Thread: My Chinese CNC Saga (continued)

shipping CNC machines with out the correct pin set up information is wrong , and then not answering emails of people who have complained is worse , well done CNCDIY , the "do it yourself" part of your name is correct , there must be a few of these machines out there going real cheep ( off customers )

like i said i held back for 3 weeks and thought about there bad feedback (CNCDIY site forum ) only when the Australian dollar hit US$1.10 i could not resist

ive been byeing stuff for a full sheet sized one for almost a year now , have 4 400watt servo's and drivers , lol ,(you think steppers are hard to set up ), gearboxes , still havent decided on ball screws or "tractor belt "( [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OdJoVh6DRPA"]ServoBelt: amazing belt drive - YouTube[/ame] ) have the 25mm proper THK rails , was going to make the x axis bed out of 300mm "C" section steel , with coolant pan underneath

so have had some experience getting motors to spin with mach3

i hadnt been to this part of the site in 3 months , after i received the cnc , i logged in and saw this posting , lol , couldn't believe you bought the identical one with 4thaxis and USB hand controller

have some huge 1200oz steppers ( ours are 52oz >?) that i bought just for the gearboxes and electric brakes , lol , should chuck these big ones on this machine and bend a few ballscrews , but the small steppers rev more than the large ones , so the large ones although a lot more powerful will be a lot slower

got the spindle all wired up , connected , set up the water tank , tubes pump , bled the pump line , started it all up ready to make smoke , and the pump ran for 10 seconds and has stopped ,

took the pump part off the motor , its seized , lol , motor runs fine with out it on there

will have to sort something else out , hose connection for now

Originally Posted by SawDustSniffer

got the spindle all wired up , connected , set up the water tank , tubes pump , bled the pump line , started it all up ready to make smoke , and the pump ran for 10 seconds and has stopped ,

took the pump part off the motor , its seized , lol , motor runs fine with out it on there

will have to sort something else out , hose connection for now

Heh. The pump is the only bit of mien that has worked flawlessly (so far). I've been reading the Mach3 manual, your pin settings, and CNCDIY settings. Did you notice your axis settings are almost exactly the same as their CB-B4-001 controller, which is supposed to be for the EC240 DC 0.2kW spindle, not the 1.5kW spindle. Only diff is X & Y dir pins are swapped.

So did you use step pin 17/dir pin 0 for the spindle? That's also the CB-B4-001 settings.

What does the digital trigger setting do? Once again, CNCDIY says to set 'Enable 1', Port 1, Pin 5? Is that needed.

Boy their manual is messed up. Walter 6545 spec is not supposed to have the CB-B4-002 controller, so the machine settings are probably wrong too. Oh wait, they're all the same anyway. Phew.

*EDIT*

BTW, One thing I noticed, my +X goes backwards. I know I can flip the switch to change it, but why would mine be different to yours? +X drive the gantry away from the end stepper (towards the non-spindle side on the gantry). That should be -X shouldn't it?

Originally Posted by BoomerangInfo

Heh. The pump is the only bit of mien that has worked flawlessly (so far). I've been reading the Mach3 manual, your pin settings, and CNCDIY settings. Did you notice your axis settings are almost exactly the same as their CB-B4-001 controller, which is supposed to be for the EC240 DC 0.2kW spindle, not the 1.5kW spindle. Only diff is X & Y dir pins are swapped.

no didn't notice , i just put in pin numbers randomly and worked it out , quite quick with consecutive pin numbers

Originally Posted by BoomerangInfo

So did you use step pin 17/dir pin 0 for the spindle? That's also the CB-B4-001 settings.

i was going to try pin 17 , and pin 1 , lol there are only 3 pins left to try 1,16&17, trying to sort out a pump to cool it , think i might just use the garden hose for now , i have a radiator for a computer that i was going to use to cool the spindle , with 3x120mm PC fans , since the fans i purchased are 240volt , im looking for a 240 volt pump ,but can only find a 17 lt/m pressure pump on ebay , i have asked a question if the pump can be ran constantly , waiting for an answer http://cgi.ebay.com.au/ws/eBayISAPI....#ht_3067wt_905 might have to by pass 3/4 of the water to a second radiator because of the flow rate of the pump , and because i have 2 radiators and 7 fans ( was going to purchase a 3kw water cooled spindle for my big one )

Originally Posted by BoomerangInfo

What does the digital trigger setting do? Once again, CNCDIY says to set 'Enable 1', Port 1, Pin 5? Is that needed.

pin 5 is an axis pin , "enable 1" is probably a better spot for the enable pin settings ( pin 14 )

i couldn't get the steppers to run , and noticed there is an "EN" wire going from the BOB to the stepper driver board , so figured there was an "enable " needed to get the steppers running , i just used the digital trigger as an output ( first on the list ) , and pin 14 worked , any out put with those pin settings will work , will now change it from "trigger " to "enable 1" , the same pin14 , port 1 , and ticks

Originally Posted by BoomerangInfo

Boy their manual is messed up. Walter 6545 spec is not supposed to have the CB-B4-002 controller, so the machine settings are probably wrong too. Oh wait, they're all the same anyway. Phew.

