Thread: MWE-MBS300 or Hafco ST-12D ?

For those who are interested, I rang up the friendly people at H&F, and asked if they knew where the ST-12D was made - the sales guy said he would find out and call me back, and sure enough, about half an hour later he called and said they were made by D-way.

So I looked up the web site, and D-way is the trading name for Mikiway, who make the MBS-300..

It's a strange old world we live in....

Hi Pete,
The ST12D does have O/H guard opt. on H/F web site. I'm looking at exactly the same machines with the sliding table & overhead guard options. MBS300 = $3489 & ST12D = $2929. A difference of $560.
Is the MBS300 worth the extra $560 or should I go with ST12D and use the extra money to get a dusty (1490cfm with pleated cartridge $550)?

PS. just noticed that the price on H/F website for the ST12D has gone back up to $1750 from $1595. What price have you got?
Cheers,
Paul

It's important to note that "same factory" does not necessarily mean same components. The machines can have the same specs, but be built to different tolerances.

At the end of the day, it's your money, and the difference is enough to make you stop and think. What are the odds the whole difference is markup?

Originally Posted by switt775

It's important to note that "same factory" does not necessarily mean same components. The machines can have the same specs, but be built to different tolerances.

Hi Switt775,
I guess that is the real problem here, I have no way of working this out. I have physically inspected both saws, and the build quality looks the same to me. WHen I rang H&F they said they had over 10 of these on the factory floor out the back, so it may be cheaper due to mass purchase...

Originally Posted by snapman007

Hi Pete,
PS. just noticed that the price on H/F website for the ST12D has gone back up to $1750 from $1595. What price have you got?
Cheers,
Paul

Hi Paul,
I wish I knew the answer to your question, but I don't know if anyone else on the forum has bought a ST-12D, so we can't compare them in the real world.

I get $1750 from H&F as well (I was in the show room on Monday), but now I am really worried, how can the same saw sell for such a huge difference in price ? Either we are being ripped off or there is a substantial difference in the quality of the materials/workmanship.

The saws looked identical though....

Without someone on the inside willing to tell the truth, it's really hard to tell.

Can you make a direct comparison (feature-wise) to other brands? Which saw reflects the normal market price for this level of specs, or can you tell?

H&F seems to be a bit of a price leader, but I've not used enough of their products to have a strong opinion - whether they are selling at a lower margin, or selling lower spec'ed goods which look the same, but have cheaper motors / bearings / etc.

Just because 2 motors both say "3HP" doesn't mean they are the same quality, or draw the same power on start-up, or even have the same (real-world) power output.

Maybe someone out there with more long term experience with H&F machinery can offer an opinion.

just to throw the cat amongst the pigeons have look at this thread as well
https://www.woodworkforums.com/f171/mj2325ds-carba-tec-10-cabinet-sliding-table-76282

Hi Switt775,
Most of the MB300's go for around the $2400 mark....(Ledacraft, Major woodworking,etc)

I don't know if H&F is a bargain or inferior goods !

Hi Smeds, I had a look at this one at Carbatech the other day, different fence and a much lighter build, it's in a different class I'm afraid.

Went and had a look at both of em today, I noticed a couple small differences in the sliding table. Inside the cabinet I couldn't tell a difference but I am very new to all this. The cheaper H/F comes with a mobile base and a saw blade included. If you want a mobile base for the Carbatec you will need to add another $100 to the price. Unless i get advice otherwise from someone here, I think i will go with who will give me the best deal but me thinks it's gonna be H/F for the machinery & Carbatec for all the other goodies.

Let us know how you go Snapman, do you have a dial gauge ? I was reading a post from Big Shed, and he seemed very happy with a TS-10L from carbatech, at around $2200.

Pete,
The TS10L is a 10" saw whereas the other 2 we've been looking at are 12".
Good saw though, shame it doesn't have a sliding table.

HI Snapman007,
True it's only a ten inch, but the tolerances seem to be really good. This is not an easy decision for me......

just got off the ph with Carbatec. They've offered a pretty good deal for all the goodies I want. $5,335RRP down to $4,500, only catch is there estimating delivery of some items at end of November and I need all the items at the same time. At this stage they don't have a confirmed shipping date from O/S yet so could be later. What to do? Carbatec seem to have a greater range for woodwork so would prefer to go with them but the wait might kill me.