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  1. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rudyvm View Post
    Hi All, came across this old thread, am currently looking at a Hammer/Minimax/Robland combination machine and was wondering if any out there could give me the benefit of their more recent experience with these units. They all come with a spiral option and whilst am conscious of price am thinking long term so do want a unit that will suit my longer term needs. The Robland seems the best option but is also the most expensive by some distance. Will be most using to make benchtops and tables from recycled Australian hardwoods so the ability to rip and thickness lengths of up to around 2400mm effectively is my main priority.

    Would appreciate any thoughts on the above.'

    Cheers,

    Rudy

    hey mate, more recently than what i have commented on above, ive obtained a few quotes for both a C3 41 (same as C3 31 but a 410 planner) and a Minimax lab 300p and CU300C26X. As much as i like the Hammer combo due to having bias of previously owning one its significantly more expensive than i expected.

    for transparency ill add some numbers below without getting fully into specific configuration options

    Minimax LAB300P $14,200.00+ GST Del and installed

    Minimax CU300C26 $17,500.00 + GST Del and Installed


    Hammer platform C3-41 $28k with silent power helical head 410 plane. the platform is similar to the Cu300C26X in that it has the slider table and outfeed support to handle large sheets.

    Im leaning towards the Minimax due to price. the Robland i did have a brochure sent through but cannot remember nor can i find a price unfortunately.

    Since owning a combination machine in general im a very big fan of them, theyre primarily more popular in europe apparently where space is more limited. Even though our land/workshops may be larger i just really enjoyed the workflow it gets you into from a productivity perspective how you can simply roll it around and rotate it to save space in your workshop for other important items

    Keen to hear your considerations and hope the above helps.

    Cheers,
    Nathan

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  3. #32
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    Thanks Nathan, really appreciate the response.

    Am also waiting for prices for the Hammer, MiniMax, and Robland and will let you know how I go.

    Do have a question which as an experienced user am hoping you can help me with, the biggest issue I have at the moment is planing, thicknessing, and ripping reasonable long lengths of recycled planks...anything up to around 2600mm...how do you think the kind of machines we are looking at will be able to handle this ?.

    Thanks in advance.

    Rudy

  4. #33
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    Rudy, those lengths aren’t too challenging for most machines. Look for a machine that has optional extension tables that mount to the machine chassis. I know that Felder + Hammer have those. You can certainly make your own extensions if you opt for a brand which does not offer them.

    I have had combo machines off and on (off when I have abandoned woodworking for good, on when I snapped out of it). The only disadvantage to a combo is sharing a spindle moulder- a machine that I have come to love. I now have a stand-alone moulder to remove that frustration.

    One thing that people often overlook about combos is the quality of build is often better than you would get for the same money on separates. The panel saw alone is safer than a cabinet saw given proper methods of work, and the spindle moulder with power feed produces much better results than a router table.

    One thing I would not buy in a combo is a mortise attachment. They get in the way, they bust your knees, they are disc-rupturing heavy and they aren’t as good as a Domino XL.
    It's all part of the service here at The House of Pain™

  5. #34
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    Thanks for the response Greg, appreciate it very much, am narrowing things down, both Robland and Hammer have an extension option so am leaning in that direction but am also considering a Minimax which does come in a bit cheaper, they are all made in Europe and was wondering if you or anyone else could advise on quality and reliability.

    Did some Utubing so can see why the mortise would be a bother so won't go down that path.

    Cheers,

    Rudy

  6. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rudyvm View Post
    Thanks Nathan, really appreciate the response.

    Am also waiting for prices for the Hammer, MiniMax, and Robland and will let you know how I go.

    Do have a question which as an experienced user am hoping you can help me with, the biggest issue I have at the moment is planing, thicknessing, and ripping reasonable long lengths of recycled planks...anything up to around 2600mm...how do you think the kind of machines we are looking at will be able to handle this ?.

    Thanks in advance.