*EDIT*

BTW, One thing I noticed, my +X goes backwards. I know I can flip the switch to change it, but why would mine be different to yours? +X drive the gantry away from the end stepper (towards the non-spindle side on the gantry). That should be -X shouldn't it?

i have mine on the bench the other way round ???? yaxis motor on the back ,stand on the other side and try it, at the moment i was just giving you settings that work , yes they still might be back to front , will have to cut something and see if turns out the right way round , mirror imaged , ect

*sigh*

Well I managed to throw my circuit breaker 4 times, at least with no smoke or mobo frying this time though.

I tried setting the spindle pins to 1, 16 and 17, and I also set Enable 1 to pin 16 as per CNCDIY to see if it made any difference, but not luck. As soon as I power on the control box, the circuit blows.

*EDIT*

I wonder if the Spindle wires were wired up wrong, although I think my BIL said he had it running? Maybe the BoB is had it, given my E-Stop problem as well. Would the axes keep working if the BoB was broken?

changing the output setting from "digital trigger" to "enable 1 " stopped it from working until you "X" the active low


Enable 1 , enabled (tick) , port 1 , pin 14 , active low (cross ) ,
and remove the digital trigger numbers and enable

Originally Posted by BoomerangInfo

*sigh*

Well I managed to throw my circuit breaker 4 times, at least with no smoke or mobo frying this time though.

are your spindle too BOB wires still unplugged ??? ( dont plug them in if they are unplugged and your tripping your box )

Originally Posted by BoomerangInfo

I tried setting the spindle pins to 1, 16 and 17, and I also set Enable 1 to pin 16 as per CNCDIY to see if it made any difference, but not luck. As soon as I power on the control box, the circuit blows.

enable is pin 14 (steppers), only 2 wires going from BOB to spindle , direction , and speed , no wire for enable

*EDIT*

Originally Posted by BoomerangInfo

I wonder if the Spindle wires were wired up wrong, although I think my BIL said he had it running? Maybe the BoB is had it, given my E-Stop problem as well. Would the axes keep working if the BoB was broken?

the wiring of a 3 phase motor is quite simple , if you bugger up any of the wire positions it will only run backwards
to run forward you can use 1,2,3 .... 231 .....312 , there still in order and will run forwards ,
if you mix up the order 3,2,1....1,3,2 .... 2,1,3 it will run backwards , there are no other ways to connect 3 wires

as for the bob , it has 16 little amplifiers in there , yes it could still run with a few fried , not likely though , there are 2 chips on the bob , one might be fried 1-8 proberly is working , 9-17 is properly fried, when you clear all pin 1,16,17 from the config pages , does the box still trip ?

lol had to run over and shut off the controller , lol , left the pump connected and smoke is now comming out of the pump , just the pump

Originally Posted by SawDustSniffer

the Spindle cable , comes off at the spindle , so i was going to wire it up 1-1 2-2 3-3 4-4 , using a multi meter to match there wires , but the numbering on the plugs is different , clock wise from notch on spindle end is 1342 ,the original plug on the cord has 1 at the notch 342 set up ( they are wired 1-1 2-2 3-3 , with no connection on 4 , no earth ??/ ) , and the spare plug they supply ( clock wise from notch ) is 1234

Before I fiddle in Mach3 again, I thought I'd have a look at the wiring on my spindle cable. My plugs agree with yours - spindle plug is 1,3,4,2 and controller plug (new one the BIL installed) is 1,2,3,4.

Now, the spindle plug is wired - Brown = 1, Blue = 2, Black = 3. The controller plug is wired Brown = 1, Blue = 3, Black = 2!!! Does that not conflict with your wiring?

I left the computer off, unplugged the parallel cable, and powered the controller up. The pump ran as normal. I plugged the parallel cable back in, computer still off, and powered up the controller, and the mains blew again.

Does that sound like a grounding issue or wiring issue?

*EDIT* I just saw your response above about 3-phase wiring. So any other ideas? With the PC out of the loop, except via a cable connection, what else is likely?

