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  1. #1
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    Default Who is the real L.S.Barker ?

    Lately many L.S.Barker machine's have been appearing for sale in auctions and internet sites etc..
    I have been watching closely the different types of equipment, badging, letters in the casting and as you all know I'm sure, the firm of L.S.Barker interests me greatly.
    One of the things I have been trying to get my head around was some sort of time line as to when L.S.Barker moved from their North Melbourne address to Heidelberg.
    One of the big things I have noticed in the Barker Line up of machines is a huge difference in some of the machinery from around the same era, almost (and I'm speculating here) as if there were two firms.

    I'll let the Pic's do the talking .....





    Two L.S.Barker 12 inch Jointers from around the same era.





    Two L.S.Barker 24 inch thicknessers from around the same era.

    All very different machines.

    This is what has me speculating, the second thicknesser and jointer each coloured in green have this Badge attached on them below.

    The other two machine's have the cursive L.S.Barker letters in the casting as well as the McPhersons Badge attached on them below.


    First of all, the things to consider I guess was that there was a relationship between McPhersons and L.S.barker.
    McPhersons originally had a range of woodworking and metalworking machinery under the MACSON name.
    This some time in the 1940's merged into the Macson/Barker name and then later L.S.Barker.
    The McPhersons badge remainder on L.S.Barker machines as they were selling agents for Barker right through till the late 1960's.
    Could the two different machines in green above be machines produced by Barker before McPherson's engaged Barker to build machinery for them ?

    Now, lets take the badge of Camo's recently acquired bandsaw for instance (and thank you Camo !), It has a north Melbourne address, but according to the McPhersons catalog it is a 1960's machine, now this may even pinpoint a date of when Barker moved to Hiedleburg, possibly after the 1960's.

    Below is the badging from my L.S.Barker spindle moulder, which is a 1966 machine.



    Any thoughts on all of this Guys ?
    Melbourne Matty.

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  3. #2
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    Default Barker machine badges.

    Matty
    Just wanted to bring to your attention the stylised "sold by McPhersons for LS Barker" badge on the Bendigo jointer that DSEL74 has posted.I haven't noticed this particular badge before on Barker machinery.
    I'm not computer savvy enough to post it easily but pics of it and others would be of interest in this thread.
    I have a few on a stick somewhere from an TAFE auction here a few years back and from memory one could work out the date of manufacture similar to the Wadkin Bursgreen badges.
    H.
    Jimcracks for the rich and/or wealthy. (aka GKB '88)

  4. #3
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by clear out View Post
    Matty
    Just wanted to bring to your attention the stylised "sold by McPhersons for LS Barker" badge on the Bendigo jointer that DSEL74 has posted.I haven't noticed this particular badge before on Barker machinery.
    I'm not computer savvy enough to post it easily but pics of it and others would be of interest in this thread.
    I have a few on a stick somewhere from an TAFE auction here a few years back and from memory one could work out the date of manufacture similar to the Wadkin Bursgreen badges.
    H.
    This is it.

    mcpherson.jpgmcpherson2.jpg

    Now I am confused who are L Barker S

    Regarding dating (excuse my ignorance on this one, I know I should know it), with my LS Barker Bandsaws serial number being 5047 does that work with how you thought it could be dated?

    Matty,

    I wish I could help, I tried to do some research through the computer today, but all I kept finding was information from you, according to Google, you are the expert

    I wonder what media they used to advertise in (magazine, trade journals, etc.), it might give a way to reference the address over the years.....perhaps.

