Thread: E.C.E. Hand plane Repair

Looking good Paul; can this mean you are starting to lean towards restoring and collecting real tools instead of those odd-shaped bits of steel plate?

I stumbled across THIS video of Laura Kampf visiting the EC Emmerich factory; apparently no-one had ever filmed inside it before! The very first “Aha!” moment for me was seeing how they joined the soles to the bodies; I had always wondered how they got that impossible looking join. Anyway; I think it!s worth a watch.

Nice one. Well done. I like it.

Definately German made. Here is some info for dating German planes Kleines Werkzeugmuseum (Identifizierung und Datierung)

You might need Google translate...

With the side indents it puts it to earliest 1930s. I tried to find out when ECE started to use Chrom Vanadium Steel for their blades, but couldn't find anything in that regard.

ECE also started early to use Pockholz (= lignum vitae) for their weir resistent soles. Or Steineiche (=holly oak = quercus ilex)



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Originally Posted by Chief Tiff

Looking good Paul; can this mean you are starting to lean towards restoring and collecting real tools instead of those odd-shaped bits of steel plate?

I stumbled across THIS video of Laura Kampf visiting the EC Emmerich factory; apparently no-one had ever filmed inside it before! The very first “Aha!” moment for me was seeing how they joined the soles to the bodies; I had always wondered how they got that impossible looking join. Anyway; I think it!s worth a watch.

Chief

That workshop is a treat. Thanks for linking it. I too had not quite appreciated how the sole was fixed to the main body of the plane and that was really why I documented the repair. I should not have been surprised as I had seen another plane made in a similar fashion. That person being Karl Holtey and his T21:

Karl Holtey plane.jpg

In fact, here it is the case of the impossible dovetail, which cannot be the whole way round the sole! You can see how it was done :

"Holtey Classic Handplanes - T21 Panel plane." (holteyplanes.com)

For the moment I am sticking with the bits of scrap metal with a token piece of tree tacked onto one end, although I do have a plane project for a later time, if I live that long. It may never get off the ground so don't hold the proverbial breath.

The tools of Herr Emmerich definitely have sole.

Regards
Paul

Originally Posted by Cklett

Nice one. Well done. I like it.

Definately German made. Here is some info for dating German planes Kleines Werkzeugmuseum (Identifizierung und Datierung)

You might need Google translate...

With the side indents it puts it to earliest 1930s. I tried to find out when ECE started to use Chrom Vanadium Steel for their blades, but couldn't find anything in that regard.

ECE also started early to use Pockholz (= lignum vitae) for their weir resistent soles. Or Steineiche (=holly oak = quercus ilex)



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Thanks CK

The blade is a surprisingly good performer, particularly in the limited way I use it.

Regards
Paul

Something I forgot to mention it that the front grip of the plane is not symmetrical and is clearly intended for a right handed person. If CK dating to 1930 is right that was probably a time when left handed people were not permitted.

Old Plane comparrison.jpg

It was why I put the other plane in to compare. I forgot to say this in the first post. Seeing the video with Laura Kampf where the front grip was made up two at a time reminded me.

Regards
Paul

You're being sucked further & into this plane business, Paul!

I had a scrub plane like that, not an E.C.E., & iirc, the added sole was glued on similarly. An easy joint to make with machinery, but you can do it manually if you are persistent (& silly) enough. I gave the thing away after doing some running repairs, not to the sole, which was still tightly stuck, but it had a crack along one side & the sole was in very rough condition. I'm a bit sorry I didn't keep it now, as the light wooden scrubs make the work a lot easier. Their only problem is that even lignum soles wear pretty quickly on woods like spotted gum. Perhaps the best solution would be a woodie with a steel sole? No, I'm not going to make one, my Veritas does a perfectly good job & the added work-out does me good...

From perusing old catalogues, I had the impression that the majority of those German planes had hornbeam bodies & lignum soles from the 50s on..

I remember making an "impossible dovetail" for my BIL many years ago - he used it to win bets in the pub.
They sure confound logic when you first see one, but the solution to the puzzle is very simple once you know, of course. I'm pretty sure I saw the method for setting them out in an old FWW or maybe it was an old book. Robert Howard did one in an AWR (quite a few years ago, now). I thought his method for setting out was a bit clumsy, but I guess whatever works....
Cheers,

Originally Posted by IanW

You're being sucked further & into this plane business, Paul!

I gave the thing away after doing some running repairs, not to the sole, which was still tightly stuck, but it had a crack along one side & the sole was in very rough condition. I'm a bit sorry I didn't keep it now, as the light wooden scrubs make the work a lot easier.

From perusing old catalogues, I had the impression that the majority of those German planes had hornbeam bodies & lignum soles from the 50s on..

I remember making an "impossible dovetail" for my BIL many years ago - he used it to win bets in the pub.

Ummmm. Ian I am trying to resist the plane thing, but because of the "future" project I referenced I can't really claim to be free of the addiction.

The E.C.E. website I referenced stated that they use Hornbeam for the sole, although I don't know when that commenced. CK looked further into the history and estimated my plane to be around 1930, so maybe well before Hornbeam found favour. The sole as you can see in the pic in the first post is red so definitely not Hornbeam.

The amusing thing, for me, is that when the Great Plane Challenge was launched onto the Forum, my intention was to make two planes ( the philosophy being that at least one of them could not come last). I was going to attempt something similar to Holtey's T21. Needless to say it would have been very much simplified. Fortunately, in a way, I completely underestimated the time involved even for one plane so my second offering wobbled at the concept stage.



Regards
Paul

Never mind Paul, you aren't even retired yet, so there'll be lots of time in the future to produce your T21 clone....

Funnily enough, my very first attempt at making a plane was a short jointer which had birds-eye maple sides & a lignum sole, but the sole was simply face-glued to the body, I had neither discovered the "impossible dovetail" at that stage nor had the skill to carry it off successfully. The blade was wedged, I would also have been incapable of making a lever cap. My plane looked pretty spiffy and I was pleased as punch with myself until I put it to work.

Seeing that plane of Holtey's reminded me of my plane & made me wince at the memory. The thing was a disaster. I did manage to get it working semi-tolerably after much fiddling, but it was such a cumbersome, awkward darned thing, it saw very little use and the arrival of a very nice Record 07 in my toolbox very promptly relegated it to being stored under the house where it remained for more than 20 years until the crappy PVA glue I'd used deteriorated & it eventually de-laminated to the extent I just salvaged what wood was salvageable & tossed the rest away.

So not starting on your T21 as your first foray was probably a good thing. And I know this will be heresy to many, but when viewing a Holtey plane I've never had the urge to pick it up & use it. They are superbly crafted and flawless, but just look cold & not user-friendly. Konrad Sauer's planes, on the other hand, just beg to be picked up & used....

Cheers,

ATTENTION PLEASE ATTENTION PLEASE Paul, is going too be building a New plane as soon as he retires(Days away I think).

Front row seats are still available but going fast, also Ian will be Critiquing on the bases does it feel Cute an cuddly.


Will the “Body” be getting a Boyfriend, bets In please peoples.

Cheers Matt.

Matt

"The Body" looks good: A bit brassy, but I find that appealing. Would a boyfriend be called "Ken?"

Regards
Paul