    Rudy
    Sorry mate I missed this. Yeah they usually have solid cast iron tables that could handle this and that was on my older c3 31 with a ‘GRRipper’ push blocks along the way worked a treat. I’d have to compare the table sizes again for the length but I’d be surprised if they couldn’t handle these sizes. Just make sure you get a helical head

    Cheers
    Nathan

  7. #36
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    For me I would be more concerned at back up service and warranty and in this area Hammer/Felder are streets ahead of the others. I think MM is most probably better value for money but Felder have excellent after sales service.
    CHRIS

  8. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chris Parks View Post
    For me I would be more concerned at back up service and warranty and in this area Hammer/Felder are streets ahead of the others. I think MM is most probably better value for money but Felder have excellent after sales service.
    And their pre sales team is very active cold callers chasing those old owners for new machines

  9. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by delbs View Post
    And their pre sales team is very active cold callers chasing those old owners for new machines
    That is something I have not experienced.
    CHRIS

  10. #39
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    Thanks Nathan, helical head for me is a no brainer....upgraded my current Dewalt to a Shelix and was pretty impressed with the results but is now time to go next level !.

    Cheers,

    Rudy

  11. #40
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    Thanks Chris, is exactly why I have requested advice from the collective wisdom of this group, is a pretty big spend and all of the machines are similarly specified, the companies all have a pretty small footprint in Australia so back up is a concern, having said that Felder have been the least responsive in getting back to me with info and pricing so am a bit at sea with respect to which direction to go....the Minimax rep was very responsive but I suppose it depends on the person you are dealing with and the day of the week. Must say is all doing my head in a bit...may need to take up knitting as an alternative !.

    Cheers,

    Rudy

  12. #41
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    I just want them to call me....

  13. #42
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    If you have any problems with Felder I would call and ask for Stefan the boss to work out why.
    CHRIS

  14. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rudyvm View Post
    I just want them to call me....
    Ah so I should have mentioned. Not Stefan but his offsider called me and followed up a couple times to confirm details etc but then went quiet. I asked him where the quote went because even though I’m not going to act on it at the moment I was curious as to the specifics. He came back saying he had covid and was operating from home so expect the quote over the coming days. It came in eventually but he may still be sick or a few of them effected.

    Cheers
    Nathan

  15. #44
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    Rudy I can’t speak to the other brands since I have ever only owned Felder machines. But I bought all three used. When I was first looking about 20 ish years ago I was ready to buy the MM since I couldn’t see the price delta being reasonable. At that time Robland had a pretty bad name, but that was before the current generation of machines.

    I have never run anything other than straight knife planer/thicknessers and I am not in a rush to change my existing machines. If I was going to buy a new build machine today I would opt for Tersa heads. The idea that you can just rotate square carbide cutters when dull ignores the reality that you have to remove them, clean the insert and the seat thoroughly, then re-install and torque correctly. Its about an hour if you care about good results. It takes me about 10 minutes* to swap out my Felder knives…maybe 15 on my other machine. HSS honed to 8000 is miles sharper than the sharpest carbide. That’s not always the answer though on local timber as you no doubt know. Carbide inserts are also very quiet compared to conventional knives.

    *10 minutes because I do it so infrequently that I have to relearn how.

    Anyway….Extension tables: Felder has a system called the F rail which allows quick attachment of extension tables, both with and without support legs. I have both factory and shop made- an easy chore. I have them on my bandsaw and router table to allow both Felder and shop made extensions to be rapidly clipped on. I made some 1.5 metre extensions from locally sourced extrusions which adorn my spindle moulder.

    I can provide drawings (napkin grade) of how to make them when you are ready. The best kind of extrusion is approx $200/ metre, so your value proposition may lean more to the factory option if such is available.

    One thing not to waste your money on is a short cross cut fence. Just stick with the standard fence and outrigger. Get digital stops if you can. I don’t, but I read nothing but good things about them****

    ****Reading good things: Some of these Euro machines are in the hands of very comfortable people…people who think nothing of dropping thousands to get options that they will never use. The forums are full of them. I always feel like a poor church mouse when reading of their shops. Its pretty easy to get dragged down the rabbit hole of thinking you NEED the power this and the digi that, but a vanilla Euro combo will be more machine than the average woodworker will ever outgrow.
    It's all part of the service here at The House of Pain™

  16. #45
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    It only takes a read of the Felder Owners Group to see how some owners spend money and think nothing of it, there are hobbyist WW's out there buying Format 4 machines which are the most expensive end of Felder's range. As for the head, Tersa v's Silent Power, the extra time taken to change or rotate the the segments can be looked at by saying that they most probably only need rotating every four years or even longer and I debated over it for many weeks before I made the decision. Professional machinists mostly stick with the Tersa saying it gives a better finish but for me the Silent Power is adequate.
    CHRIS

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