Page 2 of 5 FirstFirst 12345 LastLast
Results 16 to 30 of 74
  1. #16
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    Lindfield N.S.W.
    Age
    62
    Posts
    5,643

    Default

    The standard books on amateur lathes (Sparey, Harold Hall etc) show how it’s done. I agree that first time might take quite some time, but like most skills it will likely speed up over time. One day I might give it a go! But I will need to get the lathe properly set up - it’s been a real round tuit project.

    As for quality blades becoming available, hope springs eternal but there are few examples of an existing brand restoring lost quality - it takes a new entrant to fill the niche left by the existing brands as a result of their abandonment of the quality end ( think lie Nielsen and veritas - they only exist because Stanley had become awful). Once management consultants and accountants have taken control of a business it is an inevitable decline in quality in the futile search for profit margin.
    Cheers

    Jeremy
    If it were done when 'tis done, then 'twere well it were done quickly

  2. # ADS
    Google Adsense Advertisement
    Join Date
    Always
    Location
    Advertising world
    Age
    2010
    Posts
    Many





     
  3. #17
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Location
    Brisbane (western suburbs)
    Age
    77
    Posts
    12,095

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by jmk89 View Post
    The standard books on amateur lathes (Sparey, Harold Hall etc) show how it’s done. I agree that first time might take quite some time, but like most skills it will likely speed up over time. One day I might give it a go! But I will need to get the lathe properly set up - it’s been a real round tuit project.....
    Jeremy, go for it, with my blessing. I'll be quite interested in reading about how you do it, but it's extremely unlikely I'd be tempted to try myself. My lathe is purely a means to an end, & though I like having it & am very thankful for what it does, it's not a hobby in itself, so I just don't have the interest in pushing it to see what I can make it do. If the challenge is to see what you can get your lathe to do rather than just build a plane or two, I totally understand, but if the latter is more important, then I assure you, it will almost certainly be quicker if you cut the dovetails manually. As I've said on many occasions, it's far from the major job in building a plane.

    Perhaps the main reason I stick with a basic tools approach is because I constantly push the message that it's possible to make a very good infill with nothing more than simple hand tools and is something anyone can aspire to with only a minimal investment in tools required. So using machinery would be something of a betrayal, methinks. I already feel a bit guilty about using my lathe to make thumbscrews when I could make them without (& have done so)....
    Cheers,
    Ian
    IW

  4. #18
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Location
    Brisbane (western suburbs)
    Age
    77
    Posts
    12,095

    Default Fell off the wagon (again!)

    Yeah, ok, so I've made yet another plane I was never going to make....

    When I started to make the little plane that kicked off this thread I envisaged it with a rounded sole. However, I could not think of an easy way to do that using dovetailed construction. Theoretically, you could use a thick sole, dovetail the body together, then file a rounded bottom on the sole. If the peening was perfect & each tail completely filled its socket internally, that should work fine. But the reality is that it’s extremely difficult to ensure that you have filled each socket to perfection when you can’t see what’s going on deep inside, and I would expect to uncover a few nasty voids filing so much away. So because it was mainly an exercise to see how small I could go, & use up some very small scraps, I stuck with a flat sole.

    Ever since I finished it, I’d been musing about how I might make a small plane with a curved sole. I made a ‘double radiused’ plane for chair seats some years ago but opted for a wooden body with a brass strip across the front of the mouth, riveted to brass sides. I was a bit dubious about my construction method, but so far it has remained stable & solid.

    Anyway an idea occurred to me of how I could make a small radiused sole on a dovetailed body. No need to go into full details of the build, I'll just describe what I did that was different from making a 'normal' plane body.

    The amount of curvature needed for such a small plane is very slight, so my idea was to start out with a slightly thicker sole piece than I would normally use, and shape it. I started with a bit of steel just under 4mm thick for the sole (#1 was 3.2mm) and proceeded as if making a flat-soled plane to start with. I broached & filed the mouth, then marked, cut, & fitted the side dovetails while everything was still square. Then I drew some guidelines on the sole & screwed it onto a block of wood through the mouth:
    1 Shaping sole.jpg

    I then filed a curve front-to-back & side-to-side. The radius of the curve would be ~100 mm side to side & more like 150mm front to back so it is not a lot (but still took quite a bit of filing!).

