Thread: Thankyou

Great job. I like it that you transferred the decorative carving into the new horn. Like the attention to detail.

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MA

Great that these old saws are being resuscitated. Good onya (I'm practicing my Australian).

I was looking for an "X" stamped in the top RH corner. The No.12s all had this and I am assuming the No.112s did too as they were the same saw except with a skewback. I did enlarge the pix but I couldn't see.

Your dating of the saw is correct, as far as it goes, but the medallion (Philada is the key) would put it between 1896 - 1917. However the 112 wasn't introduced until 1901 which narrows the timeline further.

You may be able to blend the horn in with some tinting (a little bit at a time). If you want some apple wood for future handle repairs, try the BBQ section at Bunnings. They have bags of Applewood to "fragrance" your BBQ . It is in small chunks, but large enough for repairs such as yours. I bought a bag, but have not used it yet so I can't answer as to how good it is. Even salvaging pieces from other broken Applewood handles it is difficult to find a matching piece.

Good work with the full length saw vice. You may find a 45 deg bevel on the top edge either side is useful to prevent restricting the file travel and to assist with visibility. If you ever wish to try sloped gullets a bevel will be essential, but it helps with straight across too.

I'm looking forward to many more restorations to come.

Regards
Paul

Originally Posted by Cklett

Great job. I like it that you transferred the decorative carving into the new horn. Like the attention to detail.

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Thanks CK. Just trying blend the new with old . I think the horn looks a little long but I used another handle as a template, and I have seen 1 on Ebay and mine looks very close to those. Maybe the different colour makes it stand out more. It feels right in my hand and it is a tool after all. I could have made a whole new handle but I liked the original carving

Originally Posted by Bushmiller

MA

Great that these old saws are being resuscitated. Good onya (I'm practicing my Australian).

I was looking for an "X" stamped in the top RH corner. The No.12s all had this and I am assuming the No.112s did too as they were the same saw except with a skewback. I did enlarge the pix but I couldn't see.

Your dating of the saw is correct, as far as it goes, but the medallion (Philada is the key) would put it between 1896 - 1917. However the 112 wasn't introduced until 1901 which narrows the timeline further.

You may be able to blend the horn in with some tinting (a little bit at a time). If you want some apple wood for future handle repairs, try the BBQ section at Bunnings. They have bags of Applewood to "fragrance" your BBQ . It is in small chunks, but large enough for repairs such as yours. I bought a bag, but have not used it yet so I can't answer as to how good it is. Even salvaging pieces from other broken Applewood handles it is difficult to find a matching piece.

Good work with the full length saw vice. You may find a 45 deg bevel on the top edge either side is useful to prevent restricting the file travel and to assist with visibility. If you ever wish to try sloped gullets a bevel will be essential, but it helps with straight across too.

I'm looking forward to many more restorations to come.

Regards
Paul

Thanks Paul. I will have to have another look for the X. I did notice on the Disston website that this length of saw (26") and 6tpi was sold as both crosscut and rip early on but by 1918 only as a rip.

Great tip for the apple pieces. I have "milled" a small log of apple (very roughly freehand with my chainsaw) but they won't be ready for some time.

I was suprised how much pink wood was underneath the skin on the original handle, it reminded me a little of the colour of meranti.

How do you recommend getting a bow out of saw blades? Another of the saws I got from Matt is a brass backed J Taylor ans Son Tenon saw with a nice lambs tongue beech handle, split saw nuts and very woofy blade. Maybe you remember it. The brass is straight enough, the edge of the blade under the back is sttaight but the teeth edge is out of whack. Any ideas?

MA

Can you post some pix of the Taylor saw? The back as well as offering rigidity also serves to tension the plate. This is achieved by tapping the back on in a longitudinal direction towards the handle. However, if the blade has been damaged it may need to be hammered, but first I would try sliding the back on again to see if that takes out the bends.

Regards
Paul

I'd follow Paul's suggestion before you do anything else, MA. I've had a couple of saws with wavy blades that responded to re-fitting the back.
Another thing to check when you have the back off is that the gap along the spine looks even. If the back has been altered by someone "fixing 'er up" and has sections that are over-tight, & sections that are loose, that can really mess with the blade. What I've done to fix that problem is to take a piece of saw plate about 50 x 50mm or thereabouts, and tap it along the gap to clean it out & even it up. The brass of a folded back is fairly soft, so it's usually easy to clean out. I aim for a fit that needs tapping on, without having to belt the daylights out of it. That's a good recipe for a wavy blade (damhik)...

Cheers,

Originally Posted by Bushmiller

MA

Can you post some pix of the Taylor saw? The back as well as offering rigidity also serves to tension the plate. This is achieved by tapping the back on in a longitudinal direction towards the handle. However, if the blade has been damaged it may need to be hammered, but first I would try sliding the back on again to see if that takes out the bends.

