Thanks: 0
Needs Pictures: 0
Picture(s) thanks: 0
Results 1 to 6 of 6
Thread: Lots of problems with square
-
24th March 2023, 11:54 PM #1New Member
- Join Date
- Dec 2022
- Location
- Brasil
- Posts
- 4
Lots of problems with square
Hey fellows, long time not showing up here... Almost ten years ago I sold all my stuff and quit woodworking just because I didn't have space for the job (and not even to my tools). Long story short, I now have a good shed, am buying back my tools and starting some home projects.
The reason I am here today is to claim for help about an issue that has haunted me since I can remember: square. I have this BIG difficulty of cutting pieces in perfect square and I realized that the 90% of the problem comes from the squares I have that... aren't actually in square!
I figured it out because after to make a cut in square (supposedly) if I check the square right after I see that it's not. Therefore the reason is because my squares are not correctly in 90 degree (probably it's a half or a full degree opened or closed, not sure). Currently I have four metal squares, being two of them casted in one unique piece (a triangle medium one and a big carpenter one). But NO ONE of my squares seems to be reliable enough and the closer I get to a "more or less squared" is after a lot of efforts doing several checks using a measure tape and a small school plastic square. This is very straining and frustrating.
I'd like to know how do you guys deal with this and if there are tricks to check square without using a square tool.
Thanks!
-
24th March 2023 11:54 PM # ADSGoogle Adsense Advertisement
- Join Date
- Always
- Location
- Advertising world
- Posts
- Many
-
25th March 2023, 07:06 AM #2Member
- Join Date
- Nov 2006
- Location
- Ireland
- Posts
- 84
The simple way to check a square is to put it against a straight edge,
draw a line, flip the square over and draw a second line at the same
point. Any inaccuracy in the square is multiplied by a factor of two.
For greater accuracy make up a frame with four straight pieces of wood.
Each piece should be fixed at one end but free to swivel at the other.
Place your square at one intersection and tighten down the two pieces of wood. Work round the frame setting and tightening the following piece with your square.
Any inaccuracies in your square will be multiplied by a factor of four when you come to the final corner.
Sorry I can't upload a pic( I have one of a test jig for this but it's not mine, I downloaded it from somewhere on the net )
To be really accurate you need to be sure that your test wood is straight.
You can't check one straight edge, you need three. Two straight edges may
mesh together with no spaces but still be out, one could be concave and the other convex. Three edges which all agree with each other have to be straight.
Regards
Jim
-
25th March 2023, 07:21 AM #3Senior Member
- Join Date
- Nov 2010
- Location
- Sebastopol, California, USA
- Posts
- 177
Jim's more accurate test is a new one to me. I've relied for years on the first test he describes, and it works quite well. Two notes:
1. Make sure the edge you're using to test from is dead straight and smooth (bumps will render the test useless), and be sure the relevant edges of the square are clean.
2. Use either a fine-tipped pencil or a knife (or fine-pointed scribe, if testing on metal), and be careful to keep the pencil/knife/scribe at a consistent angle to the square as you make the line. The finer the line, the easier it is to see minor deviations from square.
If you've got a square with a handle/stock and a "rule" or beam, such as an engineer's square,
Screen Shot 2023-03-24 at 1.16.49 PM.png
test both edges of the beam.
Also, it's a good idea to hold up a board against that straight edge and test the square for measuring inside corners (not as critical, usually, and a little trickier).
If you do find your square isn't, you can file one-piece squares or built-up squares (like engineer's squares). Depending on how it's out, file the "high" end, then file along the full length to get it straight again. You can spend hours doing this, if you're not experienced in filing.
If you have a combination square, you adjust it for square by removing the rule and filing the little ridges in the head on which the rule runs. This requires a very thin file. Best is an auger bit file, which has an end with no teeth on the faces, only on the edges; but you can get by with, say, a warding file or a needle/Swiss pattern file.
-
25th March 2023, 07:37 AM #4Member
- Join Date
- Feb 2023
- Location
- Finger Lakes Area, Central New York State, USA
- Age
- 69
- Posts
- 50
Squares are seldom very accurate if they are the economy type even if they start out good they tend to wander. the other issue that could be causing your issue is you are measuring off the work piece that is not a good flate edge say after a saw cut.
The link here is for a couple of handy blocks called 1 2 3 blocks. These are usually pretty accurate and can be used for many functions in the shop not the lease of which is checking your square for accuracy.
Have a look there are many block options.
I have these from Amazon and find they are quite accurate
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1
I also bought this square (currently unavailable) good this it is unavailable because it was NOT SQUARE....junk.
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1
calabrese55
-
25th March 2023, 08:05 AM #5Member
- Join Date
- Nov 2006
- Location
- Ireland
- Posts
- 84
Quick diagram to illustrate the principle.
diagram.JPG
-
26th March 2023, 05:07 AM #6New Member
- Join Date
- Dec 2022
- Location
- Brasil
- Posts
- 4
Hey fellows! Since I am a newcomer the administrators longed a little while to release my thread so in the meantime I found some good answers in "Woodworking Talk" and "Fine Woodworking" forums. I found especially great this video with some easy tips and thanks to this I could confirm that contrary to what I guessed two of my four squares were just fine, and the other two inaccurate ones I could fix without any effort:
Long story short:
1) My speed square was correct - no need to take any measure
2) My two-part "L" square was correct - no need to take any measure
3) My frame square was out - the punch technique corrected it (I used a Philips screwdriver and a hammer)
4) My combination square was out - the scrape technique corrected it
Similar Threads
-
Cabinet drawer making ... lots and lots of details
By derekcohen in forum FURNITURE, JOINERY, CABINETMAKING - formerly BIG STUFFReplies: 0Last Post: 18th March 2021, 12:02 AM -
square cuts with the blade at 90, out of square at 45???
By zoovegroover in forum WOODWORK - GENERALReplies: 3Last Post: 9th July 2017, 07:54 PM -
Sliding miter saw: how square is square?
By IdahoEv in forum GENERAL & SMALL MACHINERYReplies: 12Last Post: 21st April 2016, 05:14 AM -
Lots and lots and then some more tools
By Simplicity in forum HAND TOOLS - UNPOWEREDReplies: 1Last Post: 7th October 2015, 08:52 AM -
square to table or square to fence
By yjnb in forum BANDSAWSReplies: 1Last Post: 20th July 2008, 07:50 AM