Thread: Some Handsaw Refurb

There are two other saw jobs I want to do ... one is to transplant the handle from this well-used D8 thumbhole onto this Disston Canada saw that I have ... knowing that there is no automatic guarantee that the one will fit the other easily.

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The other is that I have a friend who wants to take a 50mm slab off of a Huon pine offcut that he brought with him from Tasmania. It won't all go through the bandsaw as is. I considered removing the upper guide - but he has plans for the rest of the wood also and I don't want to risk the cut drifting off either way. Eventually I thought ... I can bandsaw in as far as it will go ... and saw the rest That would force me to rehab the one-man saw that I ... can no longer remember where it came from ...

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I think Chippy mentioned painting lacquer onto saws as a preservative. That is what these two have, I believe. So far I have just sanded them with WD40 ... is there something better to use (that won't kill me) ?

saw rejig 005.jpg saw rejig 006.jpg saw rejig 007.jpg saw rejig 008.jpg

Regarding the rehandling ... the five holes in the blades do not match. Here I matched up holes 2+4 and traced out the overhang of the new blade ...

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I ground off some of the extra ... about 1mm ... but trying the handle out, I found that if the medallion holes are matched up, the curve of the blades match almost exactly. Matching the medallion holes together, the offset to the existing holes varies ...

saw rejig 028.jpg saw rejig 031.jpg saw rejig 021.jpg

Depending on how the handle goes on, it effects the angle of the handle to the blade and the toothline.
In the end, I felt it was best matching hole number 5 ... the next step will be to mark new holes and drill them.

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paul, nice slab of huon pine!

it should work changing over the handles of the D-8's , although it now looks like your having trouble...using lacquer has its upsides and downsides, it works well to keep the rust away but can be unsightly, especially if you use gloss!, its not easy to get rid of but you can and it can sometimes cause a bit of sticking when you saw for the first time until it wears away(probably depends on the type and brand and if you put it on too thick), obviously you dont want to get it on the handle either...its easy and cheap to apply may be best for long term saws that sit around and as i say it works but you may not want to put it on your best saws, then again if it stops them going otherwise rusty <shrugs> but i wouldnt put it on my best saws...i have some saws with wax (paste) over them, it works but it needs to be applied rather thick or it doesnt work that well, petroleum jelly works quite well as does grease of course but they are messy, the wax needs to wiped off before use too or the sawdust tends to mix with the wax and bring the saw to full stop in use, quite a few other things work too and some of those purpose made sprays are no doubt good , i dont see em much here though, hence why i use PJ or grease, oil, etc


cheers
chippy

What do you use for other things like planes.

Me i just spray G15 on them.

Finally ... some success in the One-man rehab.

I first sanded down the lacquer on the blade to get a smooth surface.

I constructed an elaborate end expensive saw vice and had a go at the teeth. I had looked at some literature beforehand on crosscut saws - there are publications from the early 1900s and the US Forestry Dept have good up-to-date publications. I still wasn't 100% sure what to do - the teeth are set left and right in pairs - so I aimed to bevel them a bit like an "M"-tooth.

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The teeth were lacquered and a bit rusted or gunked ... I tried roughing the shape with a large file, then two smaller mill files. It was a bit tough going ... I only tackled one half of pairs 1, 3 and 5 until I decided that the industrial approach might be best.

I have sharpened my bandsaw blade with the angle-grinder, so that's what I did with this. I used a thin cutting wheel and ran along four times for the four different angles that needed cutting.

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I tried it on a log of cypress pine 10" across. I didn't time it, but I think it took me five minutes (maybe less) to the first photo - and another five to finish it. It certainly isn't competition quality, but it's a start.

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It occurs to me now that I was concentrating on the upper faces of the teeth, and haven't touched the upright edges yet.
I think it'll be able to do the job I want to do with it.

Cheers,
Paul

Originally Posted by Pac man

What do you use for other things like planes.
Me i just spray G15 on them.

I've heard good things about G15 - but do not know where you can get it.

I recently got down to Supercheap and picked up a hand-sprayer of Lanotec liquid lanolin for about $17.

My garage is in need of an anti-rust solution, so I'm testing this out.
I've had it on some small saws for a week - looking good at the moment.

Cheers,
Paul

Googled it.
Chris Vespers site list Beyond tools at Malaga as the Perth distributor.

Otherwise contact Australian inhibitor the distributor of G15

Originally Posted by Pac man

What do you use for other things like planes.