    Cheers,

    Camo

  5. #4
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by clear out View Post
    Matty
    Just wanted to bring to your attention the stylised "sold by McPhersons for LS Barker" badge on the Bendigo jointer that DSEL74 has posted.I haven't noticed this particular badge before on Barker machinery.
    I'm not computer savvy enough to post it easily but pics of it and others would be of interest in this thread.
    I have a few on a stick somewhere from an TAFE auction here a few years back and from memory one could work out the date of manufacture similar to the Wadkin Bursgreen badges.
    H.
    Henry, you are right, I have not seen many examples of that style of badge either, the only one that springs to mind is the one on my 38 inch bandsaw, it mustn't be a common badge.
    Camo has done a great job putting the Bendigo one up I see, that is a beautiful L.S.Barker jointer, and the style I was looking for before I found the more "boxed shape" 1955 one I have restored now.
    I have only ever seen one of these jointers with the L.S.Barker scroll writing (pictured below) in the cast body, not the best pic but you get the idea.
    H, I would like to know more about dating these machines, and also "My Kingdom" for a Compete L.S.Barker illustrated catalog too.



    Cam thanks for the internet search, I don't know that I am the expert but certainly the most curious any way...
    The McPhersons catalogs are a great source of information so far, I have in a 1966 McPhersons Catalogue which lists Agencies held by McPhersons, L.S.Barker is listed as as one, in Victoria Australia.

    Melbourne Matty.

  6. #5
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    Default

    Have you tried looking for a business name registry? It may have some leads.


    Another thought is they made a factory version and a McPhearson's line.
    …..Live a Quiet Life & Work with your Hands

  7. #6
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    Default Barker badging and numbers

    I have found the stick and will try to download the pics. This was from an auction at Lidcombe TAFE. I went there with a guy from the Strathfield Mens Shed to bid on one of the 2 Barker 27 inch bandsaws. They had been in storage downstairs at Ultimo for the past 30 years. We let the first one go when it reached $1000 our limit when Grays % was added. The buyer from H & F when offered the choice of the 2 took them both. From the numbers on these I think that the first two digits are the year. ie 6027 is 1960. The 12 jointer and badge are the first pics then the thicknesser and its badge is next. The next is from one of the 27 inch bandsaws and lastly the spindle of which I didn't get a close up. H
    Attached Images Attached Images
    Jimcracks for the rich and/or wealthy. (aka GKB '88)

  8. #7
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    Default

    nother thing to remember is that these are old machines and made by relatively small company. I don't think corporate identity was really that strong back then, as long as it had the name that was what they traded on.

    As a side point it was rising of the communist party in Russia that invented corporate identity and brand marketing as we see today.

    LS Baker I doubt had a marketing department as such and didn't have a graphic designer on the pay roll. It was probably left to the engineers to label and put the name on the machines.

    Some would just copy it from another machine others would add there little design flair to it.


    Even the bigger companies couldn't keep it consistent like Stanley.
    Screen shot 2013-06-30 at 12.22.44 PM.jpgScreen shot 2013-06-30 at 12.22.35 PM.png
    …..Live a Quiet Life & Work with your Hands

  9. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by DSEL74 View Post
    Have you tried looking for a business name registry? It may have some leads.


    Another thought is they made a factory version and a McPhearson's line.
    I have not done anything like that Dale, done a little sniffing on the internet and one of the things that comes up is a chap by the name of E.E.Rothschild,


    1. EE Rothschild was manufacturing manager and director at Fler. Co & Staff, where he ... the position of manufacturing manager at LS Barker (woodworking machinery), Kerby Furniture and Burgess Furniture, and was the national director of the ...

















    And thats about it,
    It truly astounds me how a company can trade for so long, close the doors in the 1970's and almost leave no trace of history any where.
    There would of been so many Australian manufacturing companies that produced top quality items in their day, and now all but gone.

    Melbourne Matty.

  10. #9
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    Default

    Lots more photos and some badges in this thread
    https://www.woodworkforums.com/f163/l...stings-143382/


    Maybe you need a memory refresher of what you posted
    barker_bandsaw_w.jpgrobertson.jpg
    McPherson Machine Tool Works were located in 392 Macaulay Road , Kensington,where Macson Metal lathes were made here in Melbourne and also castings were made at the McPherson’s M.T.W. Foundry in 217 Sunshine Road Tottenham.
    McPherson’s Ajax bolt works were located at 27-45 Burnley Street. Richmond.
    It is not clear though whether McPherson’s still owned L.S.Barker beyond the 1940’s, but a 1951 McPhersons catalogue does list L.S.Barker in their agencies, with a North Melbourne address.
    The two known locations of L.S.Barker woodworking machinery were in North Melbourne and later 660 Waterdale Rd West Heidelberg.
    McPherson’s were distributers of Barker woodworking machinery as reflected in their catalogues’ from 1940 to 1970 and their McPherson’s Black and Brass badge stating “Agents for Macson and L.S.Barker” found riveted on to many L.S.Barker machines.


