Thread: Extraction layout - Help...

Have you considered a Clearview or CV Max? clearvueoz.com.au – CVMAX Cyclone

Most seem to use PVC.

Your Layout plans seems OK.... but it leaves out some Y junctions handy for opening and inspection - clearing blockages etc.

BobL is the resident expert here on this topic.

Blast gates positioning etc are also important factors.

Dust Collection Research - Cyclone Plans

You can see a lot of detail about how Cyclones work at this website

This links shows some PVC ducting layout ideas / suggestions.

Corrimal Community Men's Shed Cyclone Dust Collection System - Automatic Blast Valves

Good luck with it.

Brilliant. Thanks for the advice - quick response too!

I'm kind of locked in with a machine from Carbatec - I'm getting a fair bit there and the finance company prefers one invoice for it all.

I've had a quick skim of the links - thanks very much.

I'll pour over them in detail now.

Cheers,

cam

Originally Posted by Cam.H

1. What is the best solution for 'plumbing' this all together?
A hard mainline up and over the top with flexible hose down and through a blast gate to each machine?

Yep, a larger trunk line diameter (eg 8 or 9") running past the machines, 6" ducting either direct to as close as possible to the machine, only minimal length flex where fixed ducting cannot be used. The ideal place for the bast gates are on the 6" line as close as possible to the trunk (ie not down near the machine). This may require some sort of pull line or lever to swap the blast gate and of course sometimes even this is not possible so placing it where it is convenient is another option

2. If the above is the way to go, how would this work seeing as UB-3100ECK has 3x 4" inlets and the CT-703 has 1x 200mm inlet.

Would you run 3 x 4" lines and then split them across the machines with 'T or Y' joins?
OR, with the CT-703 would you run a 200mm mainline and then duct each machine through a 200mm to 100mm reducer 'T' join piped down through a blast gate to the machine?

The second option is MUCH better but don't use any 4" ducting if 6" is a possibility- 4" ducting is a dog - read on.
Don't used T junction, use Y's and then ad a 45º bend to get the 90º bend.
It sounds like you need to read most of this forum as it will save you a lot of heartache and give you maximum airflow
Also you are wasting your dough using the 4" ports on machinery. To get the full benefit of a big dust extractor the ports must be opened up to 6" where possible - check out what John Samuel has done on this.
Sometimes 6" porting is just not possible so as short as possible multiple 4" lines coming direct from 6" ducting can be used. This is typically done on bandsaws.
Other examples
On Table saws a 6" and a 4" duct is used simultaneously
Lathes use 1 x 6" port as close as possible to the work.

3. What do I need to do this? PVC? Aluminium? What fittings?

If you get a quote for sheet metal ducting make sure you are sitting down when you read it.
PVC is not cheap either but if you look around for cheaper irrigation and stormwater pipe stores you can do far better pricewise than the big hardware stores.

4. Are there people who do this professionally? Who are they? Are you one?

For sheet metal ducting there are - check out the yellow pages. Plumbers will install PVC ducting but you will have to tell them what to do as they generally know nothing about dust extraction, and the last time I got a plumber in I felt I had my testicles extracted through my wallet.

For advice post here or send me a PM.

I would avoid the carbatech cyclones as they are (~40 year) old designs and like everyone else their claimed airflows are about double real world airflow.
It doesn't matter what 2-5HP DC is used, in the end the typical air flows through 6" ducting is around 1200 - 1350 cfm, while for 4" its between 400 and 430 cfm.

In contrast the clearvue is a more recent design and the claim air flows are real - a much better deal all round but you may need a little "roll your own" installation or pay a sparky, who also might not know much, and you may also have to pay them to tell them what to do!

You might get more local help if you changed your WWF Location to something more specific than Australia.

Hi Cam, there are many good examples of DE systems and upgrades in the this forum, here's one I did for a fellow woodworker a little while back, https://www.woodworkforums.com/f200/d...rkshop-172717/




Pete

You might get more local help if you changed your WWF Location to something more specific than Australia.

