Thread: Disappointed - another UK icon gone to pot?

Are you sure it says "J&H Sorby" and not "I & H Sorby"?

Most new tools are rough, takes time to polish, and time is money.

About the steel, Robert Sorby says this...

All Robert Sorby tools are hardness tested. That way we ensure that no soft or brittle tools leave the factory. Of course the hardness differs at various points along the tool. For example, it would be wrong to have the area around the tang at the same hardness as the tip. Its role is completely different. If it were too brittle it would snap under pressure.

Toby

Hi Velo - I suppose I've gotten used to surface-grinder marks on the backs of most new edge tools, & just accept that I'll ned to spend some time getting them up to scratch. Very, very few, if any, come lapped to a standard that would suit even a mildly fussy user. As Toby says, time is money, and tight profit margins mean mimimising every step to what will pass (just!). At least the steel has been good in the few new Sorby tools I've bought in the last 10 years or so. It would be nice if they came lapped & polished & ready to go, but the extra cost might make us wince more than the thought of a half hour of prepping.

I've had a moan or two about a couple of chisels that came highly polished, but that caused me MUCH more work than getting rid of grinder marks! These were polished by sticking the blades in a tumbler with abrasive dust, which polishes 'em like mirrors, and gives you well-rounded corners all the way along the back. Very kind to hands, but makes it pretty useless as a cutting tool. It seems to me to be the dumbest thing you could possibly do to a new chisel! It took ages to lap the first inch or so of the backs sufficiently to get square corners again, and they were quite narrow sizes - I'm glad they weren't wide ones, or I think I would have given up. They still do this to their chisels, though they must have gotten enough complaints that they now offer a line that are unpolished - you probably know the brand I'm talking about....

Cheers,

I just bought a bunch of Pfeil bench chisels and gouges and I have to say I am very impressed with the fit, finish and steel. The 26mm was the first I grabbed out of the roll to lap. I hoped for a flat back but wasn't really expecting one. Flat as! It only took a swipe or two to polish up and has held it's edge beautifully.

They're a family company too.

I have a wee little old Sorby 3mm?that I don't use. You're welcome to it if you like Veloaficianado.

Cheers

Velo, sorry to hear of your troubles, the old chisels are often nicer to use, perhaps its just the good ones that survived , i know i have sent some chisels i didnt care for much to the after life, not before i tortured them a bit, they deserved it!
have you happened to put a straight edge on the back yet? grind marks dont bother me much but the RS can be fractionally bent sometimes which is a pita, still fixable with lapping (lots) but a bit more of a pita to do that extra work. still i reckon on a whole they arnt bad chisels for not being a botuique brand and not carry their price tag! the handles seem to match up (balance) ok on them, some types can benefit from a sanding off the edges or tweaking but maybe i am just easy to to get along with (doubt that! haha)

should be good steel still for a new commercial chisel (perhaps any chisel-why do they never tell you exactly what they use. O1 or any of the other oiled cooled through to o6, which?), i have some of theirs and they seem ok, i sharpen regularly so i am not sure if some others last a bit longer, one day i'll have to take more notice or do one of those comparison tests lol, but sharpening only takes a few seconds so its not a huge factor to me, keenness of edge is more important than how long it lasts imo.
they make a huge range of chisels if you include their turning chisels so i am not sure if they are all made the same way but i thought they were pressed forged as they still do in england and some others in europe, which i assume is better in some small way than CNC O1 chisels, say from china etc, at least i assume its better because i am sure i heard that Mr LN would like to have his O1 chisels forged but in the US (which is where he likes to keep his production) he hasnt yet managed to find anywhere that forges yet.

perhaps (only a wild speculative guess on my part) because they were having some chisels bend in the grinding stage they needed to grind coarser (which i am assuming would make it cooler to grind) to reduce heat so the chisels remained straight, particularly being a thin paring chisel. i could be way off base but it crossed my mind, if that was the case then even though its a pain for you to do it might be a good trade off that you do the fine lapping in order to get a good quality O1 steel chisel


cheers
chippy

Originally Posted by Berlin

I just bought a bunch of Pfeil bench chisels and gouges and I have to say I am very impressed with the fit, finish and steel. The 26mm was the first I grabbed out of the roll to lap. I hoped for a flat back but wasn't really expecting one. Flat as! It only took a swipe or two to polish up and has held it's edge beautifully.

They're a family company too.

I have a wee little old Sorby 3mm?that I don't use. You're welcome to it if you like Veloaficianado.

Cheers

Pfeil, i had forgot that brand...ya know we are so lucky there are still so many brands of chisels available, when i consider just how many there are its mind boggling! we are spoilt for choice (even though we still want more , me too)

i cant help thinking, if all the chisels made, and all the chisels purchased second hand were being used (i picture everyone crouched over chopping away) then no matter where we went in the whole world we would be up to our knees in wood chips what a mess

Originally Posted by ch!ppy

i cant help thinking, if all the chisels made, and all the chisels purchased second hand were being used (i picture everyone crouched over chopping away) then no matter where we went in the whole world we would be up to our knees in wood chips what a mess

Yeah, i wonder that too Chippy. Mind you, Pop's Bergs, Sorbies, Titans and Charles Taylors are pretty short now. Do I have to turn them into buttons before I'm alowed to call them scrap?

PS ... Charles Taylor, Scheffield, any one heard of that brand? I think he went on to have a shoe making business

*Sheffield... too long on the continent

Originally Posted by Berlin

.. Mind you, Pop's Bergs, Sorbies, Titans and Charles Taylors are pretty short now. Do I have to turn them into buttons before I'm alowed to call them scrap?

put em on ebay and advertise them as Jennifer Lopez, Extra Butt chisels

Originally Posted by Berlin

Yeah, i wonder that too Chippy. Mind you, Pop's Bergs, Sorbies, Titans and Charles Taylors are pretty short now. Do I have to turn them into buttons before I'm alowed to call them scrap?

PS ... Charles Taylor, Scheffield, any one heard of that brand? I think he went on to have a shoe making business

Doesn't the steel get softer towards the tang? Tempered only about half or third the way up from the tip? Easy enough to fix I guess.

Toby

Originally Posted by TobyC

Doesn't the steel get softer towards the tang? Tempered only about half or third the way up from the tip? Easy enough to fix I guess.

Toby

Marples would advertise that they were, "Good to the last inch", and I've seen a few approaching that which were still in useable condition.
Cheers,
Jim

PS ... Charles Taylor, Scheffield, any one heard of that brand? I think he went on to have a shoe making business

Like these?

Did you see this?

Toby

Send it back and tell them you are not happy, if people keep buying low quality items they will keep selling them, just look at what has happened to Stanley.

Originally Posted by TobyC

Like these?

Did you see this?

Toby

Cool. Not heaps of info so I guess it was one of those myriad Sheffield brands... Like Turner planes perhaps

Originally Posted by Berlin

Cool. Not heaps of info so I guess it was one of those myriad Sheffield brands... Like Turner planes perhaps

I couldn't find much of anything, not even listed here.

Toby