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  1. #1
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    Default Large chest of drawers - WIP

    Hi Guys, Just about to start on a large set of draws like the ones in the picture. I am planning fairly traditional techniques, but am wondering about the centre vertical drawer divider. Obviously the horizontal drawer dividers are rebated into the sides of the carcass. With the centre vertical divider, would you traditionally make it thicker to cope with rebates from both sides? I was planning on the carcass being 3/4 inch thick, so it doesn't leave much of a rebate. Other options were to put the divider straight through from one side to the other and just rebate the dust boards on each side?? Any advice appreciated. Yowie.draws.jpg
    The world is a comedy to those that think, a tragedy to those that feel.

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  3. #2
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    Are U doing a large set of drawers, or a set of large drawers.
    oh for gawds sake shud up, go back to your safe room
    I would love to grow my own food, but I can not find bacon seeds

  4. #3
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    It can be the same size, as the integrity of the trenched piece is restorded once the trench is filled by the other piece running into it.

  5. #4
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by yowie View Post
    Hi Guys, Just about to start on a large set of draws like the ones in the picture. I am planning fairly traditional techniques, but am wondering about the centre vertical drawer divider. Obviously the horizontal drawer dividers are rebated into the sides of the carcass. With the centre vertical divider, would you traditionally make it thicker to cope with rebates from both sides? I was planning on the carcass being 3/4 inch thick, so it doesn't leave much of a rebate. Other options were to put the divider straight through from one side to the other and just rebate the dust boards on each side?? Any advice appreciated. Yowie.
    Several solutions:

    A rebate that is only 3-4 mm deep would be plenty to support the horizontals. That would still leave about 11 - 13 mm of timber in between - that's huge, specially if it's hardwood that you are using. Also I would not rebate all the way across the divider I would start it a good 25 mm from the front and back, and the width of the "rebate" about 4 mm narrower than the horizontal pieces. So that what you are doing is a long, shallow, mortice and tenon joint. You can also have several "mortice and tenons" say 4 mm deep by 15mm wide by 30 mm long. and 30 mm apart. that way the thin part of the vertical divider will not run all the way across.

    You could use several dowels and push them right through the vertical divider. You can make the dowels go as far into the ends of the horizontal shelves as you like... several hardwood dowels would provide enormous strength with a very small amount of timber loss from the divider and the end of the shelves. I don't know that this is "traditional" but it's the way I would do it. Dead easy too. all you need is a drill and some dowel points (or just measure carefully).

    You could have the horizontals go from one side of the carcass to the other, and have several small vertical dividers - again dowelled into place. I would not use a rebate this way, if you are going to support the unit with legs at each corner (it may sag and break in the middle). If you are going to rest the unit on a plinth that should still be fine because the middle of the unit will be supported from beneath.

    I am sure that what ever you decide will be fine. Hope you enjoy the process.

    Jorge

  6. #5
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    Default Another option

    Quote Originally Posted by GarciaJ View Post
    Several solutions:

    A rebate that is only 3-4 mm deep would be plenty to support the horizontals. That would still leave about 11 - 13 mm of timber in between - that's huge, specially if it's hardwood that you are using. Also I would not rebate all the way across the divider I would start it a good 25 mm from the front and back, and the width of the "rebate" about 4 mm narrower than the horizontal pieces. So that what you are doing is a long, shallow, mortice and tenon joint. You can also have several "mortice and tenons" say 4 mm deep by 15mm wide by 30 mm long. and 30 mm apart. that way the thin part of the vertical divider will not run all the way across.

    You could use several dowels and push them right through the vertical divider. You can make the dowels go as far into the ends of the horizontal shelves as you like... several hardwood dowels would provide enormous strength with a very small amount of timber loss from the divider and the end of the shelves. I don't know that this is "traditional" but it's the way I would do it. Dead easy too. all you need is a drill and some dowel points (or just measure carefully).

    You could have the horizontals go from one side of the carcass to the other, and have several small vertical dividers - again dowelled into place. I would not use a rebate this way, if you are going to support the unit with legs at each corner (it may sag and break in the middle). If you are going to rest the unit on a plinth that should still be fine because the middle of the unit will be supported from beneath.

    I am sure that what ever you decide will be fine. Hope you enjoy the process.

    Jorge
    I have just had another thought:

    If the horizontal dividers are only going to have an aesthetic, and not a structural role, then they don't have to run too deep into the carcass (they can be made from, say, 90 mm wide timber, or even narrower). this way they only need to be supported by a mortice and tenon towards the front of the carcass. This will also save you a LOT of timber.

