Thread: PDRacer - alternative timber

Meranti varies hugely in density. It can be quite heavy and quite light.

With our first two PDRacers we used finger jointed pine for a lot of the framing. Basically any piece of timber that is in a corner will be held together by the plywood, so the fingerjointing is not a disadvantage.

The only area where you shouldn't use it is where it glue only to ply on one face as there it might get tension loads and it will break.

No good for the chine logs because they bend and also the spars where the fingerjointing is not strong enough for the loads.

ARe there any salvage yards or second hand timber places in your area? That is another source.

Best wishes
Michael

Meranti, also sold as Queensland Maple and used in the making of "Pink" ply will be fine for mast making. Because it can vary so much in density and colour, you should choose the light coloured stuff as this will generally be lighter in weight too.

I got my Hoop from Lindsay Meyers in Clontarf.
11 Grice St Clontarf Q. 4019
Tel: 3284 5281 Fax: 3283 3352
Website: Lindsay Meyers - timber mouldings renovation Queensland hoop

93x11x4800 for the wide mast staves was $3.19/m
68X11X4800 for the narrow mast staves was $2.53/m
(These dims were for my Goat)

Quite reasonable prices I thought and lovely timber.

Edit: I see Mick's post was just before mine)
My dad and I built a couple of boats down to minimum weights using carefully selected lightweight meranti for framing.

Originally Posted by woodeneye

93x11x4800 for the wide mast staves was $3.19/m
68X11X4800 for the narrow mast staves was $2.53/m
(These dims were for my Goat)

In SA we pay that much & more for Pinus Crapiata.
Will hafta move back ter sunny Queensland I think.
AJ

What about meranti ply wood for hulls?

When I bought my Okoume, the lumberyard (kind of specializes in marine stuff) strongly suggested the meranti because it was cheaper and I wouldn't necessarily have to seal it (at least as well), it was more water resistant. It was also heavier.

I went with the Okoume, but I was tempted for a minute. Would that have been good or bad?

Originally Posted by callsign222

What about meranti ply wood for hulls?

When I bought my Okoume, the lumberyard (kind of specializes in marine stuff) strongly suggested the meranti because it was cheaper and I wouldn't necessarily have to seal it (at least as well), it was more water resistant. It was also heavier.

I went with the Okoume, but I was tempted for a minute. Would that have been good or bad?

The meranti or "Pink" plywood we get here in Australia is generally very good quality and it's quite pretty stuff. If it is made in Malaysia, unlike the Chinese sourced Okoume, the meranti pink ply probably does meet BS1088. It is considerably cheaper than Okoume. The only downside of the meranti ply is its weight, therefore for smaller boats that use 2 or 3 sheets of ply its a great choice as the weight difference is not going to be significant. For larger boats like the Goat, Okoume is a better choice, but only if it good quality.

As for the better water resistance of meranti ply, that's not a worry at all as you will seal your boat with a coating. To qualify as marine ply it must meet water resistance standards, and there is a boiling test it must pass to qualify as marine ply, irrespective of the wood used to make it. On a bigger boat like a cruiser, rot resistance may be a factor to consider when choosing marine ply. Core gaps in the poorer quality Chinese made marine ply would be more of an issue than timber choice as the gaps will promote quicker rotting if the ply becomes exposed.

One of the reasons that you get such variance in meranti is because there are many different species of timber from the same family that are all sold as meranti. Well over 20 different species, I have the article on my work computer but can't find it sitting at home, so I can't be precise. So it's well worth looking around and finding some of the lighter stuff if that's what you choose in the end.

Colin is right. Some smells like Meranti, some smells like Kapur and some smells like some tropical hardwood that used to be imported in the early 90s.

Pacific Maple is a catch all. Some sheets can be twice the weight of proper gaboon. Not figuratively!

With the coating and protection - the red Meranti is rated as durable but the light coloured stuff rots away in a trice. So if just painting or varnishing and it is the red stuff the timberyard was right.

But if using epoxy - it is a go/no go thing. You can't scale down the amount of coating without losing almost all the protection. A false economy. But they probably were not thinking of that at the timberyard.

