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22nd February 2021, 07:13 PM #1SENIOR MEMBER
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More Magnetic dust port connectors 3D printed
Following on from bitingmidge I got on the bandwagon.
It has sort of turned into a full set of connections and adapters to bring all the smaller vac hoses up to a common size, in this case 63mm which if i'm really lucky also matches the 2.5" flex i'm about to order.
The Mag Connectors are all currently designed for 4" (102mm) flex and machine connections and at least all the stuff I have seems to be consistent.
I just used the ancient 2HP dusty for the photos as it was convenient.
V1 of the design was based around 8 magnets but i wasn't overly pleased with the holding force, no doubt maybe more due to the crappy N35 magnets i had on hand, but V2 of the design moved to 16 magnets epoxied into mating face in alternating polarity pattern
P2220077.jpg P2220075.jpg
This is the machine end connector, it's carefully sized to match the port opening and should have minimal turbulence
The rear is set up with 8 slots to allow the clamp to bite down correctly
P2220078.jpg P2220079.jpg P2220081.jpg
I made a 63mm to 100 transition that the 63mm hose adaptors could be plugged in. Yep i know this is completely against normal use of a DC but interestingly (and the black hose is it) when connected to the ROS i have my DC at least with the other 4" port open actually provides all the ROS needs without sucking it down hard to a surface as the vac does.
This fell into if i can design and print it then why not
I have a couple of male 4" hose ends printed, and just in the process of doing the female end for flex hose at the DC end
The nice things was working out how to do the threads to match the external spirals on the hoses, the larger 48-63 above actually adapts the ubiquitous swimming pool vac hoses that are common and imo relatively cheap.
Oh and i've just ordered 500 N50 10x2 mm magnets that should be a bit stronger holding.
Cheers
Phil
PS 4" as that's what i have and what the current printer can handle, really need to pull the finger out and put some real ducting in at 6"
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22nd February 2021, 10:42 PM #2GOLD MEMBER
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Phil, as I said in the other thread I would be interested in these connectors. I have a standard 2 hp dusty with a pleated filter with the flexible hose permanently on it and I swap the free end between my big bandsaw, planer thicknesser and my drum sander. When I get some time to process boards I have to swap the hose between the 3 machines quite a lot, so connectors like this could make my life a lot easier.
Rgds,
Crocy.
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22nd February 2021, 11:03 PM #3SENIOR MEMBER
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Hi Crocy,
that sounds like you need 3 machine connections and one hose connector, assuming you leave the one hose on the DC all the time. I would like to get the magnets into the hose connectors and test hopefully this weekend
once happy I can/will attach the STL files or can print a set and send up… not going to get to Townsville this year the way things are but are overdue for a holiday up in cairns
sorry I didn’t reply in the other thread, sort of felt I’d done enough damage in that one but the benefit is the v2 units
cheers
phil
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22nd February 2021, 11:58 PM #4Senior Member
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Those look nice. I've been playing around with the same idea but haven't actually made anything other that a few test parts so far.
I have a few questions if you don't mind.
You said "V1 of the design was based around 8 magnets but i wasn't overly pleased with the holding force". Was it the breakaway force or were the fittings sliding around too much?
I'm guessing those were printed with mating faces down, that is, on the build plate. That means you were probably bridging the 10mm magnet holes. Did you have any trouble maintaining a consistent magnet depth or did you do something during assembly to keep the magnets near flush with the mating surface?Dave
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23rd February 2021, 06:47 AM #5SENIOR MEMBER
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Phil, how do you determine the polarity of your magnets and once you have do you "label" N from S?
As the magnets alternate in polarity on both adaptors do you have to rotate the hose connector until you "find" the opposite polarity on the other connector?
Cheers,
Yvan
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23rd February 2021, 06:59 AM #6GOLD MEMBER
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23rd February 2021, 07:13 AM #7GOLD MEMBER
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I thought about doing this but never got around to it. One of the things on my mind was if it was going to be strong enough and if something needed to be designed I to brackets to prevent shear forces from the 2 brackets from sliding around. Do you find that the 2 3d printed parts slide easily or the magnetic force is strong enough?
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23rd February 2021, 08:48 AM #8.
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23rd February 2021, 06:31 PM #9SENIOR MEMBER
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I guess a little scene setting, the Flex pipe i have is 15-18 years old Carbatec PVC stuff and is (imo) heavy stuff. it really hasn't been used much due to a long hatius doing woodworking and my yonger self being not so sensible in caring about dust.
When i did a dry hose connection fit, with the magnets set in so they didn't pull out i found the connectors would breakawy with more than a couple of feet of unsupported hose running away horizontal. sort of worse case. I really wasn't noticing the units sliding apart.
The alternating magnets alow for you to rotate to disengage.
Overnight and writing this I think that the current pattern of NSNSNSN may well be better as NNSSNNSSNNSS and would allow for a 8 magnet unit of NSNS to connect to the 16 mag unit.
