Thread: building a workbench

Read all this.

http://www.woodworkforums.ubeaut.com...ight=WORKBENCH




HJ0

Originally Posted by HJ0

Read all this.

Ive read all that, like i said ive researched the project. not wishing to detract from the worthy contributions made to that thread, it does not provide definitive answers any of the specific questions i have raised.

not one reply to the thread discriminates between a joiners bench and a cabinetmakers bench and despite the best efforts of the thread originator to seek original input, the more he tries to digress from traditional wisdom the more it sems that the "brains trust" are pushing the thread back into the tried and proven ways of the old craftsman.

Dont get me wrong, i like the creative input such as including (aluminium) "t" track in the design but i dont think it would last 5 minutes in a properly designed workbench top subjected to the pounding such a workbench should be designed to take.

thanks,

benchdog

If money was no object, I would buy the Tucker vise (pattenmakers vice) and twin screw vise, both from Lee Valley.

I dont really care whether the dogs are round or square.

Benches just seem to be a topic where there is such a diverse range of opinions that it is doubtful that anyone could provide you with an 'answer' as such. It more or less depends on what you want to do with it.

I think you have your top sorted. There's one dilemma out of the way.

As for vices, I gave you my unfinancial opinion. Taking finances into account, I would go for a Jet (Record type) vice for $139 and either another Jet vice to use as a tail vice (the easier way) or build a traditional tail vice (cheaper but more labour intensive).

I have read somewhere that it is better to stop reading after a little while and just start building it. Get started on your base and then worry about the hardware for the vices, etc.

Hi Benchdog,

I agree with Boban, start building the frame and decide what you want on top as you go. You will need two vices at least one with high capacity.

As to bench dogs and hold downs, your call. There are lots of options out there, look at some of the online catalogues.

The shape and set up of a bench is really a highly personal thing, and depends on your type of work, height, space available and type of timber yu want to use.

Regards,

Rob

Hi and Welcome Benchdog

My approach and suggestion:

Build a stable, but Q&D workbench, very basic, not too large. Use it for awhile and see what you like and don't like about it, watch how you work with the bench and maybe this will help guide you in building a workbench that will suit how you work. The old workbench can then be another work area, finishing table, garden potting table for SWMBO, etc etc.

I did this, built a Q&D workbench and now that I've been using it for about, gee ~ 2 years, I have a very firm idea on how my new workbench will be with number one need being straight, stable and nearly unmoveable. Other design points - where the tool well is, where the vice will be, the type of vice I'd like, height etc etc.

Even so, I don't think this will be my ultimate workbench.

Good Luck!

Cheers
Wendy

Benchdog,
I agree with the others that there comes a time to stop reading, and just go and build a bench. I suppose it's possible to build the 'complete' bench first up, and never need to change for the rest of your life, but I have yet to meet anyone who's actually done it. We all start out with the idea we'll build the bench of benches, but most w'workers who have been in the game a long time are on their 2nd or 3rd or later version. As you settle in to the type of work you do, you figure out what you really need, keep the useful bits, and discard the window-dressing that you once thought was so essential.

I'm on my 4th bench, with close to 40 yrs of 'serious' wood-butchery behind me. The bench I use now has served me well for about 20 years, but I am planning to make one more before I croak, just for fun. It will be a little longer and wider than the current one, but pretty much the same in all other respects. I do mostly furniture, all styles and periods, pretty well all solid wood, but occasional veneered projects, and quite a bit of turnery involved where appropriate. For this, a pretty standard European style bench with a traditional tail vice, single row of dog-holes, and a good hefty front vice hold just about anything I need held.

There must be jobs where patternmakers' vices are essential (else they wouldn't exist, would they!) but I have never felt such a pressing need that I was willing to shell out the extra $$s. Granted, for some jobs, I have to use a jig, or some extra help, and maybe the patternmakers' vice would save time there, but I have the luxury of time, and can usually solve the problem pretty easily. An example is shaping cabriole legs, where holding the sawn blank in a (wooden) sash clamp which is held in the front vice, makes the job easy to get at.

So I suggest that you will waste more time and effort trying to build THE bench, first up - the one that does everything perfectly, whatever you may chose to do in the future. Get one up and running, and find out what you want to do most, and make vers. II to suit.

As far as finish goes - anything that stops glue sticking to the surface, would be my suggestion. I've always used Danish-type oil and a good waxing of the top every year or so, and that works well. The inevitable globs of dried glue can be easily flicked off the surface with a scraper.

FWIW,

Originally Posted by boban

I dont really care whether the dogs are round or square.

Have both. Drill round holes in the bench and put a square block on the round bench dog to convert it to a square one, or any shape in between.

