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  1. #31
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    Jan 2014
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    Sydney Upper North Shore
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    Ian,
    I can’t see why you would need 240v 3 pin plug at each dust port? As NCArcher said, there’s a low voltage “switch” at the inlet gate - bridged with prongs.
    Even if you put a low voltage switch (12v), at each port, activating a 12v/240v relay to switch the main vac. motor it wouldn’t be too out of place.
    I just switch my 50mm system on with a power point switch that’s located beside the DC switch as in a number of cases I have the two systems running at the same time. My shed is not huge so it’s not a “biggee” to flick a switch. I did have it on a remote control (until the main unit failed) but I still had to pick up a remote - not much different that just flicking a switch.

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  3. #32
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    Perth
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    27,757

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    Quote Originally Posted by Chris Parks View Post
    Ian, good to hear from you, are you back in Canada? At this stage I am only kicking tyres so everything is on the table and I have no hard plans on how it would work. Conventional vacuums rely on airflow to cool the motors and that is about all I know and blocking air flow means they emit smoke from the motor and it stops. Central vacuums must have a different system to avoid the dreaded smoke.
    Most Shop type vacs use separate air loops for cooling the motor.

  4. #33
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    Helensburgh
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    7,696

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    Quote Originally Posted by BobL View Post
    Most Shop type vacs use separate air loops for cooling the motor.
    I can recall you saying otherwise and it was that comment that prompted my post. I have no idea when you posted but it was a long time ago.
    CHRIS

  5. #34
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    Helensburgh
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lappa View Post
    Ian,
    I can’t see why you would need 240v 3 pin plug at each dust port? As NCArcher said, there’s a low voltage “switch” at the inlet gate - bridged with prongs.
    Even if you put a low voltage switch (12v), at each port, activating a 12v/240v relay to switch the main vac. motor it wouldn’t be too out of place.
    I just switch my 50mm system on with a power point switch that’s located beside the DC switch as in a number of cases I have the two systems running at the same time. My shed is not huge so it’s not a “biggee” to flick a switch. I did have it on a remote control (until the main unit failed) but I still had to pick up a remote - not much different that just flicking a switch.
    I don't think I will have any problems with the control side even using ordinary PVC pipe and printed adapters for the flexible hose.
    CHRIS

  6. #35
    Join Date
    Nov 2013
    Location
    Caboolture QLD AU
    Posts
    781

    Default

    Most of the typical Shop Vac wet and dry vacs have no bag, just a replaceable pleated filter. I went for the smallest bin on the VAC as you really only need a "very small" dust bin, nothing should get into the VAC bin, it should be clean after a year of use with the exception of a some very fine powered coating if doing a lot of fine sanding. A nice big bin on the mini cyclone and your done.

    One place where a remote is of use is when working on a bench away from the main VAC switch, I'm often stopping, checking and changing things depending on the tool, it's very convenient to be able to stop / start the VAC without walking over to the main switch. Multi channel remotes units with a few hand transmitters are around 20$.

    I'm guessing Chris will likely incorporate power control into the automated gate function if he goes ahead, would be neat.

  7. #36
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
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    Sydney Upper North Shore
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    The problem I’ve had with remotes is the main PowerPoint units fail within 18 months. It’s generally the relay due to switching current. Can’t find anything “plug in” readily available above 10A at a reasonable price. If anyone knows of such units, give me a hoy.
    Obviously you want one remote and multiple power point units, not just a one off.

  8. #37
    Join Date
    Nov 2013
    Location
    Caboolture QLD AU
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    781

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    Yes I would expect that those typical small inbuilt relays, especially with no snubber across the contacts, would burn up in short order with an inductive load.

    I use the small inbuilt board mounted relay to switch a big 12v - 240V AC 25A contact rated relay, or a big SSR rated for switching inductive loads.

  9. #38
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    NSW
    Posts
    9

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    When I bought my house about 20 years ago I was pleased to find a connection point to the house central ducted vacuum system. At the time I didn’t think too much about it except it would be convenient to vacuum the car. Now the garage is my workshop I find myself frequently using the system to clean up the workshop etc. There are a some advantages with this system. The motor for the unit is under the house and there is little noise in the workshop. Also, I don’t have to worry about fine and potentially harmful dust particles in the workshop. The dust is collected in large cheap bags held in the main units - it’s easy to empty.
    There is plenty of suction and cleaning up the workshop is quick. However the system does not do everything... I use a 2HP dust extractor for the machinery (table saw, router, bandsaw etc). The dust extractor is also located under the house. This location has similar advantages to the ducted vacuum system and saves space in the workshop. For portable power tools I still use workshop dust extractors - the ducted system is tool powerful for some applications such as sanding. Hope this is useful.

  10. #39
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
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    Sydney Upper North Shore
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    Quote Originally Posted by MandJ View Post
    Yes I would expect that those typical small inbuilt relays, especially with no snubber across the contacts, would burn up in short order with an inductive load.

    I use the small inbuilt board mounted relay to switch a big 12v - 240V AC 25A contact rated relay, or a big SSR rated for switching inductive loads.
    I imagine it wouldn’t be a major outlay to build one to suit but I like the idea of one side plugs into the power point and the lead plugs into the other side - nice and compact.

  11. #40
    Join Date
    Feb 2003
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    back in Alberta for a while
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    68
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    12,006

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lappa View Post
    Ian,
    I can’t see why you would need 240v 3 pin plug at each dust port? As NCArcher said, there’s a low voltage “switch” at the inlet gate - bridged with prongs.
    Even if you put a low voltage switch (12v), at each port, activating a 12v/240v relay to switch the main vac. motor it wouldn’t be too out of place.
    I'm thinking that Chris's proposed system should be designed (configured?) to turn on when the hand tool turns on and off a few seconds after the tool stops.
    The alternative is that the vac is on almost full time.
    Depending on how Chris's shed is laid out, you might want one or two dedicated high amp sockets for running hand tools, with a further low voltage bridged connector purely sweeping up the dust.
    regards from Alberta, Canada

    ian

  12. #41
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    Feb 2003
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    back in Alberta for a while
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    Duplicate post
    regards from Alberta, Canada

    ian

  13. #42
    Join Date
    Nov 2004
    Location
    Millmerran,QLD
    Age
    73
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    11,099

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    ChrisI'm not sure that this is the on the same lines as you originally envisaged. It uses a Pullman ducted vacuum unit. The hose that came with it had wires built into the corrugated hose, but I discarded that and installed 40mm plastic tubing.

    P1050522 (Medium).JPG

    I have in line a home made cyclone made from a plastic bucket a large funnel and a garbage can.

    P1050523 (Medium).JPG

    Currently it is only hooked up to the SCMS, but there is always a spare cap nearby in case I need to isolate that.

    P1050524 (Medium).JPGP1050527 (Medium).JPGP1050528 (Medium).JPG

    There are two other possible outlets primarily for hand held tools and just have a cap pushed onto the end:

    P1050526 (Medium).JPGP1050525 (Medium).JPG

    It is not really high tech

    Regards
    Paul
    Bushmiller;

    "Power tends to corrupt. Absolute power corrupts, absolutely!"

  14. #43
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    Jun 2005
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    Helensburgh
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    Paul, that is exactly what I had in mind using a different control system....tool starts and the vacuum starts.
    CHRIS

  15. #44
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Location
    Melbourne
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    I’ve only just found this thread
    But this brilliant I’ve been thinking wanting to do something like this for ages.
    I just sit back an take it all in , I’ve had quite a busy last few days.

    Cheers Matt

  16. #45
    Join Date
    Jan 2020
    Location
    Austin, TX, USA
    Posts
    50

    Default Oneida Supercell?

    I have been lurking here for a while because you all share great information. Thank you!

    In the US, Oneida has a relatively new dust collector called Supercell that is a high pressure system with a cyclone similar to what you guys have been describing:

    Supercell High-Pressure Wall Mounted Cyclone Dust Collectors | Oneida Air Systems

    It's expensive, but tempting to me as a very small, all-in-one dust collector. The fan curve shows the CFM is pretty low, but the static pressure is really, really high.

    Screen Shot 2020-10-31 at 7.54.55 AM.png

    I am very curious how a collector like this would function with a bandsaw and planer.

    Mark

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