Thread: 'Lectricity and black magic

So just one machine has died?

Most electronic failures will not be related to a 'bad' supply circuit.
A house electrical circuit is just a couple of wires appropriately sized for the load, and protected by a circuit breaker.
Note that circuit breakers are to protect the wires (and thus your house) from overheating / fire. Circuit breakers are not and don't protect attached equipment.

A surge can't be generated by a house circuit. A surge can result from the supply coming in, or faulty equipment locally.

Most electronic device failures are due to failure of components in the device itself.
There is wear and tear on electronic components just like there is for mechanical components. Some fail early, some last much longer than expected lifespan.

Any reason to suspect a surge?
(I think a surge is often a convenient thing to blame a failure on)

Originally Posted by derekcohen

- there was a quiet "pphhiiiittt", and ... dead.

That's often (but certainly not always) a capacitor. My oscilloscope made the dreaded "phuttt" noise and emitted smoke a while ago. It was one of the X2 capacitors on the power circuit board. Caps in power circuits work hard and eventually die.

You can confirm whether your mains power box has surge protectors by have a peek inside.

Originally Posted by derekcohen

there was a quiet "pphhiiiittt", and ... dead.

From a quick google it appears the lathe is powered by a Striatech digital variable reluctance motor and looks to use a solid state controller.
One common issue with solid state controllers is failure of the output stage with the mosfet's or other device suddenly releasing the magic smoke. This release is usually accompanied by a "pphhiiiittt".

Examination of the circuit board will expose this failure type with clear escape holes and marks.

Make sure the machine is disconnected and only proceed with disassembly if you are confident with your abilities with regards to electronic circuit boards.

This should fix these sort of problems.
H.

Lucas- the Prince of Darkness.

Originally Posted by pippin88

So just one machine has died?

Most electronic failures will not be related to a 'bad' supply circuit.
A house electrical circuit is just a couple of wires appropriately sized for the load, and protected by a circuit breaker.
Note that circuit breakers are to protect the wires (and thus your house) from overheating / fire. Circuit breakers are not and don't protect attached equipment.

A surge can't be generated by a house circuit. A surge can result from the supply coming in, or faulty equipment locally.

Most electronic device failures are due to failure of components in the device itself.
There is wear and tear on electronic components just like there is for mechanical components. Some fail early, some last much longer than expected lifespan.

Any reason to suspect a surge?
(I think a surge is often a convenient thing to blame a failure on)

No obvious surge that I know of ... no other machine was affected.

Having said this, we do get breakers tripping in the middle of the night (then the radio alarm does not go on and all the clocks in machines like the microwave need to be reset).

Is it necessary to switch off all machines/outlets in the workshop at the end of the day? I've never done this in the 30 years in this house/garage/workshop.

Regards from Perth

Derek

Originally Posted by jack620

That's often (but certainly not always) a capacitor. My oscilloscope made the dreaded "phuttt" noise and emitted smoke a while ago. It was one of the X2 capacitors on the power circuit board. Caps in power circuits work hard and eventually die.

You can confirm whether your mains power box has surge protectors by have a peek inside.

I wonder what a capacitor costs to replace? The repair to the control board was around $600-700. (Cost of a new Saturn is around $4K).

I did have a technician from a power tool mobile repair shop come in. He appeared to test the electronics (well, he pulled the controller out and poked it with a meter), and said it was beyond him.

Regards from Perth

Derek

Originally Posted by droog

From a quick google it appears the lathe is powered by a Striatech digital variable reluctance motor and looks to use a solid state controller.
One common issue with solid state controllers is failure of the output stage with the mosfet's or other device suddenly releasing the magic smoke. This release is usually accompanied by a "pphhiiiittt".

Examination of the circuit board will expose this failure type with clear escape holes and marks.

Make sure the machine is disconnected and only proceed with disassembly if you are confident with your abilities with regards to electronic circuit boards.

The lathe has already been repaired. Carbatec replaced the control board. I would not know what to look for, never mind have a go. My main electrical tools are a hammer and swear words.

Regards from Perth

Derek

Originally Posted by derekcohen

I wonder what a capacitor costs to replace?

Those caps are about $1 to buy. But if it was the power transistors as droog suggested, the parts would be considerably more.

Originally Posted by derekcohen

The lathe has already been repaired. Carbatec replaced the control board. I would not know what to look for, never mind have a go. My main electrical tools are a hammer and swear words.

Regards from Perth

Derek

Ah so already repaired looking for option for prevention of future occurrence.

Even switching the equipment off at the outlet is often only disconnecting the active, unless you have specific double pole outlets.
Big surges can be induced across into the neutral cable or even bridge the gap in a switch on the outlet so safest option is disconnect the equipment from the outlet totally by unplugging it.

There are surge protectors that can be purchased to assist, the downside with a lot of them is a small surge can render them inactive as they are a sacrificial device without any visible signs that they have been used. Then you are left with a false sense of security that the equipment is protected when really it is not.

Maybe someone has a lead on better surge protectors that indicate when they have gone off.