Hi Benchdog,

I can sympathsize with your problem. When I started I made a traditional bench from the Triton project book, bought the best vice I could find (an English one I think) and the mechanism for the end vice and fabricated the runners etc. It still serves me well.

But then I needed some layout space so I made a large solid table, puts some cupboards in it for storage, added another vice, use it a lot.

As I have a long narrow work area I found I needed another mobile surface, so I made another table (lighter) that gets trundled about as needed. Then I made a smaller bench and cupboards to take a small drill press and other odds and ends.

All this stuff is used frequently but I never made anything I didnt need, and only made it as the need arose.

So I suggest you get on it, buy the best gear you can afford, make a solid bench to start and then add stuff as the need arises.

Good luck.

Barrie Restall

Originally Posted by boban

Get started on your base and then worry about the hardware for the vices, etc.

Originally Posted by Flowboy

I agree with Boban, start building the frame and decide what you want on top as you go. You will need two vices at least one with high capacity.

nice idea guys but a workbench is all about the work surface that is going to be used. how can you possibly build the base and then build the work surface to fit the base and still end up with a good bench? logic surely dictates that the work surface is of primary importance and the base is just to hold a carefully designed and crafted work surface at a good comfortable working height and solidly. seems you two guys were having a temporary lapse of sanity last night?

Originally Posted by boban

If money was no object, I would buy the Tucker vise (pattenmakers vice) and twin screw vise, both from Lee Valley.

nice vises boban but i doubt i would need half the features more than once a lifetime so i cant justify that decadence, but i can understand your passion for them.

Originally Posted by boban

I dont really care whether the dogs are round or square.

my gut feeling is that round benchdogs would be more versatile but square benchdogs would be more secure. there must be a reason that the square benchdogs are set at 87 degrees in the traditional designs. there is also the consideration that the round holes are considered by some to be more prone to elongation and distortion over time than the square ones. obviously round dog-holes at right angles to the work surface are going to be the easiest to make but are they going to be the best in the long term? you only have to make them once but you have to use what you make for several years. i dont mind going to extra effort to make something right if it is going to save me time through subsequent projects

Originally Posted by rufflyrustic

build a stable, but Q&D workbench,

nice to see some sensible input rufflyrustic but i dont do q&d

Originally Posted by mini

Have both. Drill round holes in the bench and put a square block on the round bench dog to convert it to a square one, or any shape in between.

thanks for that mini, dont know what i would do without your input. it will keep me busy for weeks experimenting with that

Thanks for your input ianw and barrie, your comments are giving me some things to think about

thanks to all

benchdog

Hi Benchdog,

Dont forget to let us know what you end up doing, with a photo if possible. Its nice to know how others solve their problems.

Regards,

Barrie

Originally Posted by benchdog

nice idea guys but a workbench is all about the work surface that is going to be used. how can you possibly build the base and then build the work surface to fit the base and still end up with a good bench? logic surely dictates that the work surface is of primary importance and the base is just to hold a carefully designed and crafted work surface at a good comfortable working height and solidly. seems you two guys were having a temporary lapse of sanity last night?

Have a look at most workbenches and the variance seems to be in the tops.

Granted not all bases are suitable for all tops, but other than the shoulder vise type with the extra leg, I can't think of too many designs that dont revolve around a rectangular base (and I have a few books on the subject).

On such a rectangular base you can build virtually any type of top you can think of. Quite sane I would have thought. All the angst tends to come from choosing the layout/hardware for the top. I figured you could get started and make your decisions on the top some time down the track. What it is about the base that you think would limit your options?

Don't know about you, but time for woodworking is scarse for me. I'd much rather use the time "doing something" rather than thinking too much about how I might do something.

I'm building two bases at the moment (after work) and I'm still not sure how the top is going to be set out. Call me nuts if you like.

So that they don't tilt and lift the workpiece up off the bench.

The slight angle gives them a small downward action on the workpiece, or if there's slop in the dog hole, they'll tilt closer to 90 degrees, but hopefully not past it.

Cheers,
Andrew

One small but important point: If you are starting from scratch I'd suggest morticing the boards before joining them up for the top so that you can have rectangular cross-section dogs; after the top is made up, circular cross-section is the only reasonably practical option.

Why the rectangular dogs? Simply because they are better able to hold/clamp workpieces in my view. However, LV's Wonderdogs are great if a bit exy.

I'd also go with a vice that has a dog hole in it - both for face and tail vices. Also, my preference would be for a Scandanavian style tail vice - the type where there is a front element as well.

Cheers!

Per the 87 deg point: I believe that LV's dogs have an in-built 2 ~ 3 degree downwards camber to meet the same design goals but for after-thought holes drilled vertically.