I seem to recall Cam posting previously that he's located in Brisbane Bob if that any assistance.

Originally Posted by Timless Timber

I seem to recall Cam posting previously that he's located in Brisbane Bob if that any assistance.

If that is the case he should see if he can go see John Samuel's setup.

Originally Posted by BobL

Yep, a larger trunk line diameter (eg 8 or 9") running past the machines, 6" ducting either direct to as close as possible to the machine, only minimal length flex where fixed ducting cannot be used. The ideal place for the bast gates are on the 6" line as close as possible to the trunk (ie not down near the machine). This may require some sort of pull line or lever to swap the blast gate and of course sometimes even this is not possible so placing it where it is convenient is another option


The second option is MUCH better but don't use any 4" ducting if 6" is a possibility- 4" ducting is a dog - read on.
Don't used T junction, use Y's and then ad a 45º bend to get the 90º bend.
It sounds like you need to read most of this forum as it will save you a lot of heartache and give you maximum airflow
Also you are wasting your dough using the 4" ports on machinery. To get the full benefit of a big dust extractor the ports must be opened up to 6" where possible - check out what John Samuel has done on this.
Sometimes 6" porting is just not possible so as short as possible multiple 4" lines coming direct from 6" ducting can be used. This is typically done on bandsaws.
Other examples
On Table saws a 6" and a 4" duct is used simultaneously
Lathes use 1 x 6" port as close as possible to the work.

If you get a quote for sheet metal ducting make sure you are sitting down when you read it.
PVC is not cheap either but if you look around for cheaper irrigation and stormwater pipe stores you can do far better pricewise than the big hardware stores.


For sheet metal ducting there are - check out the yellow pages. Plumbers will install PVC ducting but you will have to tell them what to do as they generally know nothing about dust extraction, and the last time I got a plumber in I felt I had my testicles extracted through my wallet.

For advice post here or send me a PM.

I would avoid the carbatech cyclones as they are (~40 year) old designs and like everyone else their claimed airflows are about double real world airflow.
It doesn't matter what 2-5HP DC is used, in the end the typical air flows through 6" ducting is around 1200 - 1350 cfm, while for 4" its between 400 and 430 cfm.

In contrast the clearvue is a more recent design and the claim air flows are real - a much better deal all round but you may need a little "roll your own" installation or pay a sparky, who also might not know much, and you may also have to pay them to tell them what to do!

You might get more local help if you changed your WWF Location to something more specific than Australia.

Cam I cannot add much to what BobL has told you in this post. I am always happy to speak with anyone interested in the Clearvue product and will do everything I can to help. I cannot endorse the comment about using 6" direct to the machines enough.

I confirm earlier posts relating to the issue of using Y junctions not T ones as they do so much to reduce airflow losses. Good luck with this project.

Shedman

Thanks again everyone. After much advice from here and some more research I've decided to go with the Clear Vue system.

I now need to make the 4-6" adjustments to the machines and install the ducting.

I'll be posting progress pics along the way for advice and to hopefully shed some light for other new setups too.

Cheers!

You definitely won't be sorry Cam. The clearview is a bit of fiddle to assemble if you are a bit ham fisted like me but the results are spectacular - practically no dust in the shed! I have a friend who recently bought the 2hp Carbatec cyclone and in my opinion the results are pretty marginal by comparison. The extra $300 to $400 for the clearview is well worth it.

Originally Posted by safari

You definitely won't be sorry Cam. The clearview is a bit of fiddle to assemble if you are a bit ham fisted like me but the results are spectacular - practically no dust in the shed! I have a friend who recently bought the 2hp Carbatec cyclone and in my opinion the results are pretty marginal by comparison. The extra $300 to $400 for the clearview is well worth it.

The 2HP carbatech is especially underpowered for what users expect from it.

One thing about the carbatech cyclone filters is that they are by far the best filter I have ever measured in terms of Filter efficiency (I have not measured the clearvue filters but I would expect them to be similar). However, no matter how good the filters are if the filters or filter housing or seals develop a leak they will be next to useless which is why venting outside is the way to go.