Thread: Homemade Plane Blades from M2 HSS for Wooden Planes

thanks thumbsucker.... you are a champion!

Hi TS,

Yes, thanks for the organisation, top job.

Mate, if you PM me with your details I will send you some $$, electronic funds transfer will be fastest I reckon.

Cheers
Pops

The following members have now paid their share:

Groggy √
BobL √
kman-oz √
m2c1Iw √
martrix √
CLINTON1 √
Pops √
Toolin Around √
Derek √

*Request* If you are still to pay can you use your member name in the reference so I know who it is coming from.

*Updated 5 times *

Originally Posted by thumbsucker

The following members have now paid their share:

Groggy √
BobL √
kman-oz √


*Request* If you are still to pay can you use your member name in the reference so I know who it is coming from.

FYI I missed staturday and had it in the mail monday

Gday TS, I paid via internet last night so it should show up tonight or tomorrow. Let me know when you have it.

Hi TS,

Paid first thing this morning by electronic funds transfer, so you should see funds soon.

Cheers
Pops

Hello ,

TS and others as well,

Pretty loud "auction" it was, I'd say. TS is an obvious talent in the one of the most difficult fields of being. Excellente!

It is hard to wait to see what kind of planes will pack those irons .

kippis,

sumu

See attached photo's. A set of 20, a close up, and two comparison shots with a HNT Jointer/Smoother blade.

Cheers


Thumbsucker

TS, those are indeed blanks for serious irons .

What's next, thickness grinding, bevels cutting, hardening, tempering, surface polishing and sharpening.

Was it one or two service providers yet to come? Then you will sharpen them irons and deliver them to them fellas.

Kippis,

sumu

sumu next is to:

Originally Posted by sumu

thickness grinding, bevels cutting, hardening, tempering, surface polishing.

I am still asking around trying to get a best price on the next step. Also the guy Pure Edge Saw & Knife Pty Ltd in Bayswater that can do it cheap can only do it in two weeks, I would love to find someone who could do it sooner at a good price.

Originally Posted by sumu

Was it one or two service providers yet to come?

It will be two service providers most places only do grinding and the heat treatment is done out house. Only 2 or 3 companies in Melbourne have a vacuum furnace to temper D2 steel. Almost every one says that Hill's Heat treatment are the best in town. So I am not worried about that.

Sumu and anyone else - I have a question - I have been reading up heat treatment and cryogenics. Some tool companies claim that they temper their steel 3 times as this helps to give a finer crystalline structure to the steel and makes the edge last longer. Also cryogenics is all the rage in woodworking tools. However I have only found one company that even remotely claims to do cryogenics. Cryogenics seems like a good marketing thing to help sell tools, however will the average woodworker really notice the difference? Cryogenics service providers for tools are not common in OZ.

I am more concerned about getting someone who will do a good job grinding the blades. Their are so many choice however it is hard to know who is good. I have been warned that some of are "butchers", what ever that means. I think it is important to get the top and bottom faces parallel the side faces do no seem so critical as many of the blades I have from HNT are not square on the sides. Sumu what do you think?

Also do people think it is worth stress relieving the blades?

If anyone has used a grinding services that they recommend in Melbourne, please PM me. I am waiting back for quotes from 4 companies.

Originally Posted by sumu

Then you will sharpen them irons and deliver them to them fellas.

I will clean the bevel up a little however sharpening 20 D2 blades super fine is a little more time then what I have, free. Plus some people want to do their own sharpening, which is fine by me.

I will finalize on Monday Tuesday exactly who will do the grinding, the faster the better. I already have plan's for the planes I will build for my four blades. A Krenov style scrub plane is a good first plane I am told.

Hi TS,

I did some reading up on cryogenics about a year or so ago. Also had a chat to Terry Gordon on his view of the benifits.

General comments seemed to be that the actual edge retaining benifit was not significant and not worth the money spent to achieve it. Got the same information about the cryogenic providers too, that is, very few actually deliver the results and distinguishing the difference between treated and untreated blades was very difficult. A cryogenic service is just like any other service, you pick your plastic surgeon or plumber and you takes your chances.

So, with my limited knowledge and research I would be disinclined to go down the cryogenic path, particularly if the tripple heat treatment is a quality job.

