Thread: New (OCT 2005) Bessey Clamp Order

Thanks for that Ingrid.

Burn

Hi all,

During the month of October Woodcraft has 40% off 24" and 40" Bessey K-Body Clamps. This makes them US$21.59 and US$26.99 respectively.

http://www.woodcraft.com/family.aspx...ePageDeal=True

Regards,
Mirboo.

Miraboo,

Those prices are essentially the same as Lee Valley's, given Woodcraft is large enough to negotiate the same freight rates that Lee Valley has with it's shippers.

I am hopeing we can increase our numbers of ordered clamps to get a better deal and hence we can potentially match these US figures and hey .. we did it though an Australian supplier! Not to mention, we are getting discount on all K-bodies, not just 2 or 3 specific sizes. We do expect similar discounts on the non K-body Bessey items, but this will be confirmed shortly.

As Rob Lee points out, we need our local woodworking retailers/importers, without them and the gross margin they require to survive, all we are left with is retailers like Bunnings to supply our woodworking needs.

Burn I recently purchased a whole heap of K bodies from Colin so I will buy locally where I feel Im not being done over.

What gets up my nose is that Hordens knew about the last order and no doubt know about this one, yet we have to bend over backwards in order that they sell to us at a price which we can already get. Horden's can surely pressure their suppliers given the situation.

I might get shot down for this but I cant see why I should be paying 1 cent more than I would if I buy from Rob.

Originally Posted by boban

I might get shot down for this but I cant see why I should be paying 1 cent more than I would if I buy from Rob.

There may be an economy of scale to apply. Bessey Tools USA probably order a container load of clamps to make up this 'US Sale' and hence get a nice discount from Bessey Germany. A big order from H&C to Bessey would probably be 3 or 4 pallet loads and the discount would be scaled accordingly. We are asking both Colin and H&C to reduce their gross margins to minimum to attempt to match the US price.

I used to be the Operations manager for a Compter distribution company and imported around 6 to 7 million dollars (cost) worth of stock to sell per year. To get a really good discount to our end users, we needed to get comittment from our customers, organise sea freight and badger a better discount from the manufacturer based on a much larger than normal order being placed as well as differeing payment terms to the usual. We could never get the discounts distributors in the US or Europe got as we never had the volume.

The things I learnt back then, was that there is no loyality - either from the manufacturer to the distributor or from the customer to the distributor. Loyality only existed to money. As a distributor, we would bust ourselves to sell a product, stock spares, train sales and support staff, take risks on selling/supporting bleeding edge products etc, but if the manufacturer thought they could get an extra few dollars, they would move out to Australia themselves, reduce our discount to support this move and then sell to all and sundry offering us nothing for the work and effort we put in to establish their products name. Customers would happily switch to the lowest bidder not really checking if the lowest bidder could provide the same level of service we could ... sour grapes? Probably, but I did learn this was a fact of life for distributors.

I'm not shooting you down Boban, just pointing out why I think we need to be able to present to H&C a large enough order that they can screw some more points out of Bessey and perhaps reduce their required Gross Margin slightly, but they, like anyone else, would need justification to reduce their Gross Margin. Exposure is one reason, a number of members of my local woodcraft guild didn't know what a K-Body clamp was. By paying them at time of delivery to Colin's warehouse rather than making them wait for normal account terms is another. By our using this forum to collect enough people to comit to purchase clamps is like a 'free salesperson' to them. All of this is aimed to give them cause to reduce their margin. I would also point out that Colin is taking a huge cut to margin as well. I do hope we all have the decency to thank him by way of additional sales from his normal stock lines.

Burn

Gents, the decision to go with Rob Lee or Colin belongs to each of us, there is no-one pushing us either way.

What I recall from the last effort was that it was largely a goodwill exercise on Rob's part, and perhaps the biggest dividend he got was customer awareness of Lee Vallley.

What Colin stands to gain is essentially the same, dropping prices to compete with LV and others doesn't leave much margin for an Aussie supplier.

However, I was disappointed last time there were no Aussie suppliers appearing to make an effort, this time there is. It may have been they wanted to, but didn't want to be seen starting a competitive bunfight on a BB hosted by another good company, UBeaut. Speaking for myself, even if there is a small difference in price, and given the economies of scale involved, I am willing to pay a small additional sum to encourage this to happen again.

I am concerned that trying to compare the two may sour the event for Colin or others; making it less likely an Aussie supplier will try this again - leaving us as grumpy old men on a BB complaining about the lack of Oz industry initiative.

I applaud both Northwood tools and Lee Valley for getting involved, the choice of who to buy from is ours to make. Finally, I'd like to comment that if this ever happens again, it will be because the retailer is willing to do so. That means they don't get a lot of grief and they don't lose money. I think we should be careful not to sour the deal.

As a smart person once said "You can never please all the people all the time" I am going with this order to show my appreciation for the effort being shown. A few extra dollars is a price I am willing to pay. Lets get behind this effort as I think in the future we may want to do this again and all those doing the work may say not this time!!!!!!

Don't forget it is difficult to compare prices. Don't get me wrong I do not support the local guy at all cost but in this instance at the end of the day we are getting a bargain on the normal cost we have to pay.

Doesn't one always hear about jobs going overseas. It seems to me that often people say this but when a few dollars are concerned it is STUFF the aussie.

A Happy Boxer

Hi Guys, is this still going ahead?

thanks.

Originally Posted by epf

Hi Guys, is this still going ahead?

thanks.

Yes. It is.

Burn

Thanks Burn. I will log my order tonight. Are the numbers building?

Originally Posted by epf

Thanks Burn. I will log my order tonight. Are the numbers building?

The numbers are building

K30 14
K60 46
K100 30
K125 10
K150 42
KP Set 22
TG25 6
TG30 4
WS3 4
WS6 2
EHZ30 4
GZR20 8
EKT55 8
GRZK 2

For a while the K150's were the winner, but the K60's have edged them out. Personally, I've enough small K-Bodies, so I'm just after K150's - inexpensive (for this order) champagne sash clamps! ... Yes, I know they are not, but check out the price of 1.5m sash clamps on anyone's website.
Burn

wow that looks good. Any anticipation of pricing yet?

Just a stupid idea, why dont we Aus woodworkers take a copy of the K-Body clamps to China or Tawin and get a better cheaper version made, every one on this board buys imported table saws and GMC tools, why not hey, (we may have to check out the copy right conditions)

In the short term bag yourselfs some cheap clamps. from Northwood or Rob.

Originally Posted by epf

wow that looks good. Any anticipation of pricing yet?

Very soon. Need to work out freight issues, not to mention GST.

As to sending some K-Bodies to China, I'd imagine if one did that you'd see a few mm's off the bar in thickness, and a mm or so off the thickness of the plastic bodies ... not to mention the quality of the cam in the head .... I know Vic Wood had the right idea by licencing a cheap copy of his lathes in China, but I wonder how it stands up. Can a good design stand the rigours of being built to a price???