Results 1 to 10 of 10
  1. #1
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Location
    Burpengary
    Posts
    165

    Default Dust Collection Setup

    Hi All,

    Im currently in the process of setting up my "dream shop" the space i have is 9m x 9.2m. I have a carbatec ub 3100eck which has options for 3 x 4inch round ports or if i remove the 3 way coupler a 200mm round port.

    The machines i want to attach are table saw, compound mitre saw, jointer/thicknesser combo (SCM scm l'invincibile which i have to make dust shroud for), band saw, combo drum/disc sander & router table. As well as some sort of hood/shroud for my drill press and wood lathe, smaller hose for palm sander etc.

    I've been mucking around with machine position but i don't have a very good understanding of dust extraction.

    how long can the pipes/hose be running to the machines?

    what would the best option be for duct hose/pipe size? should i try to adapt the 200mm port to make a large backbone and branch off it or use the 3 x 4 inch ports to run different directions to different groups of machine.


    Thanks

    MArty

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    Perth
    Posts
    23,290

    Default

    Sorry to appear negative but I'd say that your dreams are unlikely to be met with that dust collector in that size shed.
    For the same $ you could have purchased a ClearVue which would have been better up to the task.

    To summarise the dust collection forum:
    Ensure the DC is located outside OR in an airtight cupboard that is vented outside.
    This means you can remove the filter and improve the flow
    Ditch the 4" ports on the DC
    Make up a 8" to 6" adapter or buy one from Timbecon
    Run 6" ducting to all machinery (4" ducting has ~1/3rd the air flow of 6" ducting)
    Open up all the dust outlet ports on machines to utilise 6" ducting

    For particulars invest some time into reading the Dust forum - it will save you far more time than you spend reading it.

    If you decide to stay with your DC given the size of your shed you will need to
    - add additional ventilation to vent escaped fine dust.
    - locate your DC and machinery on one end/side of the shed so that ducting lengths are minimised eg <~6m total run from DC to machine

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Location
    Burpengary
    Posts
    165

    Default

    Thanks Bob

    your reply was not taken as negative, i know its not the greatest duct collector i could own. I bought it new in 2008....well before i heard about ClearVue. To date i have only used it to connect my table saw and jointer via a 3m long 4" flex hose.

    Budget is pretty tight so unfortunately i will have to stick with what i currently have.

    Building it a separate room is a great idea and ill definitely plan the shop around that.

    Thanks for the advice

    Marty

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Elizabeth Bay / Oberon NSW
    Age
    71
    Posts
    551

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by BobL View Post
    - locate your DC and machinery on one end/side of the shed so that ducting lengths are minimised eg <~6m total run from DC to machine
    Bob,

    I'm in the middle of installing a fixed pipe extraction system into my shed. To this end I've now built a separate 3x3 metre acoustically insulated shed sitting 300mm off the back wall of my 7x5 metre workshop. Noise abatement is the reason I went for a discrete structure. I've bought a ClearVue Max which will exhaust to the outside.

    I was intrigued about the reasoning behind your maximum 6m run from machine to extractor. My longest run from the bandsaw will be about 9m including the flexible pipe so now you have me thinking about its efficiency. Reconfiguring the workshop is not an attractive thought.

    mick

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    Saskatoon, SK, Canada.
    Posts
    1,046

    Default

    The original poster's machine is 3hp. Your CV-Max is 5hp assuming you are running it with a variable frequency drive. It will have no issues with your 9 metre run as long as you aren't strangling it with small ducts.

    Pete

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Elizabeth Bay / Oberon NSW
    Age
    71
    Posts
    551

    Default

    Thanks Pete. Good to have reassurance. VFD? Yes. It's going to take a while to convert the existing 100 & 125 mm machine outlets to 150mm but I can always increase airflow by adjusting another blast gate downstream if necessary.

