Thread: Ironwoods Handsaw Bonanza & Restoration of...

Done in the true spirit, Brad - these vises were made on the jobsite in my dad's day, from whatever offcuts were to hand, so you've kept the faith. They don't have to be pretty, they just need to hold your saw firmly while you go at it with a file...

Cheers,

Cheers Ian, I know it doesn’t have to be fancy to do the job, but I can already see a few problems with mine.
The Khaya jaws have a bow in them. I ran them through the thicknesser, but it didn’t take the bow out. I put the bow in the centre so the ends would be able to spring in when the jaws are tapped down, but I think there is too much spring. When I tap the jaws down, the other end walks back up, it’s like a see-saw. If I whack the hell out of it, it clamps the blade. But I think it would be on the verge of splitting the uprights.

When I put the jaws together, and squeeze one end, there is about 3mm gap on the other end, I can squeeze both ends closed by hand, so thought it would be ok.
I could just run the faces over the jointer, but they will probably end up a bit thin for the tapers on the uprights, they are on the limit already.
I will persevere with it for now, but will definitely be looking at a MKII at some stage.

Brad, it might be too much bow in your jaws causing the problem, I guess it will be easy enough to plane the centres a bit & see what happens. You do need a bit of 'spring' in the jaws, as you rightly deduced, to ensure even pressure along the blade when they are tapped in.

But it might also be that you need to fiddle with the slope on the cut-outs in the jaws that engage the birds-mouths in the stiles. These should be arranged so the birds-mouths pinch the tops of the jaws together slightly as you tap them home. The emphasis is on "slightly" for both the longitudinal bow and the pinching effect, it doesn't need much. The jaws on mine hold pretty well & only need gentle tapping down to get a good grip on the saw. Like anything made of wood where a bit of precision is required, it's going to vary a bit with the weather and time. I had to dress the jaws on mine last year because they'd lost their 'spring' and weren't holding firmly in the centre.

I don't think the angle of the birds-mouth is super-critical, as I said in the post you referred to, I just guestimated the angle, based on the dim memory of watching my father whip one up (which would've been 60 years or more ago). By sheer fluke, I seem to have hit on the right angles, but I think there is a range of angles over which it will still work. However, there must also be a point where the angle gets too wide to hold. Maybe some rainy afternoon (if we ever have such things again!), I'll chew up some scraps and see if I can figure out what the sweet spots are for the angles....

Cheers,

I went with 10 degrees on the tapers, as you mentioned that figure in the other thread. Maybe this could be reduced back to 7 or 8, this would reduce the tendency of the jaws to move up as you are tapping the opposite end, especially with the harder timbers.
A bit of time was spent fettling the fit, tap them down a few times, then use a paring chisel to pare off the shiny spots on the lower parts of the taper faces.
If I get a bit of time today, I might see if I can reduce the bow on those jaws a bit and see if that alleviates the problem.
I have a lot of things to tidy up today before heading off to work in the morning for another week of drudgery.

I just spent an hour fiddling about with the sawvice.
I got the low angle jack out, and took most of the bow out of the contacting jaw faces. Then spent some more time refining the contacting tapers.
The results have improved things tremendously, a few careful taps now has the jaws clamping the full length of the blade snugly.
Next week when I am home again, I will soften the sharp edges and give it a coat of something. Might even get around to using it for what it’s made for.

One other problem I have noticed, I didn’t leave enough jaw length out the sides to clamp the full length of the blade on the bigger saws, unless I were to take the handle off .
With the Slack Sellars (#1) clamped in there with the handle right up against the upright, there is about 40mm of blade hanging out the end of the jaws on the right hand side, while there is still plenty of unused jaw on the left hand end. Something to consider for MKII.

Edit = just thinking aloud here. For MKII, I will probably cut the full length of the jaws with the corresponding angle to suit the birdmouth on the uprights , that way I can adjust the overhang to suit the saw being sharpened.

Originally Posted by Ironwood

......I will probably cut the full length of the jaws with the corresponding angle to suit the birdmouth on the uprights , that way I can adjust the overhang to suit the saw being sharpened.....

I've seen them made that way, so it should work fine. Once you got the angle right, coupla bevel cuts on the TS and Bob's your aunty.

I wouldn't get too bitter & twisted over the bit of saw you can't grip in the jaws. There's just about no way to cut the ends of jaws to accomodate every saw you are likely to stick in it. I thought I had mine right, but a couple of my saws won't go far enough in, one because of he handle shape, the other because it's too deep & I can't extend the slot any more 'cos there's that bolt I put in to stop it splitting, in the way.

The last 50mm of a handsaw, or 30mm of a backsaw never (or hardly ever), see the inside of a cut and you really only sharpen them to keep the toothline even. Some didn't bother with the heel end at all, & didn't joint their saws either, and ended with some funny looking saws! I do two things to manage if there's a bit of free blade at the heel. If it's only a few teeth & I'm in a hurry to get on with a job, I just put up with the unholy screech from the file. If I'm being more considerate to my ears (& the dogs'), & the file, I slide a small wooden handscrew over the blade. That dampens it nicely and I can file the overhung teeth as easily as those within the jaws.

I should probably make another vise for myself too - I didn't own my 28" progressive-pitch rip when I made my vise, and it's a shade longer than the jaws & the blade much too deep at the handle end for the slot in he rails. I dislike having to move the saw because I lose my rhythm. Maybe sometime after you do your Mk II with all the bugs ironed out, I'll be motivated to follow suit....

Cheers,