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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
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    South Africa
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    872

    Default Stanley #4 Type 14

    I picked up a type 14 #4 recently, in an online auction. Iíve been on the lookout for a decent #4 for a while as I offered to help my nephew to find one as heís getting started doing some woodwork and likes the idea of using hand tools.

    Unfortunately itís got a couple of issues that the seller didnít mention or post photos of (one of those sellers who donít actually give a description but rely on the pictures for that). He knows enough about old planes to have posted a picture of the patent date and took the lever cap off to show the blade a bit better. But he didnít show a picture of the broken handle or the broken and brazed back together lever cap.

    Iíll take some pictures later and post them for prosperity, but thought Iíd post this now as a way of muttering about it to people who understand. I didnít pay too much, although Iíd not have bid at all if the pictures had shown the true condition, so Iím not too distressed, and itís a mission to get back into town to send it back to him, so even if he offers a refund Iíll probably just keep it and fix it up as a user. I doubt Iíll ever bid on one of his items again though, I can be quite unforgiving when Iíve been taken advantage of. The blade is one of the sharpest Iíve seen on a second hand plane so the original owner was using it and knew what to do.

    There is a pin in the handle to stop it swivelling, but the break has been flattened and even if I glued it, it wouldnít line up 100%. Iím tempted to make a new handle for it, just to see if I can. The lever cap seems to work so I doubt Iíll fiddle with it beyond cleaning it a bit.

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  3. #2
    Join Date
    Oct 2018
    Location
    Dandenong Ranges
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    845

    Default

    Hi Colin. That is particularily frustrating but making a new handle isn't too hard (cloth backed sandpaper and a wood rasp are key). Matching the timber to the knob can be though. What dark timbers do you have available?

  4. #3
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    South Africa
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    Default

    I might have a little tamboti (Spirostachys africana) that will be the right size, if I do, I’ll be able to make a matching knob as well. This plane will never be a collectors piece, so I can use it to learn how to make handles. I might just pull the trigger on that Trend Airshield I’ve been looking at before I start - tamboti dust is pretty toxic, and it’s worth avoiding exposure as much as possible.

  5. #4
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Location
    Brisbane (western suburbs)
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    75
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    10,175

    Default

    I think it's a bit cute to use carefully oriented pics & claim that is a full or sufficient "description", particularly the patched lever-cap (which isn't too clear even in your pics, Colin! ).

    Anyway, it still looks like you've got some decent bones & it should make a good user, after you've put a bit of work into it. Making handles & knobs is pretty straightforward, the trickiest bit is drilling that long stud hole in the handle. I stuffed up several in my first attempts, until I learnt to set up the blank more accurately. It's the first job I do, so if it goes south I've not wasted much time. The counter-bore for the brass dome nut is best done with a Forstner bit (to get a flat bottom), but it's 7/16", which is a nuisance if you don't have a full set of fractional sizes.

    As Mountain Ash sez, cloth-backed paper of various grades and a good rasp are your friends. I've also made a few narrow scrapers from scraps of saw-plate, and these are very helpful when cleaning up after rasping to shape (they work best on very hard woods).

    Cheers,
    IW

  6. #5
    Join Date
    Oct 2019
    Location
    melbourne
    Posts
    29

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    someone on youtube (paul sellers?) recommends leaving your handle stock completely rough and well oversized until you've drilled the through hole, and then you square up the stock in the same plane as you drilled in, and do your layout relative to the angle of the hole -- rather than trying to drill a perfect hole to match your layout

  7. #6
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    South Africa
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    872

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by IanW View Post
    I think it's a bit cute to use carefully oriented pics & claim that is a full or sufficient "description", particularly the patched lever-cap (which isn't too clear even in your pics, Colin!
    Quote Originally Posted by IanW View Post
    ).
    Itís quite common here (certainly for old tools, which is really the only category I look at) to just show some pics. The better sellers provide decent quality pictures and place them in the description where they show up better. The best sellers also describe what theyíre selling, listing any potential faults.


    I sent the seller a message stating that Iím unhappy with the damage not being shown or mentioned, and if he responds and offers a refund, Iíll not give him a negative rating. If he doesnít respond or responds but doesnít accept that he is in the wrong, Iíll rate negatively. Either way, Iíll never buy from him again.


    Quote Originally Posted by IanW View Post
    Anyway, it still looks like you've got some decent bones & it should make a good user, after you've put a bit of work into it. Making handles & knobs is pretty straightforward, the trickiest bit is drilling that long stud hole in the handle. I stuffed up several in my first attempts, until I learnt to set up the blank more accurately. It's the first job I do, so if it goes south I've not wasted much time. The counter-bore for the brass dome nut is best done with a Forstner bit (to get a flat bottom), but it's 7/16", which is a nuisance if you don't have a full set of fractional sizes.

    I donít have a full set of Forstner bits, itís on my list of stuff to buy if I see a good deal though. If the worst comes to the worst Iíll grind a scraper the right size and do the counter sink manually on the lathe.


    Quote Originally Posted by IanW View Post
    As Mountain Ash sez, cloth-backed paper of various grades and a good rasp are your friends. I've also made a few narrow scrapers from scraps of saw-plate, and these are very helpful when cleaning up after rasping to shape (they work best on very hard woods).
    Quote Originally Posted by IanW View Post


    Cheers,
    I have a no name brand rasp, which did OK when I made a handle for a hammer a while back, and lots of Abranet, which is really good stuff to sand with.


    Edit not sure whatís going on, but it keeps inserting extra QUOTE tags when I save.

  8. #7
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    Oct 2009
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    South Africa
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    Quote Originally Posted by banana View Post
    someone on youtube (paul sellers?) recommends leaving your handle stock completely rough and well oversized until you've drilled the through hole, and then you square up the stock in the same plane as you drilled in, and do your layout relative to the angle of the hole -- rather than trying to drill a perfect hole to match your layout
    Good advice, thanks. Iíd probably have done it the wrong way around and ended up battling the whole way.

  9. #8
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Location
    Hervey Bay
    Posts
    176

    Default

    Lee Valley have plane tote templates - very useful

    https://assets.leevalley.com/Origina...ote-c-07-e.pdf

    Good luck, Jeff

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