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  1. #1
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    Default Steiner 1859 Handplane

    I picked up this plane in an antiques shop mainly because I was interested in the manner of securing the wedge. It is a "Steiner 1859 original," made in Germany, but not in 1859 which was when the company was founded. My initial research is that the company was wound up in 1991. Because of the condition of the plane I would expect this one to be 1980s onwards, but really have no further information. I do have a question on it, but firstly some pix:

    P1050318 (Medium).JPGP1050325 (Medium).JPGP1050326 (Medium).JPG

    The sole is secured with a wavy cut down the length and what looks like a finger style joint at the ends, although there does not seem to be much difference in the timber either in colour or hardness.

    P1050321 (Medium).JPGP1050322 (Medium).JPG

    The blade is 48mm wide and is marked on the blade and also stamped on the end of the plane.

    Now to the problem: I have been unable to remove the blade. In fact tapping the strike button actually has advanced the blade and tightened it at the same time.

    P1050323 (Medium).JPGP1050320 (Medium).JPG

    So am I doing the wrong thing here? This is the throat and wedge assembly. It does have a chip breaker.

    P1050319 (Medium).JPGP1050328 (Medium).JPG

    Regards
    Paul
    Bushmiller;

    "Power tends to corrupt. Absolute power corrupts, absolutely!"

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  3. #2
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    Default

    Weird. About the only advice I can offer is to first try holding it upside down before wacking the strike; if there's no joy there then try holding it upright but by the wedge only as you hit the strike to see if that little bit of pull helps shift it.

    Could the iron and cap iron assembly be tapered like in the single iron woodies? In that case you could try hitting the iron down into the body which would relieve some of the pressure from the wedge. But only if there's room at the mouth; you don't want to blow the mouth wide open being extra judicious with you choice of tapping instrument.
    Nothing succeeds like a budgie without a beak.

  4. #3
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    Chief

    Thanks for your suggestions. I had tried holding it upside down when hitting the striker to no avail.

    While you were posting I had gone back to the shed to give it another go. The wedge is wider at the top and gives a slight ledge and with a small mallet (the blade adjuster size) I tried hitting it backwards alternating from each side. It worked it free in about a minute or less. Some more pix:

    P1050347 (Medium).JPGP1050348 (Medium).JPG

    I think part of the reason the wedge was difficult to remove is that the rotating abutment is not made of brass as I thought, but plastic and the wedge can be driven in further than would be normal with a more solid restraint. This aspect was a bit disappointing as it was the primary reason for purchasing. Plastic: Ugh!

    The blade and chipbreaker as it came:

    P1050337 (Medium).JPGP1050339 (Medium).JPG

    After a quick clean up:

    P1050345 (Medium).JPGP1050346 (Medium).JPG

    I still have to sharpen the blade

    A nice little touch was the piece of metal on the chipbreaker that locates the blade; Approximately at least.

    P1050349 (Medium).JPG

    Regards
    Paul
    Bushmiller;

    "Power tends to corrupt. Absolute power corrupts, absolutely!"

  5. #4
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    I guess I'd go with what CT said, but another approach I'd try is to whack the top of the plane in front of the throat. I find it takes less force to loosen a blade this way than whacking it on the heel end - not sure why, just an empirical discovery. Some planes do have a strike-button here, but I see yours doesn't. If you use an appropriate mallet, it shouldn't mark the body.

    Does that bridge swivel? If so, it might be biting into the wedge a bit. Try tapping the blade & wedge from side to side a bit to help loosen things up. If nothing works, throw it at the wall a few times. It's unlikely to cause the blade to come out, but it will relieve frustration......

    Cheers,
    IW

  6. #5
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    Problem solved while I was posting.

    How is the bridge retained? Might be easy enough to make & install a brass bridge.

    I agree - plastic! Meh!

    Cheers,
    IW

  7. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by IanW View Post

    Does that bridge swivel? If so, it might be biting into the wedge a bit. Try tapping the blade & wedge from side to side a bit to help loosen things up. If nothing works, throw it at the wall a few times. It's unlikely to cause the blade to come out, but it will relieve frustration......

    Cheers,


    Ian

    I was posting as you were posting and aside from hurling the plane against the wall ( I would have selected the fourth wall, which you may recall has still to be built) I pretty much did as you and the Chief suggested. I did once tap the side of a wood plane (forcefully) when trying to get a blade to release: That was successful and the blade fell out. So that is another technique, but you have to not mind that the plane broke in half.

    Consequently I was a little reluctant to go that path again.

    I have made mention of the plastic bridge (abutment?) thingy, whatever it is called and I wonder how a similar device made of metal (aluminium perhaps?) might perform.

    Regards
    Paul
    Bushmiller;

    "Power tends to corrupt. Absolute power corrupts, absolutely!"

  8. #7
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    PLASTIC?

    UGH!

    I thought it was brass plated steel that had been crudely folded over with sharp edges biting into the wedge; that would cause the symptoms you were describing. I can see now that the underside of the abutment thingy (hey; your term and we all know what you're referring to) is rounded off to avoid that.

    But still.. (shudder) PLASTIC!

    I'm afraid there can be only one recourse here and that is remove the offending item permanently and replace it with brass. There's a chap on the forum who knocks out the occasional hand plane who is fairly competent at turning lumps of brass into very pretty components; if he happens to notice this perhaps he could offer some tips on how to go about this

    As an added bonus; once that piece of German polyputthekettleon has been freed you can hurl it with disdain at your wall(s) of choice.
    Nothing succeeds like a budgie without a beak.

