Thread: PDR Build In Florida

Doing some dry fitting this evening. I am somewhat confused as to the fit of the bow and transom to the side panels. The transom framing plans depict a 4mm offset of the framing from the edge of the ply; page 14 of the plans shows the chinelogs to be trimmed 24mm short of the ends of the side panels. With the timber for the frames being 19mm, I am not getting a tight joint. Image 1 and 2 show my dilema. My solution would be to trim the 4mm of ply from each side of the transoms (image 3). Or should the ply be beveled. Am I on the right track or have I missed something.

Attachment 143154

Thanks,

Michael

Michael,

I'm glad I don't follow instructions very well, if I did I'd have been in the same jam you're in..

I believe the outside edge of the bow and transom are supposed to be flush with the outside of the side panels, that's how I did mine. If it were me I would cut 5mm pieces off your 19x19mm stock or some 19mm squares out of your 5mm luan to fill the gap. The bottom will add strength to those joints when you glue it on. The bow deck and side tanks will hide the error so no one will know except you and everyone who reads this forum

Answers to your other questions:
--The balanced lug rig is easier to reef so you could use less sail area while getting used to the boat
--Most people use softwood for foil blanks, it's lighter and easier to plane. If you're wanting contrasting colors for the staves spruce and western red cedar may be a better choice.
--2oz glass cloth will help prevent checking in your BC plywood, it will also protect your bottom from abrasion. It should only take a few ounces more epoxy to fill the weave of the 2oz fiberglass than it will take to do the recommended three coats on bare wood.

If you haven't already ordered your epoxy I'd recommend Raka in Ft. Pierce, about $100 for a 6 quart kit of non blushing epoxy. They have fiberglass cloth also. the website is raka.com.

If this is just a practice boat built of cheap plywood you may want to limit the epoxy coating to the areas that will get the most abuse and use exterior house paint to seal the rest.

Brad

Thank you for the suggestions. I plan on using 6 oz. glass on the bottom; 2 oz. glass on the floor. As of now I am going to bevel the ply for the transom/side panel joint, unless someone shows me the error of my ways before morning.

Watching.

would a sprit or lug rig be a better choice?

Have you read the Advantages & Disadvantages section on page 5 of the Lug Rig plans?

I reckon the Lug has more advantages.

Am I on the right track or have I missed something.

Hi Michael,
Sound like you are doing just fine. I think I spent 50% of the time building my duck just staring and saying "hmm". I'm pretty sure solution #3 will work just fine.on mine I think the ply on my transom overlaps the side panel and was planed down, but after you put fiberglass tape and epoxy on it it really doesn't matter at all.

My Duck is built with the lug and it is the bees knees. I haven't ever sailed a sprit rig so I couldnt tell you how it compares, but I know the lug is pretty cool.

With the foils, if you have similar sized staves they will be heavy and hard to shape. If you really like the walnut and want to make shaping easier (and make your foils lighter) consider walnut accent strips no wider than 1/4" between the pieces of spruce. I did my foils for my GIS like this with cedar and Philippine mahogany. They look pretty cool, the spruce will give even greater contrast.

One word of warning though as far as the glass is concerned. If it were me I would use 2 oz cloth and only on the outside. My Duck has a layer of the 6oz (this was the lightest stuff i could find at the time) cloth on the bottom (over really crappy luan ply) and My boat is substantially heavier than i'd like it to be. It also sucked up a lot more expensive epoxy than I expected. I'm pretty sure i could drag it around on the street behind my car and it wouldn't get hurt much, but it is serous overkill for a 1 person boat, especially if 1 person has to lift and move said boat without help. Also, glass cloth on the inside wont really help with strength too much as it gives the most benefit when used in tension. These are just some unsolicited opinions though, so make your boat however you see fit and have fun sailing it.

Enjoy the build,
-Al

Originally Posted by BradLH

Michael,

I'm glad I don't follow instructions very well, if I did I'd have been in the same jam you're in..