    I'm still interested to discover why a shorter run is better. Given that the volume and velocity should not change, I'm left to conclude that flow turbulence or lack of it might preclude longer runs.

    mick

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    Perth
    Posts
    23,290

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Glider View Post
    Thanks Pete. Good to have reassurance. VFD? Yes. It's going to take a while to convert the existing 100 & 125 mm machine outlets to 150mm but I can always increase airflow by adjusting another blast gate downstream if necessary.

    I'm still interested to discover why a shorter run is better. Given that the volume and velocity should not change, I'm left to conclude that flow turbulence or lack of it might preclude longer runs.

    mick
    Wall friction increases with longer runs but that tends to be a minor effect. Usually longer runs contain more bends and junctions which add to turbulence and all that increases flow. As I have indicated many times 6m is just a guide for 3HP machines , same as 3m is just a guide for 2HP DCs. But there are heaps of other factors to consider and if you have to use longer runs they so be it.

    FWIW my longest run is 12m to the underside of my TS. This was done to get the ducting feed under the concrete floor and keep the area around the TS clear of ducting. I also have a 9m run to my DP but that doesn't need much flow anyway as DPs don't make a lot of dust.

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Location
    Burpengary
    Posts
    165

    Default

    Ive been looking at the CV website and the Bill Pentz static calculator. I must be doing something wrong, if i add a small amount of 4 inch either straight pipe or flex hose...no bends or Y's it goes over 12" WC which is the recommended maximum on the spreadsheed. How much static pressure does each 4 & 6 inch bend add and is there an easy calculation i can use for straight pipe?

    What would the estimated static pressure be on a system like im planning? Im re-planing my layout to reduce the pipe runs to be as short as possible and will use the 8" to 6" reducer to run the main line.

    I cant seem to find many reviews/info on the DC i have...all i can find is they aren't as good ad the CV. Understand there is a difference in HP but what is the major difference that makes them not comparable?

    Thanks

    Marty

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Feb 2016
    Location
    Perth WA Australia
    Posts
    511

    Default

    in a nutshell it doesn't pull as much air, due to numerous factors such as smaller impeller, not enough power, inefficient cyclone design which then leads to poor chip separation which then leads to clogged filters which further hurts extraction.

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    Perth
    Posts
    23,290

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by stevo81 View Post
    Ive been looking at the CV website and the Bill Pentz static calculator. I must be doing something wrong, if i add a small amount of 4 inch either straight pipe or flex hose...no bends or Y's it goes over 12" WC which is the recommended maximum on the spreadsheed. How much static pressure does each 4 & 6 inch bend add and is there an easy calculation i can use for straight pipe?
    It doesn't surprise me. 4" ducting is very restrictive and it sounds like you are using too high an expected air flow and air speeds. What Air flow and speeds are you using ?

    What would the estimated static pressure be on a system like im planning? Im re-planing my layout to reduce the pipe runs to be as short as possible and will use the 8" to 6" reducer to run the main line. I cant seem to find many reviews/info on the DC i have...all i can find is they aren't as good ad the CV. Understand there is a difference in HP but what is the major difference that makes them not comparable?
    If you provide a photo of the DC, the size of the impeller is and the motor HP I can give you an idea of the pressure it can generate..

Similar Threads

  1. Dust collection advice for new setup
    By Newtown in forum DUST EXTRACTION
    Replies: 9
    Last Post: 12th Dec 2017, 05:25 PM
  2. A.C.T. 100mm 4" Dust Collection collection
    By woodPixel in forum WOODWORK - Tools & Machinery
    Replies: 3
    Last Post: 27th Aug 2017, 11:55 AM
  3. Replies: 10
    Last Post: 5th Dec 2016, 08:50 PM
  4. Dust Extractor Setup
    By jimmcelwaine in forum DUST EXTRACTION
    Replies: 6
    Last Post: 4th Apr 2010, 10:49 PM
  5. Dust extractor setup
    By Graha in forum DUST EXTRACTION
    Replies: 7
    Last Post: 22nd Apr 2006, 12:28 AM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •