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  1. #1
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    Default Sawstop Feedback

    Ok i may be way behind the curve on this, but I was altogether unaware of Sawstop as a brand and as a safety design. Now that they have come to Australia via Carbatec I'm sold and will be buying one tomorrow. I live in fear of my tablesaw and the peace of mind is worth it, not to mention my fingers.

    For those who are like me and aren't aware of this, I won't elaborate on the design, but it basically stops the blade if you touch it. This is the sentence that sold me (I'm paraphrasing): In ten years and 70,000+ saws sold worldwide, they have NEVER had a reported digit loss incident. Never. No one has ever cut their finger off on a Sawstop table saw. Please correct me if I'm wrong on this.

    So I was looking for any kind of feedback about these saws. Good, bad, whatever. Anyone ever accidentally engaged the brake? Anyone ever had a brake misfire? Does anyone even own one in Australia?

    Thanks in advance,
    Luke

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  3. #2
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    Default

    Luke
    Stuart Lees from Stus shed owns one and has a few videos and reviews of them on his web site www.stusshed.com

    Andy

  4. #3
    FenceFurniture's Avatar
    FenceFurniture is offline The prize lies beneath - hidden in full view
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    Fletty saw one go for $500 (no missing zero) at an auction a few months ago in Sydney. Ah, new, unused, still in crate.

    Just thought I'd break yer heart there a little bit Luke.

    Seriously though, I'm a little tired of the sausage demonstration. I think it's about time they put their belief behind the demo and used human sausage.
    Regards, FenceFurniture

    COLT DRILLS GROUP BUY
    Jan-Feb 2019 Click to send me an email

  5. #4
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    Luke, the woodclub, I'm a member of, brought one of the Cabinet Saws, in the middle of last year from Gabbett's Machinery. Solid unit, but with the mobility kit, reasonably easy to move around. We still teach proper use of a table saw to all members, as the Sawstop is not idiot proof. Keep all body parts away from the red area of the Zero clearance insert, use of push sticks and having a second person to tail out.

    We have had one discharge and everyone heard it. Fortunately not because of human contact. Watch Stuart Lee's vids to see how violent the discharge is.

    If I had the readies, yes I'd buy one, but now I just wait to Saturday morning, if I have any timber requiring a Table saw treatment.
    Pat
    Work is a necessary evil to be avoided. Mark Twain

  6. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pat View Post

    We have had one discharge and everyone heard it. Fortunately not because of human contact. Watch Stuart Lee's vids to see how violent the discharge is.

    do you know why it discharged? i would be concerned about having to replace a sawblade and sawstop cartridge just because the timber was high in moisture, or actually wet from being out in the rain.

    a real finger put into the blade. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eiYoBbEZwlk i wanna see him do it with real commitment and shove his hand in with real momentum...but that probably will end up in a mess.

  7. #6
    I_wanna_Shed's Avatar
    I_wanna_Shed is offline Now I've got a 6x7m shed! I need a new name...
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    Quote Originally Posted by FenceFurniture View Post
    Fletty saw one go for $500 (no missing zero) at an auction a few months ago in Sydney. Ah, new, unused, still in crate.

    Just thought I'd break yer heart there a little bit Luke.

    Seriously though, I'm a little tired of the sausage demonstration. I think it's about time they put their belief behind the demo and used human sausage.
    Wow, five hundred. Was it a 3 phase?

    There is a video somewhere of the inventor putting his finger into one.

  8. #7
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    Disregarding the hype around the safety aspect of the Saw Stop units, they are very nicely built to a high standard, easily the equal of any other new US branded saw I have had the opportunity to examine - Euro saws I find too limited in blades & accessories and too much aluminium in their construction.

    Apart from the safety doodads, they appear to take any accessories made for standard table saws like measuring scales, tennoning jigs and such. It uses a standard 16mm/ 5/8" arbour so saw blades - including dado sets - are readily available.

  9. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by FenceFurniture View Post
    Seriously though, I'm a little tired of the sausage demonstration. I think it's about time they put their belief behind the demo and used human sausage.
    Just google Sawstop. The top video hit is the owner of the company putting his finger into it.

  10. #9
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    Kuffy, i don't know the reason for discharge, but it was not wet wood and Sawstop did not charge us for the new cartridge. Gabbett's sent the discharged cartridge to Sawstop US for diagnostics.

    There is a manual override for wet or green timber, using a key lock system. Within the club, the key is not readily available.

    One thing we have been strict with is the use of guards, something a few of the older members have had to come to terms with.
    Pat
    Work is a necessary evil to be avoided. Mark Twain

  11. #10
    FenceFurniture's Avatar
    FenceFurniture is offline The prize lies beneath - hidden in full view
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    Quote Originally Posted by I_wanna_Shed View Post
    Wow, five hundred. Was it a 3 phase?
    I think it might have been Nathan.
    Regards, FenceFurniture

    COLT DRILLS GROUP BUY
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  12. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Luke Maddux View Post
    Ok i may be way behind the curve on this, but I was altogether unaware of Sawstop as a brand and as a safety design. Now that they have come to Australia via Carbatec I'm sold and will be buying one tomorrow. I live in fear of my tablesaw and the peace of mind is worth it, not to mention my fingers.

    For those who are like me and aren't aware of this, I won't elaborate on the design, but it basically stops the blade if you touch it. This is the sentence that sold me (I'm paraphrasing): In ten years and 70,000+ saws sold worldwide, they have NEVER had a reported digit loss incident. Never. No one has ever cut their finger off on a Sawstop table saw. Please correct me if I'm wrong on this.

    So I was looking for any kind of feedback about these saws. Good, bad, whatever. Anyone ever accidentally engaged the brake? Anyone ever had a brake misfire? Does anyone even own one in Australia?

    Thanks in advance,
    Luke
    Luke,

    One thing that many people don't realise with the Sawstop is that you'll need a second type of Brake Cartridge if you use a Dado Blade, so if you plan to use a Dado blade factor in the cost of the additional brake cartridge ($139 at Carbatec).

    I bought some old hand tools from a Woodworker in Toowoomba early this year, and when I visited to take delivery of the tools, I noticed that he had a Sawstop in his workshop. We talked a bit about the machine, and generally he seemed to be happy. He said that changing the Brake Cartridge over whenever you switch from an ordinary saw blade to a dado stack, and vice versa, was a fiddly exercise, and at that time je was still had not got the hang of changing brake units easily. His main beef with the machine was with the Rip Fence, which he thought was not rigid enough when locked down. Personally, I couldn't see anything wrong with the RIP fence - possibly just needed the fence locking lever to be adjusted.

    Personally Luke - I think you'll be quite happy with your Sawstop. As far as I can see, it is a pretty good saw for the money, even without the safety feature.

    Out of interest, Bosch have recently released their own version of safety saw that stops in contact with flesh. There's a few videos on Youtube about the unit. Apparently, Bosch have managed to do this without infringing Sawstop's patents (or at least Sawstop have yet to take Bosch to court). And, when the brake is activated on the Bosch saw, it apparently does not damage the blade. Additionally, the Bosch brake cartridge is a "2 Shot" cartridge, meaning that each cartridge can be used twice before it has to be replaced.

    The link below to the Youtube video demonstrates the saw in action, and demonstrates the process for getting the saw going again after a brake activation. Presently, Bosch only have a Job Site style saw with this feature included, but I've seen a Press Release from Bosch UK where they say that they expect to bring out larger table saws with the safety feature soon. The same press release also mentioned that Bosch was developing a Handheld Circular Saw with a similar safety feature..... (I'm still trying to re-find the web site where I originally found the Bosch UK press release, but can't find it so far. I'll post the link when/if I find it.)

    This link takes you to an article about the Bosch Safety Saw.

    This link takes you to a Youtube video about the Bosch Safety Saw.

    That's all,

    RoyG
    Manufacturer of the Finest Quality Off-Cuts.

  13. #12
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    Oct 2004
    Location
    Melbourne, Australia.
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    My Menís Shed has the Sawstop Contractorís saw with the outrigger pressed metal tops replaced with cast iron, plus we have the extended table to the right and the easy moving wheels thingy.

