Thread: Hand planing French / European Oak

Based upon my recent experience with European Oak for a workbench top, I'd say that it is very doable. In the US they consider White Oak to be tough and difficult to plane. It seems to be very similar to European Oak, with the later displaying a tighter grain but similar figure. Here in Oz we have Tassie Oak, which has many similar properties (but is a Eucalypt).

Much of the wood I work is several times harder and the grain is several times more interlocked - Jarrah, Karri, Marri, She-Oak. This may be the reason why I experienced the EO to be relatively easy. However, I was able to plane a lot of it with a block plane - which would have been a disaster with the other woods.

I'd say go for it: #5 with cambered blade (8-10" radius) to flatten, #7 to level, and a #4 to smooth (you may even get away without needing the smoother).

Regards from Perth

Derek

Thanks very much Derek! I really appreciate your help.

Whatever plane you use, I would highly recommend getting a good aftermarket blade for it.

I did a lot of handplaning of american white oak using a standard (modern) stanley blade, and it was an exercise in frustration. Once I swtiched to a thicker aftermarket blade in M2 steel, things got much, much easier.

I deal with a fair amount of white oak here in the states and Derek is right on.

The only thing I'd add is, iron quality aside, be ready to hone often. Oak is rough on edges partly due to the open grain pores holding hardened mineral deposits... Kidna kinda sand paper grit in the pores so it wears the edge quickly.

It planes fairly well across and askew the grain. That would be my first step towards flattening. You might consider a card scraper in leu of a smoother.

Good luck!

If the 'European' oak you have is Quercus robur, I think you'll find it pretty good to work with.

Firemedic, I used a bit of white & red oak when living in Canada, and although Q. robur is technically a "white" oak, the small amount of it I've used was more like your red oak than the north American white oak in its working properties. It wasn't anywhere near as hard & tough on edges as its American cousin. Of course, individual trees can vary widely, but in any case, they are all easier to deal with than some of the edge-destroying species Derek mentions!

Cheers,

Ahh, yeah I should have mentioned that that was more a general thing with oak HERE. Not familiar with the particular species you have so it's likely different.

I am thinking!
Perhaps there is a alternate use for that French Oak?
French Oak is used extensively in the wine industry for making wine barrels.
May be you should direct that French oak to a Cooper and have it made into a personal wine barrel. You could then have it filled with a drop of your local vintage.
In the mean time look around for a couple of wooden crates and or even 2 saw stools with a plank on top on which to stand the TV.
In a couple of years you will then be able to sit back watching TV sipping one or two glasses of liquid from the contents of that barrel.
Mac

Originally Posted by Malcolm Eaton

I am thinking!
Perhaps there is a alternate use for that French Oak?
French Oak is used extensively in the wine industry for making wine barrels.
May be you should direct that French oak to a Cooper and have it made into a personal wine barrel. You could then have it filled with a drop of your local vintage.
In the mean time look around for a couple of wooden crates and or even 2 saw stools with a plank on top on which to stand the TV.
In a couple of years you will then be able to sit back watching TV sipping one or two glasses of liquid from the contents of that barrel.
Mac

Jeez Mac, if he had enough money to pay a guy to build a wine barrel, he'd probably have change for a dozen entertainment units. Those things are expensive!!

YoJimbo, if you have French Oak it is either Quercus Robur or Quercus Petraea... which isn't very important because you'd have to look at the leaves and fruit with to tell them apart. The bit I've used was nice to work but, as I was also in an apartment working with hand planes, I only did a little bit. Hand tools aren't as noisy as power tools, sure, but on a quiet Saturday (let a lone a Tuesday night) the ripping sound of your plane and the clunk-clunk-clunk of your work bench (table/desk) as it walks around your floor/neighbours ceiling, soon start to sound VERY loud.

You don't have a mate with a shed you can borrow for a weekend while you dimension your stock?

