Thread: Are all Chinese made table saws rubbish ie SB-12

What you are paying for with Jet (and Grizzly or General if they were available here) is the cost of having a company representative at the factory every day checking what is being produced & that no testing is being bypassed.

Unfortunately, with local importers of machinery, is that no one can afford to have a staff member sitting in China or Taiwan doing the checking at the factory, they just have to pick a manufacturer who seems reliable, then hope that they don't end up with a container load of bricks or the equivalent.

What we get landing Australia is a mix of good and bad - if someone has a bad day at the factory & there are too many rejects, then the least important customers get the rejects thrown in to make up the numbers. The recommendation over the years seems to be - go to the show room, check the quality of what is being offered, if the floor stock is satisfactory ask to have the floor item delivered rather than something still in a box that has not been checked. Quite a number of people have reported that what has come out of the box could have never worked due to missing or grossly misaligned parts.

And don't take s%^t from the staff - if what arrives is unsatisfactory, demand a full refund. If they try to dodge, ask to see/speak to the manager, repeat, point out that goods must be suitable for use, then its off to Comsumer Affairs or whatever its called in your state. The ACCC has just ripped a number of Harvey Norman franchisees a new one for trying to fob off customers with defective electricals.

And no, I'm not picking on a particular dealers, H&F, Carbatec & others are all in the same boat as far as imports go, and all have had employees who seem to think it is their job to put one over the small buyers - they usually don't last when the owner finds out, and owners who don't care soon find they are out on the street soon enough.

After all that, for some jobs quite a few people have found the 'bench top' saws from Bosch and their competitors to be satisfactory - the ones designed for the European market have propper rise-and-fall riving knives, the fences lock up solidly & they have reasonable dust collection. Most won't take a dado blade, but some have an optional router fitting so you can use the fence with a router. They do have a small top, but there are several sets of plans out there on how to build a work station around one which includes storage, router, dust collection & a much larger work to.

My Jet table saw was made in China and I am very happy with it (bought it about 18 months ago)

My first table saw was similar to what you're looking at. When the motor blew after about two years of weekend use I replaced it with a local one and it was fine. I noted the place which sold me the replacement motor had all Chinese equipment in their workshop. Their response was that Chinese machinery tended to be just as good as any, except for the motor, which was easy to replace if and when it blew.

So as others have said inspect, buy a working floor model rather than a boxed one where possible, and beware that electrics tend to be the weak spot.
Note that purchase was 6 years ago and times change. Also every generalization is false, including this one.

Thanks guys for our feedback...I think it's like anything quality changes over time and becomes more consistent. Making things in China is costing more every year with salaries going up 10-20% annually (im in HR)..so places like Vietnam is becoming more attractive. Who would have looked at a Skoda 10 years ago...if you look at one now you will be blown away with the quality.

Advice taken...check floor stock and do a deal for that one. H&F SB-12 seems great value for money lots of features, powerful motor and not another 12' saw close in the price bracket. I'll let you know about quality over the coming months.

Kev

Originally Posted by aussie280

Thanks guys for our feedback...I think it's like anything quality changes over time and becomes more consistent. Making things in China is costing more every year with salaries going up 10-20% annually (im in HR)..so places like Vietnam is becoming more attractive. Who would have looked at a Skoda 10 years ago...if you look at one now you will be blown away with the quality.

Advice taken...check floor stock and do a deal for that one. H&F SB-12 seems great value for money lots of features, powerful motor and not another 12' saw close in the price bracket. I'll let you know about quality over the coming months.

Kev

Hi Guys,

So after spending a day driving from place to place across Melbourne I can finally comment on the Chinese made saws. I viewed the H&F SB-12, in fact I looked at all their table saws. All had Aluminium fences with the same used for the rails...this was no good. Too much flex. Certainly this was an area where they have saved in construction costs. In addition the SB-12 side support tables had the holes cut out (its a contractors saw) but they were not solid and didn't seem to have the strong supporting material on the underside. This was my own realisation that a solid table top is better than one with holes cut out. I then looked over the frame of the saw. The legs were only 2 sides of a box tube and tapered to the bottom of the feet. To me this is too unstable. The final straw was when the sales guy turned the saw on. It made a clanking sound and he said it was the motor belt out of alignment. This display model had been in the shop for 2 years and either noone had switched it on, they can't fix the noise or can't be bothered. The side tables were out of alignment too. These are setup issues and reflect more on the care and attention of the H&F staff, remember the saw has been on the shop floor for 2 years. It's like looking to buy a car and the window winder falls off in your hand...an easy fix but it shouldn't have fallen off.