    We donít have the out feed extension, but one of the members built one from a bit of scrap, a worthwhile addition.

    We also donít have the optional overhead dust collection, which I think we should now get. It wasnít an option in Australia when we bought our unit.

    We purchased a Dado blade set for a job we had, works well once set up. If you do purchase a dado set, you will require another blade brake specifically for the dado set. I donít know what that costs, but my bet is it wouldnít be cheap. The difference is that the standard brake bit, isnít wide enough for the dado set. The dado set brake thingy is very wide to accommodate the full width of the dado blade system, plus itís a different size as the dado blades are 200mm while the standard blade is 250mm. The Sawstop brake has to run very close to the blade(s) to be as effective/quick and whatever else is required.

    We have had the Sawstop mechanism fire in anger, certainly saved a bit of skin, maybe a finger I donít know, I wasnít there when it happened.

    Pricey unit, reasonably well built. Dust extraction underneath the tabletop could be better, but better than nothing. Ours is wired into a dust system so that once you start the saw, the dust extractor system fires up.

    The blade is a 250mm unit and allows cuts when ripping at or near full cut height. When doing rip cuts in hardwood to near or around full blade height, you know itís working, with softwood it sort of breezes through, but itís still working.

    The fence is really quite accurate, adjustment to 100% accuracy is quite easy to attain and hold. Whether that be on the right or left side of the blade. The mitre attachment can be user set to exactly 45ļ left and right and 90ļ with some fine tuning by using the underneath locking screws/bolts. The fence, when combined with the Magswitch magnetic feather board, is super accurate. http://magswitch.com.au/product/magswitch-starter-kit/

    We donít have a sliding table, which for our purposes isnít an imposition, but if you were working on your own, it would be quite handy. I have the Triton maxi extension sliding table on my Triton 2000 at home, couldnít live without it.

    Some thoughts.

    Mick.

  14. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Luke Maddux View Post
    . . . . I live in fear of my tablesaw and the peace of mind is worth it, not to mention my fingers.
    Anyone who lives in "fear" of a tool or machine should be seriously considering whether they should be using that tool or machine, irrespective of whether it has a specific safety feature or not.

    Most DIY woodworkers have little idea where risks lay in their woodshed.

    In a comprehensive survey of DIY and pro wood workers in the USA the machines with the greatest number of incidence per person hours was the jointer-planer (7 times more incidents than a TS). Next came the Drill press (4.5 x), then RAS (4x), and then Band saw (4x)

    Of all the major machines and tools in a workshop, the TS had the LOWEST incidence per hour of usage and the highest "Machine exposure hour to first injury".

    Anyone that lives in fear of their TS should then be in terror of the rest of the workshop.
    But this is not a way to operate.

    WRT ANY machine, respect, training, OHS best practice, appropriate precautions - yes; but fear? no.

    BTW highest "Machine exposure hour to first injury" is a major contributor to carelessness with TS amongst pro woodworkers who work for many years with a TS without a problem. At some point they drop their guard and a a result they are subject to a greater % of injuries (29% of all injuries) compared to DIY (18.5% of all injuries) from a TS.

  15. #14
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    Reading bobs post got me curious, so I tried searching for the survey.

    I found this instead. Its quite interesting.
    http://www.woodworking.org/AccidentSurvey/search.htm

  16. #15
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    Apr 2001
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    Perth
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    I think that you should read this (current) thread on WoodCentral ...

    http://www.woodcentral.com/woodworki.../sawstop-saga/

    The bottom line is that a new purchaser is very unhappy with his and getting the run around from the distributer. The problem is that the sensor can detect pockets of gum or mineral deposits and set off the brake or not start the saw as a result. If so, that would be an issue in Oz.

    I can see a place for a SawStop in a mens shed or a newby woodworker who may be inclined to do something either silly or inappropriate because of inexperience. For nearly everyone else, common sense and care have sufficed for many years. It is a powerful and potentially dangerous machine - but only if you fail to respect it.

    Regards from Perth

    Derek
    Visit www.inthewoodshop.com for tutorials on constructing handtools, handtool reviews, and my trials and tribulations with furniture builds.

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