Looks like the first 3 might get junked ...
Yes these are printed face down. They are printed in ABS and my experience over years has grown to distrust bridging for ABS plus i tend to print hot which is not suitable for bridging but does give good layer adhesion in ABS
The magnet holes are printed using supports. The holes are 2.8mm (I use .2mm layers) deep. The 2mm thick magnets generally measure 2.2mm thick, the support ends 0.2 short (1 layer) so i typically see a hole depth at 2.6, this leaves 0.4mm allowance for glue, likely 0.2mm more than i really need
It's hard to see in the first lot of photos so here is a better photo of the holes that are printed at 9.8mm with a pattern of 1mm semi circles around the hole, this provides a press fit for the magnets i have and i just use some multigrips to set them in flat and allow the squeeze out via the semi circle slots. A nice little messy job that needs a slower setting epoxy.. do not try this with 5 min epoxy
P2230085.jpg
@yvan - i have no idea which is N or S especially at the time of glueing in ... the method i have landed on is to stand a stack of magnets vertically to my left, slide the top one off away from me with my thumb and keep it facing up for want of a better term, place over hole and press in, skip a hole and repeat. Once back to the start change the way the magnet comes off the stack. Now slide the magnet off towards myself with the index finger and rotate upside down and place over hole, rinse repeat.
As for rotating the connector, yes but it's really minimal and will literally just snap into place anyway so no real thought needed.
@riverbuilder - i'm with Bob and for the same reasons, in my opinion, manifold boxes small enough to keep chips suspended in the turbulant air flow would literally just be too turbulant, make it big enough to calm the air flow and then the chips would likely drop out causing a build up. Initial thinking is that manifold style boxes work fine in a presurised environment ie HVAC but dont work as well in a vac (DC) setup.
@qwertyu - No issue with the connectors sliding around, it was breakaway/apart strength that is greater concern. I did think about designing in an antislip feature but decided it is more hassle than needed and really could be solved with a couple of spring clamps if needed.
The real test will be when a high vibration machine is used and that will test things.
Looks like the N50 series magnets should turn up this week, so more printing to do
Here is a table of the different magnet grades Grades Of Neodymium Magnets | First4magnets.com
Cheers
Phil
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23rd February 2021, 10:05 PM #10GOLD MEMBER
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23rd February 2021, 10:15 PM #11GOLD MEMBER
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I am quite limited for space, the Robinson bandsaw is approx 1.5 tonnes and does not move, it has a swing arm electric chain hoist crane above it, the planer thicknesser is on a mobile base and has to be moved out of the way when using the bandsaw or the drum sander, which is mobile also. My system works best for me using a quick change connector.
BTW, I just replaced the 20 year old grey elastisized flexible hose with a clear polyurethane spiral wound pipe and OMG does that dusty suck now.
Rgds,
Crocy.
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24th February 2021, 10:56 PM #12SENIOR MEMBER
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Well today I had 500 x 10x2mm N50 magnets arrive ..... only issue is they are only 1.75mm thick .... tempting to raise a dispute but just couldn't be bothered, I just won't link to them for others.
Guess I'll just print same spacer discs to go in the holes or just use a little more epoxy
Pretty much have finalised the basic design now with each of the main 100mm units getting labeled
Here is the Machine connector, this version got an extra 5mm of height to give a bit more clamping room
P2240092.jpg
Yep Crocy, that's the final version (i hope) .... i've just ordered some Blue filament so colour choice will be Green or Blue
Cheers
Phil
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25th February 2021, 09:41 PM #13
I got my magnets from Ali Express - the 12 @ 8x6 are doing a sterling job thus far.
Nice to see you going ape on the production line. ABS seemed like a bit of overkill - all mine are PLA!
While you've been getting your connections done I've been madly printing adapter rings to make my metal blast gates play perfectly with the pvc - a vast improvement over the old adhesive foam packing trick!
cheers,
P
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25th February 2021, 10:50 PM #14SENIOR MEMBER
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I'm sort of the odd person out a lot of the time using ABS, but I have literally printed 100's of kg of ABS, i know it back the front and you can very easily glue it together with nothing more than ABS glue itself and the joint is stronger than the area around it. Against that i've maybe used 5 rolls of PLA, I still have 5 brand new sealed PLA rolls that are maybe 4 yrs old.
One thing getting back into woodwork though is a lesson that not everything has a 3D printed solution .... but it's close
good to hear the 8x6 magnets are working, the 10x2 should be fine in the 16 ring, but i'm going to set them in NNSSNNSS alternating for one test.
Cheers
Phil
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26th February 2021, 09:30 AM #15Senior Member
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I've seen both threads... very cool guys!
Just wondering if you are concerned about PLA absorbing water? I've been getting a mate to print some dust collection fittings for me, done in PLA... Now I'm wondering if it was the right decision! Haven't had them long enough to know if they'll fail, so I just I'll just suck it and see??
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