trip to the big {inland}city this afternoon in this capacity). Shed time was virtually a forgotten pastime for a while, but the status quo is gradually returning.

    Say hi to the better half for me and I hope she continues to improve.

    Regards
    Paul
    Bushmiller;

    "Power tends to corrupt. Absolute power corrupts, absolutely!"

  8. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bushmiller View Post
    Ian

    For some reason, I have never worked out, there is only ever wheat carving ( or floral embossing in the case of E.C. Atkins for a few years) on one side of the handle. perhaps it is because left handers did not exist in those days.

    Of course there is always an exception to prove the rule and that is the revered Panther Head saw made by Woodrough & McParlin. It had an identical carving, complete with the panther head, on both sides, but not wheat: At least usually not wheat.

    panther head saw left.jpgpanther head saw right.jpg

    Regards
    Paul
    I maybe going against the grain hear,but I personally find the Panther saws yuk, i know what there worth,but yep still yuk.
    Just my not needed, over opinionated opinion.

    Cheers Matt.

  9. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Simplicity View Post
    I maybe going against the grain hear,but I personally find the Panther saws yuk, i know what there worth,but yep still yuk.
    Just my not needed, over opinionated opinion....
    Everyone's entitled to their opinion, Matt. I find the 'panther' saws interesting, but not something I'd like to own either, unless I stumbled on one for a song. The ownership would be very brief, just long enough to contact Paul & offer it to him - at mate's rates, of course!

    Cheers,
    IW

  10. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by IanW View Post
    Everyone's entitled to their opinion, Matt. I find the 'panther' saws interesting, but not something I'd like to own either, unless I stumbled on one for a song. The ownership would be very brief, just long enough to contact Paul & offer it to him - at mate's rates, of course!

    Cheers,
    Has Paul actually got anytime for frivolous Saw collecting now Ian, I thought his head Ground keeper was laid up,an Paul was back too doing medial tasks at the Easte.[emoji6]

    Cheers Matt

  11. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Simplicity View Post
    Has Paul actually got anytime for frivolous Saw collecting now Ian, I thought his head Ground keeper was laid up,an Paul was back too doing medial tasks at the Easte.[emoji6]

    Cheers Matt
    Matt

    I don't know how you can mention saw collecting and frivolous in the same sentence. The head Ground Keeper is recovering well, but not in leaps and bounds. Menial tasks have always been part and parcel of the association.

    But on to more important matters: Saws or to be more precise one saw handle .

    This is after the second coat of varnish with an almost completely matt finish. Until about a week ago I thought Wattyl's Scandinavian Teak Oil was no longer available as I couldn't find it in the shops and it has disappeared from the Wattyl website so I had resigned myself to using Danish Oil as a substitute. In fact I strongly suspect there is stuff all difference between them. However I was at a large trade version Mitre 10 and here is a tin sitting staring right at me. It has got a bit exxy at >$50 for 1L. I am not sure how that compares in price to Danish Oil as I already have about three tins of that.


    P1080028 (Medium).JPG

    The next step is to rub the oil in using steel wool. Actually, a coarse scourer similar to the kitchen type is just as good for this purpose and may be better. I wasn't too fussed with the steel wool I was using and if I was doing it again I would use a scourer. Anyhow, after rubbing in the oil, which is primarily to smooth the surface (it should come up silky smooth) and act as the lubricant, I wipe the surface dry and wipe on furniture wax. I have used several types but am most happy with the Ubeaut Traditional wax. A blatant plug there which I hope I can keep as a get out of gaol card for any future transgression. I buff the wax with a cheap auto polisher

    P1070875 (Medium).JPGP1070874 (Medium).JPG

    It comes up looking like this: Well, in the dark it does.

    P1080031 (Medium).JPGP1080033 (Medium).JPG

    I polished up the medallion and saw screws

    P1080034 (Medium).JPG

    The medallion is from 1923 - 1926, which is the last period Simonds made handsaws. They had changed the company name to Simonds saw and Steel in late 1922. The medallion reflects this change.

