Thread: Tips for Newbie Huanyang VFD users

Apologies for jumping on this long thread. But I thought folks here may be
uniquely able to shed some light..

I recently purchased what was supposed to be an HY02D223B 2.2KW 3HP 10A
inverter but it arrived looking like what could possibly be a clone or alternate
manufacturing source for a HY/Huanyang drive. There's no manufacturer's
name or model on the unit nor more importantly no electrical rating nameplate.

Could just be that's the way they're dribbling out of the HY factory at the
present or perhaps the seller and or US shipping agent tried to pull a fast
one and shipped a knock-off of a knock-off. My question is whether
others who have ordered these VFDs from Evilbay sellers recently were
shipped a similar device.

What I ordered was here,and what I received looks something like this without
the nameplate rating label.

I'm not concerned about the cosmetic differences but rather the lack of
manufacturer identification and any sort of electrical ratings. The accompanying
manual cites two 2.2KW units and I'd noticed the missing identification
when trying to determine which braking resistor applies to the model I've
received.

As an aside, while I emphethise with the folks already composing an "HY Inverters?
Well we told you so.." response, I appreciate the passion but am really looking here
to understand if this is representative of what is shipping as an HY inverter or whether
the seller shipped a lower cost clone. I know, the mind boggles from that notion.

Reason I'm suspicious is after I'd ordered this VFD a few weeks ago, the seller
came back trying to extract an extra $30 for "Free Shiping". Apparently there had
been some sort of shortage or price increase and I would now have to pay for free
shipping. After I pointed out such a problem wasn't my concern, they sat on the order
but after my persistence gave me the option of waiting weeks to ship from within the
USA (original listing agreement) or waiting essentially the same time and shipping
from China. I chose the former as I'm in the USA and if this turned out to be a turkey,
it would be less expensive to ship this back to the USA location if on my dime.

I think the way it works for these China-resident sellers is they use (in this case)
a USA warehouse drop shipping service. So they don't know exactly what is shipped
nor are aware if the warehouse received a cargo box of cloned clones off the boat.
But that's just my speculation after seeing several sellers shipping from a nondescript
location in San Leandro, CA.

FWIW I don't purchase this low-ball Chinese gear with an expectation of even finding
a diamond in the rough (although I have). However for the most part they are mindless
knockoffs and easily repaired or reverse engineered due to use of inexpensive
commodity components. At best I receive something which just works, and worst case
I'm faced with the prospect of completing the kit as part of the deal.

Originally Posted by Bob Willson

The thing that is wrong with it seems to be no voltage at all on the output side. It measures very high resistance between all output terminals:
The resistance measurements are:
U-V = 4.7 Megaohms (4M7)
U-W = 12.44 Megaohms (12M44)
V-W = 4.82 Megaohms (4M82)

Powered off that's to be expected as you're just measuring the leakage
through the IGBTs. You may see an increasing "resistance" as the
measurement continues if you are charging any parasitic or RFI
suppression capacitance.

and then, when power is applied:

Measurements across the U-V terminals was 10.6v, Then after pressing start it was 11.1 then after pressing stop it was 10v

Measurements across the U-W terminals was 4.3v, Then after pressing start it was 4.0 then after pressing stop it was 2.6v

Measurements across the V-W terminals was 8.5v, Then after pressing start it was 8.3 then after pressing stop it was 10.6v

I had a peek inside my HY02D223B arriving yesterday before I
even powered it up. Your model while different I'd hazard is
essentially the same design sans higher current rectifier,
IGBTs and increased bulk capacitance.

I'd check the bulk DC rail across the large electrolytic capacitor(s)
downstream of the bridge rectifier. You should see somewhere in
the 330V ballpark. Careful this is high voltage DC.

If that checks out you'd need to determine if the totem pole IGBTs are
seeing the PWM drive. In my case each leg of the phase has a pair
of TLP351 optocouplers driving a totem pole pair of FGA25N120ANTD
IGBTs. You want to scope on the low vlotage led side of the
optocoupler. I believe the potential to ground is 5V as the logic
seems to be running from a L7805 regulator. But you'll need to
check this yourself for safety before embarking on the diagnosis.

From my quick assessment I see a flyback switcher driven by a UC3844
controller on a perpendicular daughter PCB and 2SK-something MOSFET,
used to derive low voltage rails for the logic, analog, 24V fan and control
Somewhere in there a floating 12V or so for the high side optocoupler IGBT
drive. Could be just two rails, one for the isolated high-side drive and
another for everything else regulated down as needed.

As soon as I press the start button I get a fault dL which according to the manual is an output short circuit.
Their suggested course of action for this fault is:
1) Check whether the connection wire of the motor has a short circuit. (The motor is not connected)
2) Check whether the insulation of the output wires is good. (No output wires attached)
3) Send for repair.

There is a current transformer in circuit so that is presumably
used to detect overcurrent. It could be a shorted output stage
somehow, bad dirve (overlapping or totem pole mis-timing shoot
through), or just a faulty current sense circuitry. You should be
able to ascertain quite a bit assuming you are equipped to safely
probe the low voltage side being fed by the flyback switcher.
Theoretically that should be the case as the control side of the
circuit should be effectively referenced to ground. So assuming
you stay on the control side of the optocouplers it should be
possible. Then again these are hardly designed for servicability
and I'd be very wary of anything being at a surprize potential
voltage either through design or defect.

BTW do check the 2 internal ribbon cables to assure you
don't have a connection problem. Buzz out continuity
pin-by-pin at the respective headers in which they terminate.

So, does anyone have a circuit diagram for this inverter, or better still can anyone advise me what component has failed?

I was thinking to create one. But I found a what appears to be a
DSP/uC on the main logic board which I couldn't immediately identify.
Most else appears to be legacy components unfortunately in my
case entombed in some potting compound which obscures component
markings. I can't place the DSP/uC so that knocks my motivation
down considerably to reverse engineer a schematic. There is also
an Atmel at89-something flash 8-bit uC in the demountable panel
module for drive of the discrete 7-seg and discrete leds and
scanning of the input tact switches.

The manual also says that the VFD is fuse protected. I cannot find a fuse anywhere in the box.

The manual seems quite a bit of stuff, some actually in the English
language and some even true. It is about as compelling reading as the
white pages of a phone book, maybe less.

In any case I'd most definately hang onto that abandoned VFD
for spare parts. The power train (bridge rectifier, IGBTs and
electrolytic capacitors) see high stress and I'd expect the first
components to wink out in use.

Hello uhmgawa and welcome to the site.

First off, what you have is almost certainly a real Huanyang. Mine look exactly the same as yours and are from a different supplier. They tend to use generic pictures for these things and steal one anothers photos for use on eBay I have not heard of anybody producing a knock-off of this knock-off.

In my quest for more information about these inverters Malibu (John) came across this diagram. I hope this will help you too.

As to the rest of your post on how to fix my stuffed inverter, most of that went zooming way over my head. At present, the disassembled and partly desoldered inverter is sitting on my sideboard garnering resentful stares from my wife.

I will get around to looking at it again, but at present my time is taken up with the working one that replace this one.

Thank you for the in-depth reply.

Originally Posted by Bob Willson

Hello uhmgawa and welcome to the site.

First off, what you have is almost certainly a real Huanyang. Mine look exactly the same as yours and are from a different supplier. They tend to use generic pictures for these things and steal one anothers photos for use on eBay I have not heard of anybody producing a knock-off of this knock-off.

The marketing banter from some sellers would have you believe there are at least
competing knock-offs. I don't know why otherwise two slightly different versions exist
and the missing model and electrical name plate is rather alarming. Unsure how it
could get past regulatory approval without both but apparently the "CE" approval
stickers are more easy to come by given it does have one.

In my quest for more information about these inverters Malibu (John) came across this diagram. I hope this will help you too.

That is the power hex bridge board alone, however it contains the circuitry
most likely to sustain casualties -- assuming design weak links don't exist
elsewhere. I believe the circuitry differs in my VFD particularly the head-to-head
zener clamps on the IGBT gates. It is buttoned up now, connected to my mill
but I'll have another look at it shortly.

I'm not so much concerned about an immediate repair need but I do like to
have replacement components on hand for unexpected failures.

Hi all, great information here!

I have just purchased a HY02D223B and have yet to hook it up. It sounds as though there are a few things to watch out for. I have a need for another VFD for my feed motor and I like the idea of running another of the same model VFD but without any experience with mine I'm not sure if I should buy another. What is the general thought about this super cheap VFD's?

Thanks.

I seriously doubt that you will get better value for money. They aren't the Rolls Royce of VFDs, but they seem to work fine.

I can introduce anyone who wants to a manufacturer and you can buy directly from them in any quantity, no Ebay involved. I have used both the Huanyang and the Powtrans VFD's and The latter is a far better thing by miles. There is nothing in this for me as all I will do is the intro. We have been using these for over two years and have had no manufacturing failures at all in around 30 units.

Hi Chris
Well if they are so much better then please do give us a link for them.

Powtran technology co.,ltd.,Powtran technology co.,ltd.

What is the cost of the powtran units Chris?

Thanks for the link!

