Thread: help with dc upgrade

Others have much more expertise than me, but I think the 1hp sucker will be the limiting factor to start. It simply won't be able to pull enough air through the pipes to move the dust.

But I will watch with interest for advice from my more learned colleagues.

Trav

Originally Posted by Blazk

Hey all I'm after a new DC for the work shop. At the moment im runnig a 1hp woodfast and what I think is a 1hp dc-7?. It will be vented outside as I don't have anywhere outside where I can store it, so the DC will be inside. The main machines that will be running off it will be table saw, jointer, band saw, thicknesser. I will probable go with 6" PVC piping. The shed size is around the 6mx4m roughly. I don't have 3 phase so it will have to be single. Was looking at building a cyclone but sourcing the motor and impellor became tedious. Any help or advice would be great.

Before going any further what is the max current available in your shed?

Im not to sure / how to find out ?

Originally Posted by Blazk

Im not to sure / how to find out ?

Does your shed have a circuit breaker box (CBB)?

if yes, look in the CBB and note how many and what type of circuit breakers are there.
If no, look in the house CBB and see if there is a breaker there specifically for the shed and note what that is.
If there is no CB in the house CBB your shed probably runs off one of the house circuits.

Let's get this established first.
Also what HP is your TS?

Thanks for the quick replies.
There isn't a cbb in the shed. I did look at the power box for the house, but it isn't very well labeled (well it was built in 1984 by the date on the etsa tag). Most breakers say 15amp 250v. Only one says 30amp 250v.
Table saw is a ledacraft 1.5hp.

Originally Posted by Blazk

Thanks for the quick replies.
There isn't a cbb in the shed. I did look at the power box for the house, but it isn't very well labeled (well it was built in 1984 by the date on the etsa tag). Most breakers say 15amp 250v. Only one says 30amp 250v.
Table saw is a ledacraft 1.5hp.

The 30A circuit breaker (CB) will be either a Stove/Oven or Aircon or HWS.
The 15A CBs protect the standard 10 A outlets inside the house, (usually 20 or 25 A CBs are used to protect 15A outlets and standard installation is one outlet per breaker).
The 15A designation is nominal continuous value but it can handle slightly higher currents for a brief period.

FIRST THE DISCLAIMER ** If you are not confident of doing the following call in a sparky to tell you what is going on **

Since there is no CBB in the shed and you cannot identify a specific shed CB in the house CBB, you need to determine which of those CBs in the house CBB, controls the shed.
Do this by connecting an appliance (something like a desk lamp is the safest thing to use) to an outlet in the shed and turning it on and then turning the House CBs of-on systematically. Then you need to work out if that CB is for the shed alone, or if it connected to one of the house circuits by testing for power using the desk lamp on all the house outlets. If none of the house circuits are affected then that CB is for the shed alone.

If that CB is connected to one of the house circuits then you will need to check what appliances are running on the circuit. if they are all small appliances like power adapters then you can pretty much ignore these. However if they are high current continuous devices appliances like dryers or air conditioners then you need to take these into account

Assuming that you can identify a 15A CB that is dedicated to the shed then . . . .
If the Ledacraft is a 1.5HP that means it will draw ~4A free running and ~6A under working load.
This pretty much restricts you to a 2HP (~6A) since a 3HP draws about 10 A which when added to the saw will send you over the 15A limit .
A 3HP unit requires a 15A GPO and a dedicated 20-25A CB because the start up currents can be much higher than 15A which will trip a 15A CB.

If the line to the shed is part of one of the house circuits then the currents drawn by any large appliances in the house that use the same circuit should be included in the calculation.

The other thing to note is that it is not just a question of changing the CBs in the house CBB. The other limit to total current is the wire diameter.
The line running to the shed can probably only cope with a continuous max of 10 A so swapping the 15A CB on that circuit for a 20A could cause overheating on that line and lead to a fire.

Either way it seems if you want to run a 3 HP or greater DC you would need to upgrade your connection to the shed.

Great reply thank you. I'll will do the above steps when I get home today and post results.

Just after my previous post my niece rang me to ask me if I knew the name of a sparky because her house lights had stopped working. As I am only 2 minutes away I went around to see if I could work out what was going on. Opening up the breaker box I saw what was a bit of a dog's breakfast. I don't know who did that installation but it was a hotch potch mix of half a dozen old wire fuses, at least 8 newish breakers, several different types of RCDs and several switches. I know it was not a member of her family as they are not DIYers - maybe the previous home owner and hopefully not a sparky but these days I wonder. Working out what was what was interesting. The labels were written in faint blue marker with stuff crossed out or written over several times, strange arrows showing what switches and RCDs were behind what circuits etc.

Cutting to the chase I found the lighting circuits (there was two of everything because the addition looks like it it was wired independently from the older part of the house) and eventually found it was a wire fuse that had blown. I tracked the problem to a compact fluoro that had had a melt down inside an inappropriate light fitting - ie nowhere for the heat to go. The meltdown was so far gone the globe bayonet was sort of glued in by a mass of molten plastic and gunk and I ended up cutting off the old bayonet and replaced it with another with advice not to reuse that light fitting.

Thanks bobl. Just about to go test it. Similar to your nieces place this one has white texture markings and arrows with the older fuse wire breakers. I'm pretty diy orientated and like doing things myself. Hope for a good outcome

Ok, so I tested it all out and the shed runs on its own separate circuit (a 15A 250v breaker). It isnt linked to the house at all.

Originally Posted by Blazk

Ok, so I tested it all out and the shed runs on its own separate circuit (a 15A 250v breaker). It isnt linked to the house at all.

The 15A breaker almost certainly means the power line to the shed is a 10A line which means you are limited to running a max of 10A continuous.
That means a 2HP will be the max you can use without upgrading the line.

The line itself might be capable of carrying more than 10 A continuous so you may be able to get the 15A replaced with a 20A breaker but it will be unlikely.

Ill get my mrs, sisters, husband to come out and test and/or upgrade the circuit, as hes a sparky. Least so I can run a 3hp?
So second part. What machine to get ?

Originally Posted by Blazk

Ill get my mrs, sisters, husband to come out and test and/or upgrade the circuit, as hes a sparky. Least so I can run a 3hp?

If you are going to run a line you might as well run decent size so you can at least run 2 x 15 A devices.

So second part. What machine to get ?

If you can run a 3HP you can run a Clearvue.
Have you got the readies for a Clearvue?

Hard to find a distributor in Adelaide for the Clearvue Cyclones, I would love to get one though...