Thread: BOX JOINT BIT HEIGHT PROBLEMS

Originally Posted by OLDBROWNDOG

Im using the latest model triton router table

Answering your own question?

Originally Posted by doug3030

Answering your own question?

Not exactly, is that a dig at the triton?

Hi,
Try getting an extension piece, that way you can bring it right up to the bottom of your jig and have the length of the bit available.
I use the Triton box jig so do not have that problem.
Regards

I am not familiar with the design of the later model Triton tables. How thick is the section between the top of the table and where the router mounts on to it?
Does the end of the collet on the router come to about the same height as the base plate of the router when fully plunged?
Are you able to attach any photos of your setup?

Ok will attach some pics later today.. Is there such thing as a spacer/ extender? Something maybe 10mm long you drop into the collet to extend the reach of the bit? Though I imagine that's dangerous as you have less grip on the bit shank..

Hi,
They are some thing like this

A collet with a shank, some like this one and others with a more normal griping action.
Regards

Originally Posted by A Duke

Hi,
They are some thing like this

A collet with a shank, some like this one and others with a more normal griping action.
Regards

Not sure why having a box joint jig saves you from that problem..

anyway ive done some research & it seems there is a collet extension bit from carbatec
http://www.carbatec.com.au/router-co...tension_c10002

But it needs a variable speed router which the 3600BR makita is not...
DAMN!

heres a pic of my problem.photo.jpg


So i need to buy a router that fits this bloody table it seems... any suggestions...

Hi,
A Triton router of course. That router seems rather low, are you sure the stops etc are all clear and letting it get full travel. the Triton jig works with the job on the table and does not have an extra base in-between, so that helps
Good luck with it all

By a process of elimination:

Is the router fully plunged?

Are the plunge rods visible when plunged? They shouldn't be.

Is the "turret" setting preventing you from depthing any further.

Is the Router correctly mounted on the router table/carriage?

Is the router table top correctly seated on the frame?

Is the bit inserted into the collet too far? It MUST be at least 3/4 depth for safety, but shouldn't ever be fully pushed home, as this prevents correct collet tightening.

If you still have problems, then there's a few alternative solutions:

Some bit mnfr's. make long-shank bits for router tables. Trend & Carb-i-tool (those with an "X" & "XX" prefix) spring readily to mind.

As mentioned, you can also get bits with longer cutting edges.

You can replace the collet & nut with a model-specific "eliminator" type chuck. Yes, they call them chucks, not collets because the bit is held in a different manner. The Eliminator Chuck and the Musclechuck are a couple of examples. I have had success with the former in one of my DeWalts. Mine protrudes sufficiently far through the base that I can exchange bits through the base while fully plunged & inverted. It negates the need for the spindle lock & spanner, instead using a ball-ended allen key.

You can purchase an extension collet from a variety of sources. This is merely another collet premounted onto a short shank which fits into your existing collet in the same way any other bit would. They are specific to your particular collet diameter. There may be issues with concentricity and vibration/balance with these.

It might be worth taking the router out of the table and going through the first few checks that Ratbag has mentioned. Having it out of the table in clear view will allow you to see if there is anything preventing you from getting full plunge depth such as stops, turret, etc.

Originally Posted by OLDBROWNDOG

Not exactly, is that a dig at the triton?

Well call it a dig at the triton router table.

I am a big fan of triton products except one. Guess which one? While triton products have their limitations they generally make up for it in another way, like portability or ease of setup and use or something. not so the router table.

Anyway, more pertinent to your question, I own three makita routers in addition to my two triton routers. Both the triton routers will plunge further through the triton table than the makita ones do. (or at least did, when I still had a Triton router table).

A variable speed router is far more useful in a table than a single speed one. It allows you to use bigger diameter bits when you need to. You may wish to consider hunting down a variable speed model.

Cheers

Doug

You're right. I had the first triton router table. Model 100?? It was great. You used the sawbenches' fence, with a couple of steel?? subfences attached to the infeed/outfeed sides. The outfeed was micro-adjustable with screws.