    Like this:

    Euro carcass with comment.JPG

    A similar arrangement at the back of the carcass would provide structural support and provide support for the back panels.

    The only caveat is that your drawers will need to be supported by drawer runners on the sides of the drawers and the drawer runners will need to be mounted on the sides/vertical dividers (like the drawers in modern kitchen cupboards).

    Hope this helps

    Jorge

  7. #6
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    Cheers for the advice guys! You've given me a few options to contemplate. I've got a week to think about it so shall come back to it.
    The world is a comedy to those that think, a tragedy to those that feel.

  8. #7
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    20140313_181110.jpg20140327_145658.jpg20140327_165947.jpg

    Well I've made a start, panels for carcass completed. Now have to join them up...
    The world is a comedy to those that think, a tragedy to those that feel.

  9. #8
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    Looking good there yowie. Timber has cleaned up real nice.

    Keen to see how it all comes together.

  10. #9
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    Nice looking panels Yowie ! What timber ? And do you know what the original boards were ?
    Glenn Visca

  11. #10
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    It is all Jarrah, not sure what they were, just planks, you could see the saw marks from a very large diameter saw on the faces. Pulled them out of dads shed when he passed away so they could have been there for 30 years or so. Hopefully get some joining in this afternoon...
    The world is a comedy to those that think, a tragedy to those that feel.

  12. #11
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    If I was building that I would use a web frame rather than solid timber partitions. Uses less timber (by a long shot) and is much lighter. You can also build it frame and panel instead of solid if you do it that way, although it might be too late.

    Like this:

    11654_10.jpg

    Note in this picture the web frames have been filled in with plywood dust panels. You don't have to do that, you can leave them open. It just helps stop things getting caught when you open and close drawers. You also incorporate drawer runners into the web frames. I use something nice and greasy like tallow wood for that.
    "I don't practice what I preach because I'm not the kind of person I'm preaching to."

  13. #12
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    I am going to use frames with dust panels. Except for the central vertical divider between the lower three draws which is solid. The dust panels are a necessity as the wife always overstuffs the draws. No work today...
    The world is a comedy to those that think, a tragedy to those that feel.

  14. #13
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    This , Chest construction / how to do it traditionally is an interesting one .
    Traditionally it changed and evolved over a few centuries . What you are doing is solid sided not panel and frame like the joiners did it .

    The Horizontal rails were dovetailed in ,left and right, in the past . this holds the chest together . A middle divider would be done with halving joints .
    The back of the horizontal rail in Victorian times had a groove in the middle , the drawer runners had the tongue and the runner was fitted and glued at the front only . nailed or screwed at the back was one quick method if the sides were not trenched . The runner also had a groove, they sat it in a trench [ the better way] and held it in with the a dust board . it was the way of holding the runners apart ,tight in the trenches because they couldnt be glued from front to back .
    An earlier way was to dovetail the horizontal rail ,but the back of the rail had a rebate at the top which matched the thickness of the dust board , the dust board was glued in to the rebate and held in the side trench tight and high by a wedge,. the drawer ran on the dust board , this is a Queen Anne / Georgian way of doing it , beautiful, but a hard one to repair when they get deep wear marks which stop the drawer working. The English mainly covered the visible dovetails which can be seen on the sides of the chest front .Some American 18th century left it as a feature .

    I would always recommend either doing a scale drawing and / or a full set out to get your head around it . A front and side elevation and a plan. Fully trained cabinet makers know how important this step is, in not getting things wrong . No matter which way your building it .

    Regards Rob

  15. #14
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    Finally managed some time in the shed after a few weeks fishing and diving down South. Half blind dovetailed the base into the side panels. First time working on such large panels so a bit of a learning curve for me. Unfortunately managed to poke the screwdriver bit in my drill straight through my thumbnail yesterday, then dropped a 3 foot length of 3x3 inch jarrah on my big toe today, have called it quits until my coordinationreturns. Next step is to sliding dovetail the centre divider into the base and then do the slots for the draw dividers.20140505_160639.jpg
    The world is a comedy to those that think, a tragedy to those that feel.

  16. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by yowie View Post

    Unfortunately managed to poke the screwdriver bit in my drill straight through my thumbnail yesterday, then dropped a 3 foot length of 3x3 inch jarrah on my big toe today, have called it quits until my coordination returns.
    Yowie Yowie ! yowie .



    what were you wearing on your feet ?

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