Thread: WIP Diminished stile French Doors

I'm turning this thread into a WIP. My concept for the project is to make doors to fit a 2020x860 opening. Because of it's position I want to make it as a pair of narrow width doors. I'm not sure yet if I'll hang both in the French Door manner, or perhaps I will hang them as a bifold.

Not having any better suggestions, and because this is very much a speculative build, I've located some cheap Slash Pine that looks like it might be suitable and wont break the bank if things don't work out.

Given the material at hand I've decided to go for a design using diminished stiles. I can't find much design guidance on set out for this style of door, but I've come up with the following concept that is friendly to the material I'll be working with and that is also in sympathy with the existing house doors.

doors.jpg
The slash pine is old twisty recycled 70x45s. I think I can machine it and straighten it up to 65x35 for the stiles. The rest of the panels and bottoms of the outside stiles will also need to be glued up from that stuff.

Fuzzie

The french doors on my place have a wider lock rail than you have drawn, something in the order of 4 x the width of the top rail, and have the trapezoidal shape on both styles. see red line on attached

Hi Ian,

Thanks for your thoughts. I sketched it first with full length skinny mid stiles to see how it looks. I was influenced by this picture from an American book on "Doors and Entryways". The pic is of a bifold door made to fit a standard door opening and matched the common 6 panel doors there. I was wondering how the same treatment would look for a glazed door. Americans don't seem to do diminished stiles much, which probably accounts for the lack of google hits. Making all the stiles diminished probably does look more balanced when they are glazed above.
img079.jpg

I replaced all the hollow core doors in this house with 4 panel solid doors about 10 years ago. Those doors came from Doors Plus and I'm matching the dimensions of the lock and bottom rails to them, not classic Victorian proportions.
IMG_1175.JPG

As an alternative I'm contemplating reproducing these doors from a prior house we lived in in Brisbane. They are 1940's vintage. These would not have diminished stiles, but be 90mm full height. The problem there is that they would be a bit more difficult to glue up from my 70x45s since I only have 5 at 2.1m and some 1.2m shorts. I'm not sure using 65mm wide full height would work and allow for enough meat for rebates and handles.
img337.jpg

Cheers, Franklin

Hi Fuzzie,
Don't forget that with only 2 doors hung bi-fold you will lose about 100mm of opening to allow for the way the hinges work so you're 860 opening becomes 760 or a little less.
Regards Rod.

Hi Rod,

I'm struggling to remember exactly how the Yeronga house folding doors were hinged (it was 20 years ago), but it was definitely with basic butt hinges, probably with narrow leaves. The slash pine is relatively light so I'd expect standard hinges will also work here. I wouldn't be using a tracked system for these doors and I can't see how I'd lose much more than an extra door thickness off the opening clearance.

My main installation issue is that the door frame is set into a double brick wall. Depending on clearances, I might have to find and fit parliament hinges on the jamb to get the doors to fold back as far as possible - if I go with a bi-fold.

Cheers, Franklin

Hi Franklin,
Only mention it so you are aware (may well have allowed for already)of the reduction in opening admittedly it will be less without hanger's and bifold hinges,only twice the thickness of you're doors plus hinge gaps about 75mm But as you say with parliament hinges you could be able to open them right back against the face of the wall to give the full opening.
Regards Rod.

I understand your timber constraints.
If you decide on the Victorian style, the top of the lock rail would be about hip height -- say 750 to 800 mm -- above the floor.

This is going to be a slow build as it is only getting a look in at the bottom of the honey do list. I've settled on a final design with diminished stiles all round and rebated at the meeting stiles. I've found another couple of sticks suitable to bulk out the meeting stiles, although I'm not sure about the depth of the rebate, 20mm might be a bit fat. I'm leaning towards hanging these as a bifold set, for functionality as well as probably being easier than trying to find a rebated lockset.
door2.jpg

Fuzzie

Are you looking at something a bit like these?

Simon's French Doors 008.jpg

Let me know if they are any help or you want dimensions.

Regards
Paul

Looks close doesn't it Paul? I would be interested to know the dimensions of the rebate and bead. As for the rest of it, I'll be mainly matching the other frame and panel doors currently in the house.

Cheers, Franklin

I'll measure up for you tomorrow. There are two pairs of doors and the only difference is in the bead.

Regards
Paul

This project finally got a timeslice today. I think I might have been a bit optimistic attempting this with just a few $ worth of recycled slash pine framing. So what's new?

Although the studs initially looked reasonably clear I found it a challenge to pick them over to work around the knots and defects. All elements will have to be glued up one way or another. Today I cut out and glued up the stuff destined to be the rails.

slashpine.jpgglueup1.jpg

All the blanks are now ready. Each hinge stile was glued up from 2 studs while the meeting stiles needed 3. Next step will be to bring them all down to final thickness and then I'll have to do something about a panel for the bottoms, perhaps pallet timber will do if I can find some nice clear white pine ones.
blanks.jpg

It's getting close to having to commit to the final design. I hadn't quite decided on whether to build a bifold or french door solution, but I was in Masters yesterday and all the door hardware was 70% off. I picked up some parliament hinges for $4 that will work with the bifold idea, so that decision has now been made. Before I can layout the mid rail shoulders I now have to decide on what moulding style to run around the glazing.