Conclusion

For me, 800-1000 will only get you a chinese made saw. If you can overcome the faults of above by modifying the saw then go for it. But not me. I have just sold my Triton gear and want to step up in the quality stakes. In fact I'd rather have the Triton over these saws anyday.

Although I didn't buy a table saw today I now understand what's important in a saw for me. I will be saving my pennies for the March sales and get a decent saw. I was blown away with the quality of the Jet saws, the fit, the finish and thought that went into their design. These machines are a good entry level point for a good saw that you are likely to keep for 10-20 years. Steel fences, strong legs / cabinets etc. I'm sure there are other good brands out there and some better than the Jet but stay away from table saws with narrow legs, and aluminium fences.

I hope this helps other "square heads" looking for saws.

I have no grudge with H&F, the staff were plesant and I'd buy from them no problems but when it comes to the low end table saws make sure you know what you are looking at to make an informed decision.

H&F staff if you read this post, please guys make sure you setup your floor stock so you can lead with your best foot forward. If everything on your saw was spot on I could have easily have bought one without thinking too hard. The fact that this and that wasn't right got me thinking harder on my decision and you lost the sale.

Regards

Kev

The next step up saws $1000-2000 have some issues as well. Not having access to floor stock is a real issue even in major provincial centres like Townsville & even less now with Jet Toolshop showroom closed & Glenfords gone etc.

I looked & looked and finally settled on a Woodfast TS250 (now $1500-1700) a few years back. It suits my needs very well however I reckon it would be a far better saw if it had a table slot on the cast iron table, a closer tolerance fit of the sliding table to cast iron table and provision for quick removal/replacement of the saw guard. All extra cost to manufacture though. To take the guard & riving knife support off means removing the sliding table, two panels, plus fiddling with the mounting fixtures in a tight area without dropping anything into the dust chute & removing the blade if you want to make it a little easier. Then you have no riving knife & fitting an after market or hone made one becomes a nightmare because the riving knife is fixed & doesn't rise & fall with the blade! I know not a good idea removing the guard & riving knife but some operations can only be done without the guard in place & making it a hassle means people leave it off! I had a few minor missalignment issues when I set it up but generally the quality is very good. Overall I'm very happy with it - the saws with the features I mentioned are another step up again. We can dream of a Hammer C31 or the like, not much chance of santa leaving one though!

I brought one of these from Get Woodworking in Williamstown. They have a 2hp motor which will run off a 10 amp outlet, whereas the H&F saw is 3hp and requires a 15 amp outlet.
The build quality is quite satisfactory with solid cast iron wings, and everything is able to be aligned correctly. The riving knife is a bit of a pain to line up, but a little mod to it makes re-aligning easier. It rises and falls with the blade along with the guard. The motor is fully enclosed inside the cabinet, so dust extraction is more effective than saws which have the motor hanging out the back leaving a large air gap in the cabinet. The fence is steel with aluminum faces, and locks in place very well on the steel rail. Parallel alignment to the blade is easily adjusted. It is a very solid saw, and the only thing that lets it down is the fact that it only has one bolt through each joint in the legs. This allows the whole leg structure to move about if you push on the saw. I fixed this on mine by drilling an extra hole in each face where the legs are attached to the cabinet, and putting bolts in these. Now it is solid as a rock.
All in all, I think these are reasonable value for money, and around your price range. You pay a little more than the price advertised on the Major site, due to transport costs to Melbourne, but I think it was only about $50.
I too started with a Triton which I had for years, but once you get a table saw, there's no going back.

That saw comes in various incarnations.....I have the same unit but in an enclosed cabinet style. It is Tiawanese built. My review here if interested: https://www.woodworkforums.com/f171/s...et-saw-148542/

Cheers

Originally Posted by Treecycle

I brought one of these from Get Woodworking in Williamstown. They have a 2hp motor which will run off a 10 amp outlet, whereas the H&F saw is 3hp and requires a 15 amp outlet.
The build quality is quite satisfactory with solid cast iron wings, and everything is able to be aligned correctly. The riving knife is a bit of a pain to line up, but a little mod to it makes re-aligning easier. It rises and falls with the blade along with the guard. The motor is fully enclosed inside the cabinet, so dust extraction is more effective than saws which have the motor hanging out the back leaving a large air gap in the cabinet. The fence is steel with aluminum faces, and locks in place very well on the steel rail. Parallel alignment to the blade is easily adjusted. It is a very solid saw, and the only thing that lets it down is the fact that it only has one bolt through each joint in the legs. This allows the whole leg structure to move about if you push on the saw. I fixed this on mine by drilling an extra hole in each face where the legs are attached to the cabinet, and putting bolts in these. Now it is solid as a rock.
All in all, I think these are reasonable value for money, and around your price range. You pay a little more than the price advertised on the Major site, due to transport costs to Melbourne, but I think it was only about $50.
I too started with a Triton which I had for years, but once you get a table saw, there's no going back.