I must have churned out kilometers of T&G flooring, VJ lining & other assorted mouldings. Often I used the bit as a width device too, passing the timber between the bit & fence! This breaks every safety rule in the book, including common sense, but was the only failsafe way at my disposal to ensure exact uniformity of width and therefore accurate butt jointing in flooring etc.

Sold it eventually, buying the "series 2000" version. Big mistake! The later version is even worse. Still looking for a better table than my original though.

Originally Posted by Ratbag

By a process of elimination:

Is the router fully plunged?

Yes it is

Are the plunge rods visible when plunged? They shouldn't be.

Nope

Is the "turret" setting preventing you from depthing any further.

Nope

Is the Router correctly mounted on the router table/carriage?

Well thats an issue with these tables.. you cant mount it directly to the plate because the damn thing isnt flat.. So you have to mount it on these metal brackets they provide which make it sit about 4mm off the plate.. also because the clamps that hold it on arent long enough you have another issue holding it tight.

Is the router table top correctly seated on the frame?

yep.

Is the bit inserted into the collet too far? It MUST be at least 3/4 depth for safety, but shouldn't ever be fully pushed home, as this prevents correct collet tightening.

I have pulled it up a bit thanks for that info.. got another 5-6mm out of that...

If you still have problems, then there's a few alternative solutions:

Some bit mnfr's. make long-shank bits for router tables. Trend & Carb-i-tool (those with an "X" & "XX" prefix) spring readily to mind.

As mentioned, you can also get bits with longer cutting edges.

You can replace the collet & nut with a model-specific "eliminator" type chuck. Yes, they call them chucks, not collets because the bit is held in a different manner. The Eliminator Chuck and the Musclechuck are a couple of examples. I have had success with the former in one of my DeWalts. Mine protrudes sufficiently far through the base that I can exchange bits through the base while fully plunged & inverted. It negates the need for the spindle lock & spanner, instead using a ball-ended allen key.

You can purchase an extension collet from a variety of sources. This is merely another collet premounted onto a short shank which fits into your existing collet in the same way any other bit would. They are specific to your particular collet diameter. There may be issues with concentricity and vibration/balance with these.

I think im gonna use some 4mm ply for the router jig base plate, instead of 10mm.. i think it'll still be rigid enough & now that i have around 27mm sticking out I can route the depth of 22mm into the material I was after.. hopefully it'll work...

But yeh i should probably get a triton router to suit the table.. or dare i say, ditch all & get a festool...

Is the Router correctly mounted on the router table/carriage?

Well thats an issue with these tables.. you cant mount it directly to the plate because the damn thing isnt flat.. So you have to mount it on these metal brackets they provide which make it sit about 4mm off the plate.. also because the clamps that hold it on aren't long enough you have another issue holding it tight.


Some of this doesn't seem right. I've only had limited experience with Triton Router Table/Jigsaw Plates, and only ever mounted one router (an Elu). Why do you need to have anything between the router's base & the carriage? My tables were the "type 100 Router/Jigsaw plate & the series 2000. My Elu 177 had a pretty thick baseplate casting (1/2"??), but I can't recall any difficulties in mounting.

From memory (I admit its getting a little hazy these days) once the router is optimally located on the carriage, centred around the hole, you permanently fix four "lugs" around the outside of the router's baseplate casting trough the Triton's carriage. This is to allow you to easily remove & accurately replace the router for handwork.

Extra clips, lugs, whatever are then used for securing the base casting to the carriage in a "quick release" manner. Do they have wingnut tightening or something? The concept is that the Router should be held firmly by the baseplate casting to the Triton carriage, but be easily removed and quickly and accurately replaced.

I think the key point is that the brackets are meant to go around the base of the router: definitely not under. Are you sure your machine is mounted correctly? Unless I'm reading this wrong, which wouldn't be the first time, this could also be part of the problem.