Best wishes
Michael

Guess I'm getting cranky...

...unlike the Chinese sourced Okoume...

That seems like a pretty broad brush...

I am certainly no cheerleader for all things Chinese, but the okoume ply I purchased for my Goat was made in China. Each sheet is stamped, "6mm Edensaw, BS 1088 Marine Grade, China Origin." I have not found a single void in any of the material I've cut.

On the other hand, I do not doubt there is low-quality okoume plywood being manufactured in China.

I guess my point is not all okoume plywood coming out of China is low-quality. But how do you tell the good stuff from the bad when buying? I don't really have a choice. Virtually all plywood in this area regardless of retailer, comes from a single wholesaler. Luck of the draw?

Originally Posted by woodeneye

93x11x4800 for the wide mast staves was $3.19/m
68X11X4800 for the narrow mast staves was $2.53/m

Hi again

I have rung around a bit and I have to admit they are very good prices for hoop. At those prices the mast would only cost me around $60 excluding epoxy - at the risk of sounding like a tight #### I want to do it cheaper than that. In fact I want to do everything as cheap as I can on the boat, without being silly. I can buy light, good quality Pacific Maple for around half the price of hoop.

It's not that I am really short of a quid but I really want to see how low I can go on this build. I know if I can build a nice looking boat on the cheap with easily sourced materials I will be able to encourage my friends to build one too, I know they would never do it if it costs them $1000. I have never been sailing but I reckon it would be more fun if I had a few mates to race. If I hate it at least I am not hugely out of pocket.

I have to go now and buy my sail from 'Crazy Clark's' - crappy polytarp $8.99

I found that I wasted more money in gas looking for the best prices on lumber than I would have spent if I just bought it at the first place I went. Think about it. Same goes for epoxy.

If you spend $20 in gas going to every shop in town to buy wood for $60 instead of buying it for $80 last week, you lost a week of building and still came out in the same spot.

Originally Posted by paulwjax

I found that I wasted more money in gas looking for the best prices on lumber than I would have spent if I just bought it at the first place I went. Think about it. Same goes for epoxy.

If you spend $20 in gas going to every shop in town to buy wood for $60 instead of buying it for $80 last week, you lost a week of building and still came out in the same spot.

You are right, but I mostly do searches on the internet and ring around these days.

Col

Col, if you want to do it cheap, go to Bunnings and buy their radiata. Their stocks are so large it's not hard to find clear timber. The grain is coarser than oregon so it's not as nice to work but it does the job and it's cheap - 42x19 sticks (I think, it was that sort of size anyway) are only $1 a meter and I was buying 3.4 m lengths. I bought it because I was out of options and sick of travelling but you can't beat the price and if you're buying on price ...

The next best resource are the second hand timber places where you can get the 'real thing' for low prices, though you'll need to machine it to size - which is where a thicknesser and table saw pay themselves - and you'll have to put up with a lot of wastage and nail holes. It works though.

You don't need an expensive table saw - I know a bloke who uses a $100 table saw, a hand plane and a keen eye on rubbish skips ... his timber collection is much better than mine.

Richard

I hear you Daddles, I have been to Bunnings (which is only 500m away) and have had a good look through their Radiata and I reckon I could easily get a heap of good bits without knots, it was around the $1.00 mark I think for 1.2m lengths. I was going to cut the 42*19 down the middle and make 19*19 and then scarfe them for the chine logs, a bit of a pain but the cheapest option. I managed to get a table saw of ebay for $43 dollars that should do the job but I am a bit scared of it, it sounds like a bloody jet engine. I just need to find some stock at 12mm thick for the mast, hence the pacific maple. I too have scabbed through bins in the industrial estates on my last night shift but didn't find too much, the search continues.......

Col

Hi Col,

I'm also building in Brisbane. I've mainly used hoop pine, however did use radiata from Bunnings on some of the framing since that's what I had to hand at the time.

PM me if you want to come see my boat - I've just about finished the hull, but have not done the spars or foils yet.

Would be interested in some local racing too

Duncan