Thread: Making a few hand saws

Blake, Rob Streeper makes his own folded backs.

He's a member of this forum site.

Note he's also based in USA Texas.


About rob streeper

Location:San Antonio, Texas, USA

Thank you I sent him a pm asking if he was still in business. His website hasn't shown new items in a while.

My first teeth cut. Before I sharpened and completely disassembled the retoother for a overhaul. You can kinda see it in the picture but it wasn't sharp enough.

I'll cut 2nd plate soon. Had to order new spring clips. But the first should still file up ok. 8° degree rake. 14 ppi.

Hi Matt, & welcome to the intriguing world of backsaw making..

With respect to backs, I have been unable to convince myself that there is any inherent superiority in folded backs vs slotted ones, but it does depend on how you apply them. To get the best effect from any back, they need to fit well. The fit should be firm but not over-tight. I find the best way to achieve this with a slotted back is to cut the slot slightly over size, then squeeze it up a bit in a vice 'til you get he desired firmness. It's a bit of a delicate business squeezing it to get just the right 'tightness' without over-doing it. Mine usually end up a little tighter at the ends than in the middle, but that seems to work well.

A well-fitted back does more than simply add stiffness to the plate, it applies a little tension to the top of the blade, which holds it straight. The spine is added as the last step, after the plate is bolted into the handle: Tap it on about 3/8-1/2 inch forward of where it will eventually be, then tap it back til it seats nicely in the handle, checking that the plate remains nice & straight during the process. This is Rob Streeper's method, which adds a bit of tension to the top of the blade. It made sense when I read it because several articles on restoring old saws I've come across mentioned adjusting the spine by tapping up & down or back & forth to straighten seemingly buckled plates.

To work best, the slot needs to be comfortably deeper than you intend setting the blade. My early saws had too-shallow slots and nt understanding their function fully, I "bottomed" the plate in the spines . I suspect that this might be a reason why folded backs are claimed to be superior, because the "slot" is much deeper than many of the slotted backs I've seen. A deeper slot makes it easier to squeeze a bit of "pinch" into the brass & gives you more room to manoeuvre when adjusting during the fitting process.

To this end, glueing or riveting spines to the plate as some do seems like you are removing one of the critical functions of the spine..

OTH, there is a bloke in England who has gone to the other extreme, and fitted an elaborate tensioning device inside the handle of one of his top-of-the-range saws. The theory is ok, but it seems like gilding the Lilly to me. He certainly makes nice-looking "conventional" saws, worth ogling, but the prices are all a bit above what I could afford to pay for a back saw!

Cheers,

That's a very nice looking saw handle, Matthew! Top-drawer.

Out of interest what finish do you use on it?

Chris

IanW, thank you for the advise. To clarify... you slot your brass and then press it some to get a good pinch or grab? No glue of any kind and you only go on the blade about half way? Basically, you treat it like a folded back?

Chris, thank you! I messed up a few but I'm getting better. Couple coats of clear shellac.

Thanks Matthew

I've often contemplated how Veritas get their saw handles so glossy. But I have noticed if anything I think they're too glossy - at certain angles they actually create glare. Shellac seems to be a good balance - posh but a little understated.

Originally Posted by M Williams

.... To clarify... you slot your brass and then press it some to get a good pinch or grab? No glue of any kind and you only go on the blade about half way? Basically, you treat it like a folded back?....

Yes, yes, and yes.

To expand a bit on that: For a typical 1/4 x 3/4" spine, I cut the slot 1/2-9/16" deep, i.e. leaving somewhere between 1/8 & 5/32 at full thickness, which approximates a folded back, structurally.

With a bit of rounding of the top & tapering of the bottom, you can make a slotted back look enough like a folded one that it takes a second look to spot it: Baby Kenyon 2.jpg

However, I usually make no attempt to disguise it, but take advantage of the straight corners to do some chamfers and little decorative flourishes: Lace S-oak.jpg

When pinching, take it very carefully until you get a feel for how much clamping pressure you need to close your slot up to the desired tightness. Watch the slot, & you should see it close as you squeeze, but be aware it'll spring back on release. The only brass readily available to me in appropriate sizes for spines is 'hard' machinable grade (C3800), which springs back more than softer brasses, so it will depend on what grade of brass you use. Just squeeze/test/squeeze/test until you've got it how you want.

Cheers,

Originally Posted by IanW

OTH, there is a bloke in England who has gone to the other extreme, and fitted an elaborate tensioning device inside the handle of one of his top-of-the-range saws. The theory is ok, but it seems like gilding the Lilly to me. He certainly makes nice-looking "conventional" saws, worth ogling, but the prices are all a bit above what I could afford to pay for a back saw!

Cheers,

Ian

Agreed. Only a nice price if you are the seller.

Regards
Paul

Matthew

A little while ago I undertook a backsaw project and the spine was one of the issues I had. I had tried folding metal myself both in brass and steel and had three absolute disasters. Rob Streeper certainly used to fold backs, but I think his time may be completely taken up with his other enterprise at the moment. His health also took something of a king hit at the beginning of this year when that wretched virus laid him low.

Anyhow, to return to my project, there I was quite spineless (I recall an ex girlfriend one describing me exactly the same way when I think about it, It occured to me she was not entirely happy

IanW came to rescue with his slotted backs for which I was very grateful. I was trying to replicate some old saws from the eighteenth century and they needed to be rounded and if possible look folded. It was easier to do than I had anticipated:

Some details can be seen here

American saws traditionally seemed to prefer polished or blued steel backs, but I really like brass.

Regards
Paul

Matthew,
Nothing really to add, that the others haven’t already added, except I personally think Matthews or Matt’s generally make excellent saws.[emoji6]

Cheers Matt.
I feel another saw coming on!!

If you guys run into anyone else making backs, please let me know. Or I might have to start experimenting. Lol, I'm gonna try at some point I'm sure anyway. But for now let's see if all Matthews can make saws. I have acquired 4 slotted backs and I was lucky enough to catch Erik Florip Toolworks when he made a few unstamped folded backs. He is pretty busy now and isn't really selling backs at the moment. But I was able to get 5 from him and they are in the mail now.

So stay tuned as I make a few saws and hopefully get better as I go.

I currently have a 42x sawset. But recently rewired a bemaco rapid saw set. We will see if I can get it tuned and adjusted just right. I am also getting a 281 foley trip-hammer set soon as well.

- - - Updated - - -

If you guys run into anyone else making backs, please let me know. Or I might have to start experimenting. Lol, I'm gonna try at some point I'm sure anyway. But for now let's see if all Matthews can make saws. I have acquired 4 slotted backs and I was lucky enough to catch Erik Florip Toolworks when he made a few unstamped folded backs. He is pretty busy now and isn't really selling backs at the moment. But I was able to get 5 from him and they are in the mail now.

So stay tuned as I make a few saws and hopefully get better as I go.

I currently have a 42x sawset. But recently rewired a bemaco rapid saw set. We will see if I can get it tuned and adjusted just right. I am also getting a 281 foley trip-hammer set soon as well.

Originally Posted by M Williams

So far I'm learning as I go. Spent a considerable amount of time tuning in a Foley 385 retoother.

Matthew

I had meant to comment that I am very envious of you having this machine. It would be worth it's weight in files and sweat.

Good to hear you have sourced some folded backs. and we will look forward to seeing some pix.

Regards and all the best for the festive season
Paul

I meant to ask before but how are you guys cutting your saw plate?

My current way involves a cutoff wheel and sparks lol.