Thanks Chris
I tried for about 5 minutes to get some sense from their website, but to no avail. If you click on the English flag then you just get a front page in mostly English. From there, you can click about like mad and get nowhere.
From the looks of their inverters they use the same casings as the Huanyangs do.
It APPEARS that they have a distributor in Brisbane. I found it impossible to confirm that from their website.

Edit: Oooo, some success. It appears that if you click on the map at the bottom of the page then you get English descriptions ... sometimes. I tried to repeat the journey and got trapped in a fractal universe.

Re-edit Try this link

Apologies in advance if the techie diatribe isn't quite appropriate for this
forum. However most other discussion boards seem to point to here
as the defacto source for trials/tribulations/information of these HY inverters.
As such I though it would be acceptable to add the following in hope
others may find it useful.

Originally Posted by Bob Willson

Hello uhmgawa and welcome to the site.

I have not heard of anybody producing a knock-off of this knock-off.

I've graduated beyond suspicion. When I contacted the seller specifically
calling out the lack of an actual electrical nameplate or *anything* visibly
indicating this was an HY02D223B unit, I was told the factory removed such
identification for "trademark" reasons. Hmm.. I was also offered a substantial
refund if I kept the unit.

So yes I probably have at least a knock-off of a knock-off. But like so many
China knock-offs the design is relatively open, leveraging commodity components
which is arguably how the knock-off came to be. Most of the silicon consists of
70/80's vintage cmos logic, opamps, and optocouplers. I wasn't too motivated to
free the board from the encapsulant glaze to reverse engineer a schematic and
capture greater detail, as I couldn't identify the controller called out as U7.

But I've since determined the uC used on the upper control board is a M30260F8AGP
of Mitsubishi design sold off to Renesas. It is a simple 16-bit SoC which in
addition to the usual assortment of peripherals provides 3 phase motor control.
It has 64KB flask and 2KB RWM, but is otherwise a fairly horrific SoC. The
semi good news is at least on my HY02D223B clone a 10 conductor depopulated
header exists which I believe pins out to the standard in-circuit programming
connector for this SoC series. In my brief reading the Mitsubishi/Renesas data
seems somewhat opaque in describing the protocol to read the SoC flash but in
the likely event it is locked (yes, to protect the knock-off firmware from theft), it
could take forever to guess the key. Still I'd be willing to have a go at doing so and
generating a full schematic if I can find a sacrificial HY02D223B or close cousin.

Though as the M30260F8AGP has abysmal rewrite endurance (100x) compared
to competitive devices (10000x), it would probably be better to displace it with a
more mainstream SoC for serious experimentation. That horrid 100x write endurance
is why there's a 93c56a SPI EEPROM tacked onto it for holding speed pd* parameters
and any data retained across power cycles.

If anyone else should be interested in unrolling this design more quickly for the
collective benefit of all, feel free to PM me via ths forum. Also if someone (ideally
in the US) may have a defunct HY02D223B series inverter looking for a new home,
I'd appreciate hearing about it.

Thanks.

Originally Posted by Bob Willson

I seriously doubt that you will get better value for money. They aren't the Rolls Royce of VFDs, but they seem to work fine.

I can only agree. In the US a 2.2KW version can be had for about $110.
That's impressive by any measure. I'd like to see the design openly
documented for at least service concerns to better leverage the low price
without fear of investing in throw-away equipment.

Originally Posted by Bob Willson

Thanks Chris
I tried for about 5 minutes to get some sense from their website, but to no avail. If you click on the English flag then you just get a front page in mostly English. From there, you can click about like mad and get nowhere.
From the looks of their inverters they use the same casings as the Huanyangs do.
It APPEARS that they have a distributor in Brisbane. I found it impossible to confirm that from their website.

Edit: Oooo, some success. It appears that if you click on the map at the bottom of the page then you get English descriptions ... sometimes. I tried to repeat the journey and got trapped in a fractal universe.

Re-edit Try this link

Bob, they definitely have no distributor in Oz as they have been after me to do it for over twelve months. From my dealings with them I am totally surprised at the instant response I get with any issue even to the point that I have written emails with a question and a few minutes later they are on the phone explaining things, try that with you Huanyang!

Advantages I have found...

Up to 10 profiles can be loaded

Program can be uploaded into the keyboard and downloaded so a keyboard can be programmed and put into another VFD and downloaded from the keyboard

Rotary control standard

Keyboard can be remote mounted via an ethernet cable, we have one 25 metres from the VFD

The factory is readily accessible for any problems and always gets back to us within hours and generally minutes via email or phone

They speak and write very good english

I don't have to search the internet for product, the reason I changed was the Huanyang at one time just about disappeared and i could not buy the one I wanted and I can't run a business if I can't buy a critical part.

The one disadvantage I experienced was the manual and the method of entering the program values. Others don't have an issue but I did.