Berlin

Thanks for all the feedback guys. Not sure specifically what kind of Quercus it is. Really nice stuff though. I bought 2x 2.3m x 80mm x 240mm or something like that, and had it remilled into 55mm or so crossections, gettting 4 out of each piece. Obviously orientation in the log was pretty different, so I have some classic Oak wild looking grain in 4 of the pieces, and more subdued in the other 4, so it will be great to tailor the exact effect I'm after.

Anyway, I can see exactly what you're talking about with the way the grain will kind of come away in parts of it. I also have some French Oak floorboards that are made from reclaimed beams in a French warehouse or something. They seem much more dense / smooth if I recall, but that could just be the dressing messing with me. Anyway, I'm using them for the panelling, but I'll worry about them later.

Anyway, I'm going vintage with the tools, and breaking out the sharpening stone. The logistics are a real pain. I have a few mates' houses where I could go, but it's just kind of impractical due to the size of the wood vs. my car. I've tried to think through all the options, but this seems the only way - especially given the most time-consuming part of the job will be removing a twist from every single one of those pieces! My electric planer just isn't going to have the nuance to do it without the odd slip-up that I can't afford (especially at the price of Oak!).

Mac... Wine barrels... You've got me thinking actually. Isn't the way we do it in Australia just to throw Oak chips into a vat...? Hmmm. Though the last thing I need is yet another hobby; if I eplained to my wife we'd have wine on tap for years, that may go down well.

Originally Posted by YojimboJones

I've tried to think through all the options, but this seems the only way - especially given the most time-consuming part of the job will be removing a twist from every single one of those pieces! My electric planer just isn't going to have the nuance to do it without the odd slip-up that I can't afford (especially at the price of Oak!).

Re moving timber to mates place ... hire trailer?

Other than that ... re the electric planer ...
<timeout> I just realised you said twist rather than bow or cup, but I'll type it out anyway ... might still apply ... </timeout>
I'm thinking that you could have two identical and appropriately sized pieces of timber and clamp them either side of your oak pieces in such a way that the areas that you want to remove are above the 'guide-rails', and then use the planer at an angle across the rails to take off a controllable amount of material. Even if you then finish off with hand planes it could help rough down.

Cheers,
Paul McGee

Originally Posted by pmcgee

Re moving timber to mates place ... hire trailer?

Other than that ... re the electric planer ...
<timeout> I just realised you said twist rather than bow or cup, but I'll type it out anyway ... might still apply ... </timeout>
I'm thinking that you could have two identical and appropriately sized pieces of timber and clamp them either side of your oak pieces in such a way that the areas that you want to remove are above the 'guide-rails', and then use the planer at an angle across the rails to take off a controllable amount of material. Even if you then finish off with hand planes it could help rough down.

Cheers,
Paul McGee

Re the trailer, I have an Alfa. They're not really made for that sort of thing. More for posing. In any event, I like the idea of going "old school" for this project. We'll see how it goes though - if it takes me a month to do the first piece, I'll be hiring a ute, for sure.

Actually re the twisting, I thought of a similar solution. We have a floating polished wood floor that's REALLY flat, so I will rest the timber on the floor, and sit some gym weights on it to remove any bowing in the oak. Then I will find the corner highest off the floor due to the twist, and use a template to track a line all the way around from that point, parallel to the floor. (say, 10mm up) Then I just have to plane down everything to that line.
...and repeat at least 32 times.

Originally Posted by YojimboJones

Re the trailer, I have an Alfa. They're not really made for that sort of thing. More for posing.

I used to have the exact same problem as you: An Alfa with no towbar. My wife solved it by writing the poor thing off, and now I have something more practical. I could send her over your way for a holiday if you like.

That's ok, I'm trying to convince my wife to trade her Peugeot for a Hilux.

Thanks for the offer though.

I handplane a lot of American White Oak. I start with an old transition Jack plane with a highly radiused iron (like a scrub plane) to remove saw marks and flatten. Next I use a #5 Stanley to remove the scoups and further flatten. Then I use my #4 1/2 Smoother.

The only trick is to hone often. A truely sharp iron is the secret.