    Other identifiable forms on Barker machines were raised letters in the casting, very early McPherson’s machines had just a plain brass badge with nothing in the casting, 1930’s onward was the large letters stating MACSON on machines starting to appear, some early Macson/Barker machines had no raised lettering. The earliest L.S.Barker raised lettering was a lovely cursive scroll with a “L” in the front “S” at the Rear and “Barker” surrounded in the Middle and appeared around the 1940.

    1950’s L.S.Barker was cast into machines in small plain letters running horizontally across and later in the 1960’s Larger lettering running vertically from top to bottom.


    L.S Barker later in the 1970’s became very well known for their wide belt sanders, some were branded as Barker/Sparrow after a merger or acquisition from Barker of R & EH Sparrow of Westgarth St Fitzroy, Sparrow also had a good reputation for their wide belt and drum sanders.
    Barker Woodwork Engineering 43 Mologa Rd Heidelberg West Victoria, are the last reminisce of L.S.Barker and still a good source for parts and repairs for barker and other woodworking machines, they specialize in servicing Barker wide belt sanders and sell second hand machinery.

    Melbourne Matty.
    Everyone Still awake....



    …..Live a Quiet Life & Work with your Hands

  11. #10
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    Default

    hers one from my shed no mention of ls barker but still the same style

    20130701_125410.jpg20130701_125420.jpg
    20130701_125828.jpg appologies for picture quality
    cheers pat

  12. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by DSEL74 View Post
    Lots more photos and some badges in this thread
    Maybe you need a memory refresher of what you posted
    Yes, more of my Ramblings I'm afraid Dale,
    Its always an information update as the information comes to mind I guess....

    Melbourne Matty.

  13. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by clear out View Post
    I have found the stick and will try to download the pics. This was from an auction at Lidcombe TAFE. I went there with a guy from the Strathfield Mens Shed to bid on one of the 2 Barker 27 inch bandsaws. They had been in storage downstairs at Ultimo for the past 30 years. We let the first one go when it reached $1000 our limit when Grays % was added. The buyer from H & F when offered the choice of the 2 took them both. From the numbers on these I think that the first two digits are the year. ie 6027 is 1960. The 12 jointer and badge are the first pics then the thicknesser and its badge is next. The next is from one of the 27 inch bandsaws and lastly the spindle of which I didn't get a close up. H
    Henry, some lovely examples there, that last shot is, I'm pretty sure a L.S.Barker high speed moulder and not a common machine.
    They all seem to be late machines, same Waterdale address, same McPhersons badge.
    The dating system seems to make sense, L.S.Barker may have even moved to the Waterdale address pre 1960 I'm not sure..
    Camo's bandsaw also may even be a late 1950's machine.
    From what I can gather from the McPhersons catalogs L.S.Barker written horizontally in the Casting were usually a 1950's machine, and L.S.Barker written vertically top to bottom were a later machine say 1960's.
    Thanks for showing those Pic's Henry, it just confirms more how much I like these machines !

    Melbourne Matty.

  14. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by 1thumb View Post
    hers one from my shed no mention of ls barker but still the same style
    Pat, very unusual jointer, it has some great lines, this machine is an early McPhersons machine Before Barker and before Macson.
    It reminds me of this Bandsaw recently ...

    https://www.woodworkforums.com/f163/p...andsaw-166977/

    thanks for showing !

    Melbourne Matty.

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  16. #15
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    I do Pat, but thanks for thinking of me, thats really thoughtful.
    Mind you it is a cleaner copy than mine, which has the front cover missing...

    Melbourne Matty.

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