Originally Posted by simops

That saw comes in various incarnations.....I have the same unit but in an enclosed cabinet style. It is Tiawanese built. My review here if interested: https://www.woodworkforums.com/f171/s...et-saw-148542/

Cheers

Do you guys know whether this model has dado capabilities and to what min/max width?

Many thanks.

Originally Posted by metester

Do you guys know whether this model has dado capabilities and to what min/max width?

Many thanks.

Yes it does (well my version does). I use a CMT 8" dado out to 3/4" no problem. Had to make a new zero clearance throat plate to accommodate the Dado.

cheers

That's a huge plus for this model. Many in the price range do not. Thanks.

Originally Posted by Treecycle

I brought one of these from Get Woodworking in Williamstown. They have a 2hp motor which will run off a 10 amp outlet, whereas the H&F saw is 3hp and requires a 15 amp outlet.
The build quality is quite satisfactory with solid cast iron wings, and everything is able to be aligned correctly. The riving knife is a bit of a pain to line up, but a little mod to it makes re-aligning easier. It rises and falls with the blade along with the guard. The motor is fully enclosed inside the cabinet, so dust extraction is more effective than saws which have the motor hanging out the back leaving a large air gap in the cabinet. The fence is steel with aluminum faces, and locks in place very well on the steel rail. Parallel alignment to the blade is easily adjusted. It is a very solid saw, and the only thing that lets it down is the fact that it only has one bolt through each joint in the legs. This allows the whole leg structure to move about if you push on the saw. I fixed this on mine by drilling an extra hole in each face where the legs are attached to the cabinet, and putting bolts in these. Now it is solid as a rock.
All in all, I think these are reasonable value for money, and around your price range. You pay a little more than the price advertised on the Major site, due to transport costs to Melbourne, but I think it was only about $50.
I too started with a Triton which I had for years, but once you get a table saw, there's no going back.

I am pretty close to buying either the same model as yours, Treecycle, or the cabinet version. Could you or anyone else comment on how it goes for vibration? Do you get much coming through the tabletop and/or blade? I have been told it is always best to go for the most solid, heavy table to keep any movement and vibration to a minimum. Also, do you know if the 4" dust collection outlet is the same as the cabinet version ie., the outlet is part of a rectangular panel that screws into the cabinet housing the motor.

Vibration is almost non existent. It is a pleasure to turn this saw on as it is very quiet and vibration super low.
The dust port I am not sure about. I looked at the cabinet version on the Major site and I could not see any photo angles of the port coming out. The open stand version has the rectangular plate in the base of the square cabinet with the port in the middle pointing down towards the floor. I wasn't sure if your description was referring to the open stand or the cabinet version, so I have described mine.
The other thing I did with mine was replace the original throat plate with a homemade zero clearance one. The original has a massive gap down the side of the blade which is very dangerous if you are cutting small items.

Originally Posted by Treecycle

Vibration is almost non existent. It is a pleasure to turn this saw on as it is very quiet and vibration super low.
The dust port I am not sure about. I looked at the cabinet version on the Major site and I could not see any photo angles of the port coming out. The open stand version has the rectangular plate in the base of the square cabinet with the port in the middle pointing down towards the floor. I wasn't sure if your description was referring to the open stand or the cabinet version, so I have described mine.
The other thing I did with mine was replace the original throat plate with a homemade zero clearance one. The original has a massive gap down the side of the blade which is very dangerous if you are cutting small items.

Thanks for your prompt reply. It sounds like a great saw for the price. I was describing the cabinet version which has the port on the side. It was neat because you could replace it with a wider mouth to catch even more dust. It's more of a bonus rather than being essential. The zero clearance inserts are a great idea. I also like how they minimise tearout. The salesman I spoke to recommended I make several at the same time including a few blanks, some at varying angles eg. 45 degrees, and some at different blade heights etc. It was a good tip I thought. I also like the idea that it does not require a 15A power supply. It's a compromise on table saw power yet I am not super keen to run a dedicated circuit to the workshop.

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