Regards
Paul

Here are some of the bits

20210108_165447.jpg

This is the view of the top of the blade

20210108_165543.jpg

And this is the view of the toothed bottom of the blade

20210108_165550.jpg

Originally Posted by IanW

I'd follow Paul's suggestion before you do anything else, MA. I've had a couple of saws with wavy blades that responded to re-fitting the back.
Another thing to check when you have the back off is that the gap along the spine looks even. If the back has been altered by someone "fixing 'er up" and has sections that are over-tight, & sections that are loose, that can really mess with the blade. What I've done to fix that problem is to take a piece of saw plate about 50 x 50mm or thereabouts, and tap it along the gap to clean it out & even it up. The brass of a folded back is fairly soft, so it's usually easy to clean out. I aim for a fit that needs tapping on, without having to belt the daylights out of it. That's a good recipe for a wavy blade (damhik)...

Cheers,

Thanks Ian. I will try your idea now I have some spares. I know I should be getting some other saw making happening but I am a little distracted by these saws at the moment! Interesting how little of this saw blade was in the brass back, probably only 6mm or so. Made a real job of taking the split nuts out, I will have to re cut the thread on all 3 bolts, looks like 22 ppi UNC. And I will drill bigger clearance holes before I put it back together

Hmm, I don't think it's a back-fit issue, MA. If that had been the case, the blade should have pretty-much straightened itself when the back was taken off. I'm afraid them is kinks & will need more serious treatment.

You have little to lose, so here's your chance to lean another skill. All you need is a good solid chunk of flat steel for an anvil and a suitable hammer. Paul has a whole arsenal of genuine saw-beating hammers, but I have had moderate success straightening blades about as bad as yours with a planishing hammer. A 24oz ball-pein with a clean, slightly rounded face should work ok too. Lots & lots of firm taps starting on the convex side is the way to go. The technique has been discussed on the forum & elsewhere - I'll have a search later & see what I can find. Unless you go really whacky on it, you are unlikely to make it worse. From my own experience, I'd say the worst that can happen is you won't get it perfectly flat, but you should get it pretty close....

Makes me wonder what some blokes DO to their saws!?

Cheers,

I did a google on straightening saw blades, & as expected, there's a heap of stuff there. Some of it is a bit dubious, but there are a couple I thought worth your while to take a look at. This one is worth a look. Post #6 by George Wilson, who used to work at Colonial Williamsburg as a tool maker is interesting - using boiling water to remove bends sounds a bit weird, but this guy seems to know his stuff, so I've certainly filed the info for future need.

Peter Sellers shows the effect of pinched backs & a very simple way to correct the problem. This is the sort of problem I was burbling about in my first reply. My method of re-fitting the back & tapping it along the blade is a bit more involved than rapping the back on the bench top, but I'm a great advocate of taking the simplest approach to fixing any problem, so I'll be trying this the next time I encounter the problem

For a thorough treatment of hammering a saw, take a look at this one by Bob Smalser. Bob is the 'eminence gris' of hand tools with many years of practical experience to back up what he says.

I think there are a few different roads that will get you to Rome, but somewhere in the above you might find the start of the journey & not get too lost on the way.

Something I forgot to mention is that it's very common to see a small bend in the tooth line of backsaws, directly under the cheeks of the handle. I've seen this to a greater or lesser extent on about 2 out of 10 (probably more) of the factory-made back saws I've worked on. The cause is a slight curve in the blade slot so that when the bolts are tightened, it curves the plate slightly.

I first encountered this making my own handles - it's easy to introduce a slight twist in the blade slot unless you are extremely careful when sawing it. You need a saw that is tracking perfectly true and watch the scribe lines the whole way. I also switch the handle round a couple of times & saw from the opposite side to help cancel out any bias. If a slight twist does happen, you won't notice in when cutting the spine slot & 'dry' fitting the blade & back, you only discover it when you do the final assembly of the saw. My remedy is to use a saw as thick as the slot and with no set, to straighten it. I've made several small "knife" saws for rounding out the back of handle slots, & these are also handy for straightening the rest of the slot as well. (These cut on the pull stroke, btw, which is advisable on a no-set saw). I work the saw gently down the slot, applying no pressure at all, just allowing the saw to find its own way. The un-set saw will naturally want to go straight & planes off the high spots. This will usually fix the problem nicely unless the slot is severely twisted.

Having said all that, the twist in the blade at that point is usually of no consequence whatever; you never use that part in normal sawing. Most people live with it & never notice....

Cheers,

M.A ,
Only just found this thread this morning,
Well done on the saws,
You really are truly stuck down the Rabbit hole now.

Cheers Matt.

Originally Posted by Simplicity

M.A ,
Only just found this thread this morning,
Well done on the saws,
You really are truly stuck down the Rabbit hole now.

Cheers Matt.

And we know one of the people who are to blame......... . Thanks again

Originally Posted by Mountain Ash

And we know one of the people who are to blame......... . Thanks again

It was Matt.



Regards
Paul

Originally Posted by Mountain Ash

And we know one of the people who are to blame......... . Thanks again

Look just because Paul an my self are of the lower class form, with zero morals.

An would find it difficult getting respect at Zombie reunion.

An Satin him self finds us disgusting.

There’s no need to play the Blame game.

Cheers Matt.