I believe the outside edge of the bow and transom are supposed to be flush with the outside of the side panels, that's how I did mine. If it were me I would cut 5mm pieces off your 19x19mm stock or some 19mm squares out of your 5mm luan to fill the gap. The bottom will add strength to those joints when you glue it on. The bow deck and side tanks will hide the error so no one will know except you and everyone who reads this forum

Answers to your other questions:
--The balanced lug rig is easier to reef so you could use less sail area while getting used to the boat
--Most people use softwood for foil blanks, it's lighter and easier to plane. If you're wanting contrasting colors for the staves spruce and western red cedar may be a better choice.
--2oz glass cloth will help prevent checking in your BC plywood, it will also protect your bottom from abrasion. It should only take a few ounces more epoxy to fill the weave of the 2oz fiberglass than it will take to do the recommended three coats on bare wood.

If you haven't already ordered your epoxy I'd recommend Raka in Ft. Pierce, about $100 for a 6 quart kit of non blushing epoxy. They have fiberglass cloth also. the website is raka.com.

If this is just a practice boat built of cheap plywood you may want to limit the epoxy coating to the areas that will get the most abuse and use exterior house paint to seal the rest.

Brad

Howdy,

Sorry I didn't see this one.

The joint doesn't need to be tight - any gap can be filled with epoxy during the gluing or with epoxy from the gluing bag when you fill any fastener holes later. This is more foolproof than putting a bit of timber in there, but that won't hurt either.

best wishes
Michael.

FYI for a fellow Floridian

If you haven't ordered your epoxy yet there's another place in Florida (Jacksonville guy here) that is top notch and very inexpensive. US Composites sells epoxy kits and ships them from West Palm. I ordered fiberglass tape from them and it was shipped to my door very quickly.

Can't wait to see pics of your build.

I'm not a Floridian but thanks for the heads up Paul, $69.00 for 1.5 gallons is the best price I've seen for epoxy.

I've used both name brand and generic epoxy and they all seem to be about the same. The US Composites is about half the cost of System 3 Silver Tip from Duckworks, does anyone know if there's a significant difference in quality?

Thanks,
Brad

Originally Posted by BradLH

I'm not a Floridian but thanks for the heads up Paul, $69.00 for 1.5 gallons is the best price I've seen for epoxy.

I've used both name brand and generic epoxy and they all seem to be about the same. The US Composites is about half the cost of System 3 Silver Tip from Duckworks, does anyone know if there's a significant difference in quality?

Thanks,
Brad

I don't know about comparable quality but my brother uses the US Composites epoxy on his stunt Jetski hull. I'd be willing to bet that if the forces his 800cc motor and the surface tension from landing on the water from 6 feet off a wake don't wreck the epoxy, sailing should be OK.

I think Duckworks has a few different epoxies.

The quality of epoxies is not generic - they can differ quite a bit in handling properties and end strength and brittleness and the ability to get a clear finish when glassing or coating.

Generally if I can find a big bunch of people using a particular epoxy on the net then there are probably no major problems. The big brands with wide areas of availability seem to do the most work to make their products good and reliable.

I wouldn't make the decision on dollars alone - I have seen too many test results of different brands. Widely available epoxies that are commonly used are the best.

Michael.

Originally Posted by Boatmik

Widely available epoxies that are commonly used are the best.
Michael.

For anyone who has had limited experience with using epoxies, then that's the best advice they will ever get...

As an adhesive the generic epoxies are probably OK but for laying down a layer of 'glass I'd stick with one of the brand names. My pirogue ended up with a huge blister where the 'glass lifted. The Marinepoxy I used on it blushed like crazy and I guess my attempts to clean it were inadequate. The MAS epoxy I've used on two additional boats has never blushed.

Exactly right MAM,

Once you know the field of widely used and trusted epoxies then this sort of knowledge of the ins and outs of each becomes very valuable.

Best wishes
MIK