  9. #8
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    Hi Paul,

    am glad you had success with removing the blade, I was not looking forward to
    suggesting, the fire method when removing axe handle stubs from axe heads!!!!

    Graham.

  10. #9
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    I’m sorry
    You mentioned the P word, I’m not contributing,
    Even with my blackened soul, I have standards, an that is even for me, way under the belt.

    Cheers....

  11. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bushmiller View Post
    ....I have made mention of the plastic bridge (abutment?) thingy, whatever it is called and I wonder how a similar device made of metal (aluminium perhaps?) might perform....
    Better. (Surely..)

    I suppose the first task would be to get the offending piece of plastic out. That may not be easy, the axle is probably a tight press-fit in the bridge (I prefer that term rather than 'abutment' for this kind of wedge-holding device, but whether it's a groove cut in the side of the throat, or a cross-pin, or a couple of brass 'commas' or a swivelling bridge, the wedge still has to abutt some part of the device, doesn't it? ).

    You may need to resort to some delicate surgery with a drill bit if the axle refuses to punch out easily. Once it's out, & you can see exactly what you are dealing with, you can decide on the best way to fix your new bridge in. Aluminium would work, I suppose, and is the easiest metal to shape (sometimes!), but to my mind it's only one step up from der plastikenthingen - brass is the metal that goes with plane in my book...

    If it's like I think it is, I'd start with a piece of brass the same thickness as the thickest part of the current bridge, cut it to fit across the throat, then drill & tap two holes for screws. Five mm screws are quite adequate to take the force of the wedge (I've used 4mm for the lever caps on smaller planes), provided it's a neat fit. But it looks to me like the holes in the steel inserts in the sides are larger than that, so you'll need screws that have a cylindrical head to the depth of the sides, then drop down to the appropriate thread size. If the centre part of the bridge is fat enough, you could just use straight 6mm screws. The reason I prefer screws to a through-rivet a la Norris et al is that I almost always find some reason to remove lever caps or bridges at some point after I've installed them - having to undo a couple of screws is a little easier than drilling & punching out a rivet!

    Once you've got your bridge fitting, grab a hacksaw, a selection of files & some W&D paper & shape it to your heart's desire. A cupid-bow is very de rigueur......

    Cheers,
    IW

  12. #11
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    Default

    Ian

    Not quite sure how it is secured. Seems to be hollow though and possibly a roll pin through the middle. I will have to check when home.

    Regards
    Paul
    Bushmiller;

    "Power tends to corrupt. Absolute power corrupts, absolutely!"

  13. #12
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    I was thinking roll-pin maybe, too but I couldn't see any split in it in the side pic. It might be just a tube & an interference fit in the plastic?

    Cheers,
    IW

  14. #13
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    A little more information.

    The pin that held the "thingy" is just a tube and not a roll pin. I was able to drift it out with a suitable size punch. It seems to have been only ever so lightly peened over at each end around a washer.

    P1050353 (Medium).JPGP1050354 (Medium).JPGP1050356 (Medium).JPG

    I think I will have a go at replicating a metal thingy. I absolutely agree with the way brass and wood go together. It is a bit like men and women: Oh, half a tick. that isn't always as compatible as we like to think.

    The reason I suggested aluminium is that I have some chunks of it that I could cut up for this purpose whereas if I were to do this in brass, which I would prefer, I would have to purchase some material. I have been a little extravagant of late so I am on an economy rebound and I have been wondering what I could use the aluminium for.

    As you can see below the block of aluminium is not much smaller than the plane itself and while by no means solid because of the holes, I can easily reclaim sufficient material to make a "thingy."

    P1050357 (Medium).JPGP1050358 (Medium).JPGP1050359 (Medium).JPG

    The main issue will be shaping with a file as Aluminium is problematical in that regard.

    Regards
    Paul
    Bushmiller;

    "Power tends to corrupt. Absolute power corrupts, absolutely!"

  15. #14
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    Hi Paul,

    if you are trying to watch the pennies, try trawling through your local op shops and salvage yards,
    you may come across something suitable!!!

    Graham.

  16. #15
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    Yep, Aluminium is a beast to work with ordinary files, it's a little better with the 'proper' soft-metal files, but you still need to stop & clean the teeth every few strokes. Brass is abut a million times better to file, that's for sure (that's a conservative assessment, of course ).

    I appreciate your conundrum - you need such a little bit (1/2 x 1 1/4 x 2"??), but you'd have to buy a minimum order of 10 times as much from most suppliers, plus postage, & it would cost you more than the plane by a goodly margin. Then you'd have to decide what to do with the rest of it - I can see a slippery slide into metal plane-making coming on....

    I reckon you should go ahead with your plan A, & see how it goes. If, as I suspect, the Al is even worse than the plastic at seizing on the blade, then mac's suggestion of casting about for a bit of brass in any likely spot might turn something up (got any bronze statues in your town?), or next time you drive by Pullenvale, drop in & we'll see if I can find a suitable scrap in my pile of leftovers.

    The place where I get my brass puts the little bits left over from preparing orders for customers on a couple of shelves in the front office & sell them at scrap prices, which is considerably less than what you pay for a requested piece they have to cut for you. It's total pot luck what's on the shelf at any time, but it's always worth a look, I've picked up a couple of lever-cap's worth for less than 10 bucks, for e.g.. You could do a quick detour on your way home from Brisbane next time, & check them out, it's only about 5 minutes each way off the highway....

    Cheers,
    IW

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