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  1. #1
    Join Date
    May 1999
    Location
    Grovedale (Geelong) Victoria
    Posts
    11,770

    Default Hide Glue is back at U-Beaut Polishes

    I noticed a bit of posting about Hide Glue recently and thought this might be of some interest.

    ___________________________________________________


    I'm currently working on a new upgrader shop for U-Beaut Polishes and after 2+ years without hide glue I'm pleased to announce that we now have hide glue again.

    Davis Gelatine (Leiner Davis) stopped making the Glue here in Aus a number of years ago and had production of same done at their facility in NZ however the factory burned down, back in January 2018 and all that was left was what was in stock.

    Anyway.... Our new Glue is granulated and not the pearl glue we used to have. We tried sourcing a number of glues and settled on this one which seems to be the best of the lot for for woodworking and what we use it for.

    Unfortunately it will be a bit more expensive than the old glue but it's a better glue in the long run.

    Below is the blurb from the new site: Some of the info taken from Leiner Davis and some from me.

    ___________________________________________________

    HG25%.jpg

    Granulated Hide Glue

    250 Bloom/Gram Strength

    In plastic bag in box with
    instructions for use.
    400gm

    Ideal for woodworkers, luthiers
    and for many other applications
    For centuries, hide glue has existed for use as glue, but also for use in wood finishing, gesso, decorative finishes, as a size for artists canvases and even mural paintings.


    Today hide glue is sparsely industrialized, but still used in making and restoring objects. In recent years, yellow and white PVA glues have been used in woodworking applications as a replacement for hide glue (protein glue) under the assumption they provide a stronger and longer lasting bond. This assumption is incorrect and, for those in the antique restoration, furniture construction and restoration, marquetry (applying pieces of wood veneer to a structure or form to create decorative designs) and lutherie (musical instrument making) fields, it is important to understand why hot hide glue is still a superior adhesive solution.


    Using PVA glues, a wood to wood bond will vary greatly, depending on the porosity, clamping time and other factors. A percentage of the water content will evaporate or be absorbed before setting occurs. That process leads to a loss of adhesive thickness and, if not under consistent pressure the whole time, results in a weaker bond. Hot hide glue, in contrast, sets by gelling quickly, dependent on temperature and time to set. From that point, no clamping is necessary and the bond continues to get tighter and tighter. The result is a 100%, well conforming airtight joint.


    Hide glue, unlike PVA glues, will never set up in one part of the bond and remain wet in another. Hide glues are much stronger than the wood itself whereas PVA glue joints are not. PVA glues also create another problem called “joint creep” since the bonds are stretchable. Given steady pressure, like sitting in a chair for example, the pressured joints will stretch and other joints will be stressed because of that movement. Chairs constructed or repaired using PVA glues do not last as long due to this “joint creep” dynamic since the joints are literally being pulled apart.


    On the other hand, hide glue provides a rock hard bond that does not stretch under normal pressure and thus the integrity of the chair is retained. The assumption that a “flexible” bond is stronger is an incorrect one as well. Unless each joint is hard in a chair or any other application dependent on the stability of its own wood, every joint is at risk and will eventually fail. Hot hide glue is extremely versatile on its own or, by adding particular additives, can greatly expand the range of applications for usage. The hide glue bond is molecular; a chemical bond primarily, and a mechanical bond, secondarily. PVA glues only bond mechanically. And since they are stretchable, PVA glues only work in applications where only momentary shear forces are at work. If shear forces are continual, PVA glue bonds will creep, slide apart, and break relatively quickly.

    REVERSIBILITY

    The reversibility property of hide glue for wood applications provides an advantage over other types of glue.


    This provides greater flexibility for not only new jobs, but also for the repair and restoration of old ones. Common wood applications that benefit from hide glue’s reversibility property range from the production of musical instruments, furniture and applying veneers of varying sizes and shapes.


    The secrets to reversibility are heat and water. Once you get water and heat to the glue, it will liquefy regardless of how old the glue is or when it was applied.


    The hide glue can be fully removed using a hot wet cloth with no impact on the integrity of the original wood. This helps correct defects in production or, for repair and restoration, allows for easy removal of the hide glue. Re-application of new hide glue for a new, strong bond is a simple process that is just not possible with other types of glues.

    Quick way to reverse a glued joint on chair and table legs and many other joints:

    With a hypodermic needle and syringe, inject Methylated Spirits (ethanol/denatured alcohol) into the joint and leave it sit for a short time. The glue will crystallise and a sharp wrap at the joint with a rubber mallet should break it apart easily. The crystallised glue can be removed with heat and water.


    Another great feature of hide glue is its development of a very strong green tack and fast bond. This wood glue greatly speeds assembly and in good clean well matched joints may even eliminates much of the need for clamping and pressing.


    Hide glue is also compatible with wood stains. Once other liquid glues touch raw wood, the pores are filled and the glue cannot be removed. As a result, wood stains cannot penetrate evenly. This is the reason for inconsistent stain finishes on wood projects assembled with modern glue. Hide glue, in contrast, is water soluble and can be completely removed using a hot wet cloth. Once the hide glue is removed, the wood stain will penetrate the wood uniformly.

    ___________________________________________________


    There's more information on mixing and using this glue can be found on the Hide Glue Information Sheet
    or on pages 39 to 42 in the current version of "A Polishers Handbook" similar in previous editions

    Hope this information is of interest to some.

    Cheers - Neil




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  3. #2
    Join Date
    May 1999
    Location
    Grovedale (Geelong) Victoria
    Posts
    11,770

    Default

    Page for Hide Glue is back up and updated on the old web site. New site coming some time this month.... Been threatening that for almost 12 months now.

    Anyway. For what it's worth, new page is here >HIDE GLUE<


  4. #3
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    Hobart, Tas
    Posts
    1,117

    Default

    This is great to know. I've been wanting to pick up some hide glue for a while now, so good to know you are supplying it. Sadly I only put an order through for more Hard Shellac a couple of days ago, so this will have to wait until my next order.

  5. #4
    Join Date
    Jun 2021
    Location
    Melbourne
    Posts
    8

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by ubeaut View Post
    Page for Hide Glue is back up and updated on the old web site. New site coming some time this month.... Been threatening that for almost 12 months now.

    Anyway. For what it's worth, new page is here >HIDE GLUE<

    Is its available for purchase? I can't seem to find it on the order sheet.

  6. #5
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Location
    Sydney Upper North Shore
    Posts
    4,360

  7. #6
    Join Date
    May 1999
    Location
    Grovedale (Geelong) Victoria
    Posts
    11,770

    Default

    Thanks for letting me know.
    Sorry folks. I knew I'd forget something. Doh!

    Well n truly under the hammer at the moment. I think the "Oldtimers" is beginning to set in.

    I'll get to it later on today.

    Cheers

  8. #7
    Join Date
    Feb 2015
    Location
    Hobart
    Age
    75
    Posts
    492

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by ubeaut View Post
    Thanks for letting me know.
    Sorry folks. I knew I'd forget something. Doh!

    Well n truly under the hammer at the moment. I think the "Oldtimers" is beginning to set in.

    I'll get to it later on today.

    Cheers

    Couldn't hear, what did you say?!??

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