Originally Posted by SawDustSniffer

are your spindle too BOB wires still unplugged ??? ( dont plug them in if they are unplugged and your tripping your box )

No, I plugged them back in before I started trying to get the spindle to work. Just had a reply from the BIL. He didn't get the spindle running. His power tripped the very first time he had just the controller plugged in, but by the end when he had the spindle and pump plugged in (he had no PC side happening) he didn't have any other trips.

your vfd is toast ?,
unscrew the power cables going to it ( with the plug OUT OF THE WALL and short the 2 terminals out with 2 screw drivers ( insulated screw drivers ) ) tape them up and isolate the 2 leads , the blue and brown one , remember , blue is neutral , brown is active , its brown, because if you touch it live "you will #### your self ", blue / neutral is just a glorified "earth "

disconnect the spindle board , and see if you can get your axis to run again



*EDIT* I just saw your response above about 3-phase wiring. So any other ideas? With the PC out of the loop, except via a cable connection, what else is likely? ,

clear pins 1 , 17 , 16 from all referance in your mach3 config pages , and try again , the port might keep its state even when powered off , with the plug plugged in , ???? pin ??/1 ??? might be grounding and setting off a chain of events that leads to a board blow out

Originally Posted by SawDustSniffer

when you clear all pin 1,16,17 from the config pages , does the box still trip ?

I went in and disabled (unticked) the spindle motor output, and my active low on 'Enable 1' was already an X. Same result. Start up the controller while Mach3 is running, and the circuit breaks.

Tried once again with the power off and a different parallel cable. No cable plugged, it runs. Plug in cable, circuit trips. So something seems to be shorting across the parallel connection, but, only when the spindle plug in the BoB is connected (although I haven't confirmed by pulling it again, but I'm pretty sure that's the conditions).

>????? might Be ????

4 pins on the spindle , put a OHMS test on the pins (upside down U with feet ) , you should get 2.2ohms between 1-3 pins (any order), and the 4th should not be connected to the out side or other pins

test pin 1 with pin 2 and 3 , should be 2.2ohm
pin 2 against pin 1 and pin 3 should be 2.2ohm
pin 3 aganst pin 1 and pin 2 should be 2.2ohm

pin 4 test to out side (should be 0 , or in the mill-ohm scale )
pin4 to pin 1 , 2 , 3 , should be 0 as well


the bob separates power from the control box to the computer , all power from the computer switches little amplifiers , and go's back to the computer , all power from the control box is contained within the controll box ,large voltages will " Jump" across , the wires
from the BOB to the VFD it can still ground ( let power flow from the VDF to the BOB ) causing the fault to happen again ,

i dont think your bob is stuffed , pin 14 must be working or your steppers would not work , and the chance that some pins are blown and others work ,is a bit less than bugger all


REMOVE ANY REFERENCE TO PIN , 1 , 16 , 17 IN ALL OF THE SETUP PAGES

Well, I'm back to square one.

I went and removed the Spindle plug in the BoB again, set the Mach3 settings back to what they were when my steppers were working this morning, but now the steppers don't work again. At least the thing stays running while plugged into the PC again, but that's about it. Why the steppers don't work anymore, I dont know, unless the parallel port got zapped. The Mach3 drive test says everything is OK, but is that just a software test, or a hardware test? The position numbers in Mach3 are moving, so the pendant is working, but seems there's no signal going out again. I tried Enable1 and Dig Trig, both with Active low ticked & not ticked, but there was no difference.

Is there any difference between actually disconnecting the spindle power to the VS just unplugging the BoB connection?

It's too late to go out to the shed anymore today, and the LOML will be home soon and wonder what I've been doing all day. I'll try and check the spindle plug connections in the morning. Do you mean the plug in the controller, or the spindle itself?

Originally Posted by BoomerangInfo

Well, I'm back to square one.

Is there any difference between actually disconnecting the spindle power to the VS just unplugging the BoB connection?

i believe your spindle board is toast , don't disconnect it and throw it away just yet , until you test your spindle , but please unplug the spindle wires from the bob

Originally Posted by BoomerangInfo

I'll try and check the spindle plug connections in the morning. Do you mean the plug in the controller, or the spindle itself?

yes test the spindle( on the machine ) for a earth short ( that will trip the RCD )and the plugs , and the connection to the controller , also whats the amp rating of the RCD your tripping

1500watts spindle
400watts computer
??? 400 watts ???? control box
???? monitor
2400 watts at 240 volts is 10amps
is the beer fridge plugged into the same box ?
how many extension cords are plugged in end to end and coiled up on the floor ?
???searching for straws now ???


with the control unit unplugged from every thing

put the cable on the spindle end only, to see if any of the wires short against the metal plug .one lead in the end of the cable , the other lead on the out side of the plug / spindle unit , (ohms test)all 4 pins
then go through all of the pins again on the plug ,
pin 1 too 2,3,4, ,
pin 2 , too 1,3,4,
pin 3 , too 1,2,4
they should still be around the 2.2 ohm or zero for the 4th pin

make sure the control box is unplugged for 1/2 hour before testing

then disconnect the spindle unit end and plug in the control box end of the cable and test all 4 pins holding the other test lead to the green wire going to your VFD
your checking for an earth leak
you should have , zero on all of those ,
make sure the control box is unplugged for 1/2 hour before testing