Thanks for the photos TS, very nice. As BobL is picking the Perth blades up in January there is now rush on the blades from me.

Cheers
Pops

Originally Posted by Pops

the actual edge retaining benifit was not significant and not worth the money spent to achieve it.

Pops that seems to be me feeling as well. I think it is a cool things to say about your product however the benefits is not clearly distinguishable or quantifiable. Is is more magic the science at this time.

Maybe with a quality cryu outfit it maybe worth it, Ron Hock seems to swear buy it, claiming that he would not even use A2 steel without cryo. However he is selling his for profit.

With the W.A. folks collecting their blades through BobL in January 2008, and many of the Melbourne folks getting together on January the 5th inc. BobL for the BBQ show and tell. That is most people on the list except for 3 others who are in NSW or QLD. However the sooner the better as I am keen to finish the proof of concept and then start the Second Plane Blade Batch List.

Originally Posted by thumbsucker

sumu next is to:



I am still asking around trying to get a best price on the next step. Also the guy Pure Edge Saw & Knife Pty Ltd in Bayswater that can do it cheap can only do it in two weeks, I would love to find someone who could do it sooner at a good price.



It will be two service providers most places only do grinding and the heat treatment is done out house. Only 2 or 3 companies in Melbourne have a vacuum furnace to temper D2 steel. Almost every one says that Hill's Heat treatment are the best in town. So I am not worried about that.

Sumu and anyone else - I have a question - I have been reading up heat treatment and cryogenics. Some tool companies claim that they temper their steel 3 times as this helps to give a finer crystalline structure to the steel and makes the edge last longer. Also cryogenics is all the rage in woodworking tools. However I have only found one company that even remotely claims to do cryogenics. Cryogenics seems like a good marketing thing to help sell tools, however will the average woodworker really notice the difference? Cryogenics service providers for tools are not common in OZ.

I am more concerned about getting someone who will do a good job grinding the blades. Their are so many choice however it is hard to know who is good. I have been warned that some of are "butchers", what ever that means. I think it is important to get the top and bottom faces parallel the side faces do no seem so critical as many of the blades I have from HNT are not square on the sides. Sumu what do you think?

Also do people think it is worth stress relieving the blades?

If anyone has used a grinding services that they recommend in Melbourne, please PM me. I am waiting back for quotes from 4 companies.



I will clean the bevel up a little however sharpening 20 D2 blades super fine is a little more time then what I have, free. Plus some people want to do their own sharpening, which is fine by me.

I will finalize on Monday Tuesday exactly who will do the grinding, the faster the better. I already have plan's for the planes I will build for my four blades. A Krenov style scrub plane is a good first plane I am told.

I'm more than happy to take the blades without a bevel and do them myself. I'd acually prefer that as the whole blade has even hardening and tempering. I've found the beveled ends tend to take a bit of a beating during the process and often end up softer than the rest of the tool.

Originally Posted by Toolin Around

I'm more than happy to take the blades without a bevel and do them myself. I'd acually prefer that as the whole blade has even hardening and tempering. I've found the beveled ends tend to take a bit of a beating during the process and often end up softer than the rest of the tool.

great point

I agree with Toolin Around, it is best to get a uniform temper across and through the whole blade, before establishing the primary bevel. The skin effect were the outer casing of the steel will be softer then the inner only extends 1+/- mm of the surface of the blade. This skin affect is resolved when the blade is ground flat after tempering by removing that outer skin of steel.

However if the primary bevel is ground before tempering, then we will lose more the 1+/- because the thin bevel edge will become overheated during tempering which will force us to significantly regrind the whole primary bevel twice, wasting time doing two grinds of the primary bevel, costing us money because grinding the primary bevel is the most costly part of the process even in the steel's annealed state, and having to grind away 5 mm - 10 mm of a now overcooked and worthless steel from the primary bevel that was established for no reason in the first place. Regardless of what approach you will take you will have to grind the primary, and if it is such a difficult and thankless job why would one ever seek to do it needlessly twice.

It is therefore only reasonable to conclude that the best approach is to establish the primary bevel only once after the tempering process is complete.

PM me if you wish the primary bevel established for you, which I can do after the the blades are tempered. If you are like Toolin Around and you want to establish your own primary bevel then that will be fine, just PM so I know.

Toolin