Stanley Planes; What Type of Thread Are the Screws and Nuts?

[seanz]

Well, the title says it all.

I used the search function but "thread" and "Stanley" bring up quite a few results.


Are they UNC?

[Vann]

Are they UNC?

Nope, the threads are Whitworth profile, but few are BSW. Which ones specifically?

Cheers, Vann.

ps very modern Stanleys are metric I think.

[seanz]

Whitworth? Bunny-rabbits! I should have tried harder when I was bidding on those taps&dies this morning.....dratted self imposed upper $ limits. Oh well.

It's not for any specific plane or piece of gear, it's just so I know what the threads are (or should be) when one needs a bit of a clean-up.

I suppose I could also get a proper thread gauge.........

[Thumbthumper]

Well, the title says it all.

I used the search function but "thread" and "Stanley" bring up quite a few results.


Are they UNC?

My friends at a US forum say this (US Stanley planes)

Stanley used 12-20 threads for the tote and knob rods. The screw at the front of the tote and the frog screws are also of this thread size and pitch.

and

The rod diameter is 7/32 with a 20 tpi thread. A 1/4" rod diameter is usually associated with 20 tpi (1/4-20) and a 7/32 rod usually has a 24 tpi thread (12-24).

The thread sizes are supposedly non-standard.

[Vann]

The thread sizes are supposedly non-standard.

Or pre-standard. Stanley adopted these threads before BS chose certain tpi/diameter combinations as standard.

When Record went into plane production in the early 1930s they copied Stanley planes of the period, right down to the threads. Here are the sizes from Recordcollector's site:

Cap Iron screw : 5/16" 18tpi BSW (I believe this is the only standard BSW thread on benchplanes)
Frog screws : 7/32" 20tpi Whitworth;
Tote & Knob bolts : 7/32" 20tpi Whitworth;
Tote Toe screw : 7/32" 20tpi Whitworth;
Frog Adjusting Plate screw : 7/32" 24tpi Whitworth;
Frog Adjusting screw : 1/4" 24tpi American/Unified;
Brass Adjusting nut : 9/32" 24tpi American/Unified (left-hand thread);
Lever Cap screw : 9/32" 24tpi American/Unified.

Recordcollecter previously had all threads specified as Whitworth form, but when I checked his site tonight I found he's updated his information thanks to input from the TTTG.

I hope this has you sufficiently confused .

So only the 5/16" tap and die would have been any use Seanz.

Cheers, Vann.

[clear out]

Jim Davey is one of the people who is clued up on this the other that springs to mind would be John Bates.
John has written a treatise on Stanley threads, TTTG can probably source it for you.
I did have taps for the lever cap hold down screw and the left hand for the adjusting wheel stud but sold them a year or so back at a TTTG club sale at Asquith.
Jim bought some and I can't remember who else.
I'd sourced some of these locally thru a contact who knew the P&N managment and the left hand thru the 'States.
Was casting repo frogs for 113s etc but it wasn't worth it back then.
Good luck finding this stuff now.
H.

[seanz]

I hope this has you sufficiently confused

No more than usual.......

Thanks for the replies, very helpful.

And thanks for reminding me about the left hand thread. Fortunately I've only had one dodgy one sofar and that frog was no good anyway but the LH thread means I'm not likely to come across a die for that particular bit anytime soon........

[Vann]

I wonder if there'd be enough interest in a group purchase of plane taps and dies. Some of these odd threads may be available internationally or we could ask Sutton for a price to manufacture them.

I guess we would be looking at small quantities - possibly as little as a dozen of each (maybe they'd just laugh at us ).

Anyone else interested?

Cheers, Vann.

[NZStu]

When the wife's grandfather died, the cleanout of his workshop revealed quite a range of odd taps and dies. He used to be an engineer at Todd Park in Porirua (back when they still made cars there), so he'd accumulated a whole heap of interesting and useless stuff. We came across a complete left-handed whitworth tap and die set at one stage. Not sure whether all that suff ended up with my father-in-law or his brother, but I might see if I can find out as there are bound to be at least some of the correct ones in the collection.

[JimDavey]

Rutland Tool USA have most of the Taps and Dies - The Taps aren't too expensive but the Dies are. Quantity orders are cheaper. Some of the items aren't listed in the catalogue but are included in their range of Specials.
I have a feeling they don't ship offshore but I have a US delivery address so could do an order if enough people interested.

Take care and Stay Sharp,
Jim

[seanz]

I wonder if there'd be enough interest in a group purchase of plane taps and dies. Some of these odd threads may be available internationally or we could ask Sutton for a price to manufacture them.

I guess we would be looking at small quantities - possibly as little as a dozen of each (maybe they'd just laugh at us ).

Anyone else interested?

Cheers, Vann.

I'm just off to bid on some taps and dies so I bought this thread back up. Suttons would be worth approaching, I'm fairly certain of that
But, maybe not the NZ branch (P&N) as I think they just do drills now. I'll check anyway....I think I know where they are.

[Lappa]

I posted some time ago re an Australian company (Goliath Taps and Dies) that can manufacture the taps for those unusual threads that you can't buy taps for. Eg. admiralty fine 9/32" 24 tpi. Not sure about dies
They can make any thread tap you desire. The cost for the above tap was approx. $76.

[seanz]

Thanks Lappa. I think we were talking more about a group buy sort of thing...even though I've heard those can be very challenging to whoever organizes them.

On the other hand, there is a tap I wouldn't mind getting my hands on, the 1 1/8" 12tpi Whitworth for the Myford spindle nose thread. So, thanks, I might ask Goliath as I'm almost 100% certain that Suttons would not do a one off.