    P1080043 (Medium).JPG

    However, the saw for which this handle is destined, is from a later period as Simonds did not include their Docking Saw in the classification of "handsaws." It is quite unclear as to the date of the saw as the only catalogue I have seen with this handle is 1938. At some point I think an aluminium handle of the same pattern was substituted for the cast steel affair. This may make the saw in question pre WW2, but that is only a guess. There is a rather strange bit of sculpting going on at the toe, which will have no effect on sawing

    Simonds Docking saw circa 1938.jpg

    The etch is all there including "Docking Saw," which is often missing, and the owner and I believe it will clean up very well.

    Simonds Docking saw circa 1938 etch.jpg

    Of course the argument remains as to whether this saw should be left original. Debateable! This is going to be a user and will need to be cleaned up. The metal handle is fixed with two steel rivets so they are not easily replaced once removed from the saw as they have to be drilled out or ground off. Once that has happened, to achieve complete cleaning of the plate, really we can do what we want. It is only on the outside edge of a collectable saw, but a very good saw for fast cutting in the workshop with it's 4½ppi teeth. It is not called a Docking Saw for nothing.

    Regards
    Paul
    Bushmiller;

    "Power tends to corrupt. Absolute power corrupts, absolutely!"

  12. #26
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    Paul,
    You certainly have got a handle on making saw handles,that one has come up trumps.
    Well done.

    Cheers Matt.

  13. #27
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    Nicely done!
    As to the criminology of tearing off the original handle of a saw you describe as marginally collectible, but an excellent user - pffft! - function & comfort come before all else on a tool I'm going to use a lot. I'd much prefer to be hanging onto your creation than cold, hard steel on a July morning! I guess it didn't worry folks in its home country, docking firewood was largely a winter occupation & the 'dockers' would've been wearing gloves, so it didn't matter much what the handle was made of as long as it was rugged.

    I think there are one or two marginally-collectible tools in my shed with non-original handles.....
    Cheers,
    IW

  14. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by IanW View Post
    Nicely done!
    As to the criminology of tearing off the original handle of a saw you describe as marginally collectible, but an excellent user - pffft! - function & comfort come before all else on a tool I'm going to use a lot. I'd much prefer to be hanging onto your creation than cold, hard steel on a July morning! I guess it didn't worry folks in its home country, docking firewood was largely a winter occupation & the 'dockers' would've been wearing gloves, so it didn't matter much what the handle was made of as long as it was rugged.

    I think there are one or two marginally-collectible tools in my shed with non-original handles.....
    Cheers,
    Ian

    That is pretty much my take on the "bastardisation" aspect. With these Docking saws there are numerous references by the various manufacturers to a large hand hole so that a gloved hand could easily hold the saw. The manufacturer's blurb describes their typical uses being for bridge builders and around lumber mills. Both are outdoor activities with winter temperatures in many parts of the States being fairly bitter so gloves were order of the day. The metal handle was because that made them close to bullet proof, which may have been a requirement in some areas . Simonds did offer the same saw with a timber handle (actually they gave it a separate model number, the No.347, while the metal handled version was a No.348) , but there were no pix in the catalogues of this variant. I suspect, but don't know, that it was similar to the one-man logging saws, hornless and devoid of any appeal other than something to hang on to. Perhaps we have just inadvertently returned to your functionality and comfort over form comment.

    Their wood handle was probably like this:

    Simonds One man crosscut 1912.jpg

    Again there is always an exception to prove the rule. This one has horns on it:

    Simonds One man crosscut 1912 with horns.jpg

    But still not very flash to my mind. These saws were from the 1912 catalogue, but by 1916 they had eleven model: Ten models were hornless (polled?) and one with horns (cuckolded?)

    This was Simonds No.348 from 1938:

    Simonds 1938 Docking saw.jpg


    Anyhow, I understand that this saw is going to be displayed on the wall so it is in easy reach when required as it is a definite user.

    Regards
    Paul
    Last edited by Bushmiller; 21st November 2021 at 10:29 AM. Reason: spelling
    Bushmiller;

    "Power tends to corrupt. Absolute power corrupts, absolutely!"

  15. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bushmiller View Post
    I cut out the rough shape with the bandsaw for the external cuts and a jigsaw (my ancient Lesto in this instance) for the internal hand hole.
    Good to see that the Lesto is paying for itself. I found another wood cutting blade which should fit if you want it.
    20211211_173848.jpg

  16. #30
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    Thanks for documenting the process, Paul.
    Beautiful handle. I've bookmarked the page for (not anywhere near) future reference.

    Cheers,
    Andy

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