Me i just spray G15 on them.

if i had G15 i'd probably use it, i just use what i have at hand, oil and sometimes wrapped in an oily rag, some planes get put in a tool box and the wood has gotten quite oily over the years, in the confined space with the oil seems to keep em free of rust, my nice set of planes i keep covered in rags though

cheers
chippy

Paul, is that log looks a bit dry for an M tooth? there's a few more steps to sharpening those well too

Originally Posted by ch!ppy

Paul, is that log looks a bit dry for an M tooth? there's a few more steps to sharpening those well too

I'm sure there are - I'm kinda flying blind - and stupid

But having tried out a bit of practical ... this might sink in deeper (just searched it up again) ... http://www.fs.fed.us/eng/pubs/pdfpub...12508dpi72.pdf

This is me definitely ...



Actually ...

You watch the video, and then it brings up other possible videos to watch ...

some of them crosscutting with chainsaws ...

and I think ...

"You have a chainsaw with a 900mm blade" ...

hmmm ...

I'm sure that would do the job too, but I am interested to get this saw working moderately well, so ...

Actually - in that video, and when I was using the saw - because of the significant curve to the toothline, it isn't completely obvious to me how you are supposed to move the saw. One possibility is to swing in a curved manner, so that the teeth are roughly following that curve and theoretically cutting a parabolic (or whatever) kerf.

Just moving the handle piston-like to and fro should change the point in the width of the cut where the teeth are cutting most ... I don't know if that is what you want or not. It occurred to me when doing the test cutting - cos I had some time on my hands - that the idea might be that when I am pushing the blade it cuts on the half of the kerf away from me, and then when the other guy is pushing it is cutting on my side. I have no idea - I was sweating a little at the time - I coulda been thinking anything

Cheers,
Paul

Some cool stuff found ...

Pacific Crest Trail Association - Trail Skills College - Home

http://www.pcta.org/pdf/trail-skills...ance_v0311.pdf
http://www.pcta.org/pdf/trail-skills...sign_v0311.pdf

http://www.pcta.org/pdf/an_ax_to_grind.pdf
http://www.bchmt.org/esbch/Cross%20Cut%20Saw.pdf
http://www.fs.fed.us/t-d/pubs/pdfpub...2815dpi300.pdf

Malcolm Rosholt Collection
The Wisconsin Logging Book, 1839-1939 / by Malcolm Rosholt
http://www.mcmillanlibrary.org/rosho...ging/index.pdf
http://www.mcmillanlibrary.org/rosho...s/00000008.pdf

http://www.bchi.org/education-manual...201%282%29.pdf (2001 edition)
ftp://ftp-fc.sc.egov.usda.gov/ID/sno...dent_guide.pdf (2006 edition)

http://www.hse.gov.uk/pubns/indg317.pdf
http://www.wst.tas.gov.au/__data/ass..._chainsaws.pdf
http://www.forestworks.com.au/multiv...20Mar%2009.pdf

Always wanted a truck and a couple of logs ...

Re the oil - I used lanolin (not sure which brand) on a lot of stuff and left it for two years and didn't find anything with more than a tinge of red when I pulled them out (...and then promptly put them back again )

Matt

Hmm, looking at your pics of that "one-man" crosscut brings back some mixed memories, Paul! On the one hand, aching arms & shoulders, & on the other, sitting on a log with my dad, having 'smoko', and the delicious smell of the bush & fresh-cut wood!

I wish I could help you with wise advise on how to get the best out of that saw, but I confess that I never took much notice of our 'black snakes' unless thay were dull, at which point they were handed over to the old pot, who (wisely) insisted on being the only one to take a file to them. Being much more keen on saws that smoked & made lots of noise at the time, I didn't even watch what he did other than casually, though I certainly appreciated the results! We used our saws mostly on green wood, only very occasionally on dry or semi-dry stuff. I can't remember if the sharpening was different for dry wood, but I suspect not, because we cut so little of it. They cut dry wood pretty well, but did need a lot more frequent touching up if docking a large dry log, that much I remember.

I do know the M-tooth was sharpened to cut on both strokes and that the teeth came to an outer point (I have very clear memories of the kerf- I wached thousands of them inching slowly to the bottom of a log! ). But how the point was achieved, I'm not sure, now. I seem to recall it was all done by angling the 'inside' (i.e. the bevelled side) of each tooth, & I don't think the front of the teeth were touched except when the gullets neded to be deepened every few years or so. They certainly weren't in the bush, but he may have done something more at home when getting them ready for a day or two's heavy use. Can't ask him now, of course....

Anyways, if I were thinking about ripping that Huon slab with potato power, I'd be seriously considering building a frame saw, with a nice thin blade optimised for rip sawing. I certainly wouldn't entertain trying it with the 'one-man'. Even if you altered the tooth geometry to something more suited to ripping, it would be much more difficult to control and leave you with a wide, wobbly kerf, unless you are a much better sawyer than I could ever be. Either way, having an assistant would greatly mprove the speed & accuracy of the cut, I reckon.

Or maybe you could get a couple of these blokes to do it for you:

Sawing log red.jpg


Cheers,

Grimshaw has a bit to say about M-tooth saws.

Cheers
Michael