Thread: Salmen Master Oil Stone.

Stewie - thanks for opening me to Western naturals. They are lovely. I am a fan of Japanese & Australian naturals, I am tempted to try a few European naturals.

You have me by the short and curly's. I never knew Australia ever quarried their own natural sharpening stones.

Stewie;

Gadge a forum member has been mining them from around the Hunter Valley. He does not sell but he does trade. They are very nice water stones. If used across the sedimentary layer on the edge they are in the #10000 to #15000 grit range. I have found that on the face they can be a little flakey.

I have three of them and he has them in medium soft to hard. I hope to get more of them over time as he mines them. They are comparable to the Japanese naturals that I have. Different but very good.

Originally Posted by planemaker

You have me by the short and curly's. I never knew Australia ever quarried their own natural sharpening stones.

Stewie;

try googling "Mudgee stone"

from a pamphlet published in 1875 -- "There are alsolarge quarries of stone nearly, if not quite, equalto the far famed Turkey stone and extensivelyused for sharpening edged tools."

There are also large quarries of stone nearly, if not quite, equal
to the far famed Turkey stone and extensively
used for sharpening edged tools. The geological
formation is probably Devonian, connected with
serpentine, charged with chromate of iron
affected by green-stone, diorite, and trappean
porphyritic whin-stone and folspar

http://aiatsis.gov.au/sites/default/...eTimes1875.pdf

Thanks for the info Ian.

Originally Posted by ian

try googling "Mudgee stone"....

Didn't help me much, ian - most of what I got was to do with a quarry that doesn't seem to do whetstones. But I did find this, eventually. (Edit: and so did Stewie, obviously! )

Stewie, I can see how you can become passionate about those stones - they are pretty things!

Interest in 'natural' stones seems to be breaking out all over, these last few years, particularly with that strange group of neolithics that have taken to shaving with cut-throat razors (why do you think they were called that? ) But a few years ago, I finally gave up on my two natural stones, a 'soft white' (medium fine) and a translucent white (finest) Arkansas. This was due to the number of A2 and other very hard blades that have found their way into my shed. I was finding it more and more tedious to sharpen them on my trusty Arkansas stones, which cut very slowly no matter how well-dressed, but worse, they just would not put a tolerable edge on one very hard blade, in particular (an Academy Works job). So a few years ago, I reluctantly moved to diamond plates and one of the 'new breed' water stones. The water stone is still a pita, and needs constant attention, though nowhere near as much as the soft things I tried 35 years ago, thank goodness, so although I miss the way the Arkansas stones remained flat for years on end, and I hate using water as a lubricant, I can at last get those damned hard blades properly sharp.....

Cheers,

She explains the source of place names such as Dunedoo (small feet), Mudgee (sharpening stone), Dubbo (ground grub), Coonabarabran (inquisitive person) and Gunnedah (motherless). Why Coogee smells in history - National - smh.com.au

Hi IanW; the Arkansas I posted recently is a slow cutting stone that releases little in cutting slurry. imo other nat stones, indigenous to the u.k, are far better sharpening stones. No offense intended to our U.S forum viewers..

Stewie;

imo; a good quality natural sharpening stone is one that will shows signs of releasing a natural cutting slurry. Any stone that is within the higher range of hardness, that show no signs of releasing a cutting slurry is of limited value to the woodworker, and does require the use of an independent slurry stone to enhance its rate of cut. In other words, there can be clear differences between the needs of woodworker, and that of a straight razor user.

Stewie;

Hi IanW; the Arkansas I posted recently is a slow cutting stone that releases little in cutting slurry. imo other nat stones, indigenous to the u.k, are far better sharpening stones. No offense intended to our U.S forum viewers..

Stewie;

The process of cleansing the Arkansas stone of oil has started. Boiling hot water and 2 dishwasher power balls.

Stewie;

After 1 hr, the dishwasher power balls have lost their effectiveness within the oil cleansing process. The following photo shows the oil residue that's already released from the stone.



The process needs to be repeated again to further rid the stone of oil. The contaminated water has to be emptied out, cleaned out with dishwasher detergent, and refilled with boiling hot water, ready for 2 fresh dishwasher power balls.



To slow down the loss of temperature within the water, seal the top of the container. Check again in 1 hrs time. Note any further loss of oil from the stone via the appearance of the water. Repeat a 3rd time if its deemed necessary.

I will supply some later feedback on the results of testing the oil free Arkansas stone with water as the lubricant.

Stewie;

An update on the oil cleansing process. I noticed that some oil had been trapped on the underside of the stone during the 2nd round.
I opted for a 3rd round lasting only 30 min, this time making sure that I gently lifted the stone from side to side within its water bath to allow the loose oil to rise to the top of the water.

A few important comments to add; if the stone is not Novaculite within its structure, it may not survive without cracking after being submerged in boiling water. That being the case, it would be better to lower the temp of water. Also, make sure that the bottom of the stone be raised slightly above the bottom of the container to allow the water bath to better penetrate all sides of the stone. A couple of short brass or stainless steel rods would do the trick. Rinse the stone in fresh clean water and dry at the end of the cleansing process.

The following photos shows the stones colour change after completing the oil cleansing process.

After the 1st bath;


After the 3rd and final bath;


Stewie;

As requested; I am forwarding the feedback after testing the Arkansas stone with water as the only lubricant. The 1st observation to note was that after spraying the top surface of the stone with water, the water did not soak within the stone, but maintained a unified float of film. That indicates to me that the stone is not porous by nature, but more tightly bound within its make up.

The 2nd observation to make is that when the stone surface was being worked by the chisel, the sound being given off was much deeper in tone to that experienced when oil was used as lubricant. A much more grittier sound. One could feel the chisels edge being worked in closer contact with the grain structure of the stone, versus having a float of oil interfere between the 2 surfaces.

The time taken to form an appreciable secondary bevel imo was 1/2 that compared to using oil, but apologies need to be made, as I did nor record the exact time difference. The sheen formed on the secondary bevel, to my eyes, looked no different to that being worked on oil, but one would expect it to be slightly lower.

The level of sharpness straight from the stone more than matched my requirements within woodworking, as testament by the paper test shown within the 2 following photo's.

Conclusion; as a once only test, I see no valid reason to return to using oil on this Arkansas stone. If any issues later arise on the question of water versus oil in preventing the stones surface from glazing over or clogging up, that would be dealt with during the normal practice of resurfacing during periodical stone flattening.

All attempts have been made to remain impartial within my findings.

Hopefully you found the above mentioned topic of some interest. If you decide to de-oil any of your sharpening stones in the future, make sure they are not a man-made Norton Crystolon/Carborundum, as this will likely destroy the manufacturers oil pre-fill.

On to the photo's.

regards Stewie;

As mentioned previously, I have no intention of buying more honing stones. So that in itself will represent the end of my threads on nat stones. (you can breath easy now gents).

I still have a side hinge sharpening box to make for the Scotch Dalmore Blue. That's a few weeks away from completing, and will represent the last time I post a thread dedicated to making a sharpening stone box..

Stewie;