    Here it is set up ready to peen - there is lots of protrusion of the front & back tails! 2 on peening block.jpg

    Peening was straightforward, though I realised after I'd started (too late) I should have trimmed the front & back tails a bit, there was much more metal protruding than needed, which makes peening more difficult. Fortunately, the Chinese brass I was using is very malleable & I got them pounded down without mishap; there were a couple of small gaps when filed off, but nothing too bad: 3 Sole radius.jpg

    The rest of the build went smoothly. With the benefit of experience on Vers1 I used 6mm thick brass for the back cross-piece instead of 4mm, which makes a more solid base for the back of the blade to sit on (there is no infill, the blade sits on the back of the mouth & the cross-piece only). The mouth isn't quite as I wanted it to be. I tried to keep it very narrow until the final fit, so I could round the front to match the curve of the sole & have the gap even, but it sorta sneaked up on me and it would have become too wide if I'd evened it out, so I've left it straight across. It's more of an aesthetic flaw than functional as it's not designed for fine planing: 4 mouth.jpg

    I tried the plane with a fine set & it planed quite ok along the grain direction, but its main role is to scoop out little pills of wood across the grain, which it does very nicely: 5 shavings.jpg

    So, curiosity satisfied & I got what I really wanted in the first place. The brass scraps were also about 5mm longer so I was able to cut out a better shape for the sides (well, I think so, anyway): 6 done.jpg


    Cheers,
    IW

  5. #19
    Join Date
    Oct 2018
    Location
    Dandenong Ranges
    Posts
    1,866

    Default

    Beautiful work Ian. When do you start making violins? (or maybe go back to it if I recall correctly?)

  6. #20
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Location
    Adelaide - outer south
    Age
    67
    Posts
    935

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by IanW View Post
    Yeah, ok, so I've made yet another plane I was never going to make....
    Yawn, no news there .

    The radius looks to be quite subtle in the photos but on thinking about the numbers you gave it is apparent that you could hollow out a piece of timber to a considerable depth with that plane.

    Is there any particular reason for having a different radius in the lateral direction?
    Cheers, Bob the labrat

    Measure once and.... the phone rings!

  7. #21
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Location
    Brisbane (western suburbs)
    Age
    77
    Posts
    12,095

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Mountain Ash View Post
    ..... When do you start making violins? (or maybe go back to it if I recall correctly?)
    Nope, instrument-making is one of many areas I have not dabbled in, MA. I long nurtured a desire to do so, & at one point my son was keen to have a go at making guitars, but for various reasons, it never happened, & now we live 3 states apart, so I don't know when we will get around to that! I will just have to content myself with admiring some of the terrific work of others.....

    Cheers,
    IW

  8. #22
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Location
    Brisbane (western suburbs)
    Age
    77
    Posts
    12,095

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by labr@ View Post
    .... Is there any particular reason for having a different radius in the lateral direction?...
    Bob, my reasoning is that the more curvature, the harder it is to control the plane. The fore-aft curve is what sets the tone, and you'll know if you've used a compass plane it gets harder to control the tighter the radius you are working. The side-to side curve doesn't need to be much at all for it to work like a gouge, and the less you have, the easier it is to plane a fairly smooth surface rather than a series of wheel-ruts. The curvature may not seem much, but you may be surprised at how small a hole it can dig. With a generous blade exposure I can scoop out a 'bowl' from a flat surface with a smaller radius than the plane's sole, but its main use for me will be as a tiny scrub plane, roughing out very small areas on small stuff... (& showing-off to others how small I can go .... )
    Cheers,
    IW

  9. #23
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    Rhode Island
    Posts
    77

    Default

    I really enjoyed this post Ian. I make instruments, at least I've made a few hand carved F5 mandolins in the past. Currently trying to find the desire to finish an acoustic guitar I've been working on. There are so many detours in my shop and I want to follow in your footsteps and someday make an infill, they look so nice. This little plane would see a bit of bench time if I didn't already have the Ibex set. I have it in my mind to build a infill shoulder plane first since I don't own one. Anyway, I'm glad to have builders like yourself to learn from. Oh, when I retire the things I'll do.
    Dick Hutchings

  10. #24
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Location
    Brisbane (western suburbs)
    Age
    77
    Posts
    12,095

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by banjopicks View Post
    ...... Oh, when I retire the things I'll do.....
    This is what we all think, bp, until it happens. Then everything slows down, except time!

    Thanks for the kind words, my whole idea is to encourage others to have a go. I couldn't claim every plane I've made was a roaring success, but given my level of ignorance & incompetence when I started, surprisingly few have been complete duds.

    A shoulder plane made by laminating sides to core pieces is pretty straightforward, and I've suggested it's a good introduction to making metal-bodied planes. You have a choice of 5 different sizes of proprietary blades, and you can make a matching width body for all of these using stock sizes of brass, which makes things much easier.
    SPs all sizes.jpg

    (These are not all mine, I made a couple for someone else & just happened to have an example of every size from 1/2" to 1.25" at one time so I couldn't pass up the photo op....)

    The first shoulder plane I made using the lamination technique was in the early 80s. It had a Record 1.25" blade.
    6 SP.jpg

    I made it with an adjustable toe, which I decided was an unnecessary complication, and it left a bit to be desired aesthetically, but it worked ok & served me well for several decades. I probably would have gone on using it 'til the end of (shed) days but I made a similar size for someone with a heavier blade (L.N.), which was a lot more "solid" than the thin Record blade. So the old original rosewood-infill model gave way to a ringed gidgee infill model, to match two smaller planes I'd made in the meantime. The side profiles are copied from an old Miller of London example I saw. So I now have 3 of the things, an utterly unnecessary luxury, but they do make a nice family group
    S-planes.jpg

    The little 1/2 inch job is surprisingly handy, and I think something this size would see a lot of use in any shop where instruments or other small stuff gets made. I haven't been making much in the way of furniture or bigger stuff these last few years, so the large size hasn't had all that much use - I think the last time I used it seriously was when I was making a large trestle table (which was two years ago, already!)

    So yeah, a shoulder plane is lotsa fun to make & though you are unlikely to use it every day, when you need it, it sure is a handy tool to have around the 'shop.

    Cheers,
    Ian

  11. #25
    Join Date
    Nov 2020
    Location
    Newcastle, NSW
    Posts
    225

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by banjopicks View Post
    Oh, when I retire the things I'll do.
    Exactly my thoughts! Only another 35+ years of work to go, but my list of things to make and skills to learn lengthens by the day.

    Quote Originally Posted by IanW View Post
    Thanks for the kind words, my whole idea is to encourage others to have a go.
    I'd say you're succeeding, Ian. Those planes are stunning! I'm beyond keen to attempt to make one and I'm sure a lot of others are inspired by your work. Blows my mind!

  12. #26
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Location
    NSW
    Posts
    643

    Default

    I just realised how bad your problem is Ian, when I went looking for this thread. You have tried to hide another plane build inside a thread about 'saw blades'.

  13. #27
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Location
    Melbourne
    Posts
    6,975

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Picko View Post
    I just realised how bad your problem is Ian, when I went looking for this thread. You have tried to hide another plane build inside a thread about 'saw blades'.
    Your spot on, there Picko.

    I’ve been trying to come up with some “comments” but you have put it perfectly.

    Poor guys just completely in denial.

    Lucky for us tho [emoji6][emoji6].

    Cheers Matt.

  14. #28
    Join Date
    Nov 2004
    Location
    Millmerran,QLD
    Age
    73
    Posts
    11,099

    Default

    I would point to a precedent. Now that the OP has included a theme off-topic, almost anything is now permitted your honour. In sentencing, I would like the following to be included.....

    Actually.....maybe not.



    Regards
    Paul
    Bushmiller;

    "Power tends to corrupt. Absolute power corrupts, absolutely!"

  15. #29
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    South Africa
    Posts
    950

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by johknee View Post
    Exactly my thoughts! Only another 35+ years of work to go, but my list of things to make and skills to learn lengthens by the day.
    I’m thirty years odd older than you and am still trying to make sure that I have all the tools I could ever need by the time I retire, let alone the skills. It’s nearly a full time job.

  16. #30
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    US
    Posts
    3,076

    Default

    stainless is a booger for sawing, even for portabands. I don't know if the blades you had deformed due to unhardened stainless or if something was going on at the point of the cut where little bits of metal were work or air hardening.

    I've made a bunch of plane irons out of XHP and if you pause for a second with a bimetal portaband blade, the steel at the point of the cut will harden and run the teeth right off of the blade. It's a hardness issue more than wear resistance and I would guess the reality with jewelers blades is that they've never really intended to please a market for cutting stainless.

    I'm sure if I asked starrett about the portaband blades, they would say "why are you cutting stainless dry?".

    I've gone back to cutting XHP by hand with lenox hacksaw blades - it's not fast, but it's not really slower than whizzing $7 worth of teeth off of blades and then waiting for more to be delivered (those portabands will generally cut 4 or 5 full sets of carbon steel to make chisels - or put in money terms (the way I prefer to think of it) about 35 cents a chisel to get a fat piece of bar stock that can be hammered to taper.

    The same thing has happened mostly with files here - they were in home stores in limited sizes, but nicholson. Then nicholson went to mex and they're OK (more recent have improved to near what they were before they left the USA) and then they disappeared from at least one of the two chains here. I no longer try to buy any of this stuff in person (lenox bimetal blades for hack saws would've been something I could get for the same price in person, but haven't seen in "roughing" tooth count for a long time - 18tpi).

Page 2 of 5 FirstFirst 12345 LastLast

Similar Threads

  1. N.S.W. Jewellers saws x 3
    By clear out in forum WOODWORK - Tools & Machinery
    Replies: 3
    Last Post: 1st July 2018, 01:19 PM
  2. Best blades for jewellers saw?
    By haggismuncher in forum HAND TOOLS - UNPOWERED
    Replies: 3
    Last Post: 13th June 2010, 09:12 AM
  3. Antique Jewellers lathe
    By Woodlee in forum ANTIQUE AND COLLECTABLE TOOLS
    Replies: 23
    Last Post: 10th December 2009, 10:06 PM
  4. Jewellers saw blade choice
    By jmk89 in forum METALWORK FORUM
    Replies: 8
    Last Post: 10th November 2009, 12:01 AM
  5. Jewellers sawblade in nut.
    By ohno in forum SAFETY
    Replies: 15
    Last Post: 29th October 2006, 11:55 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •