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21st March 2013, 11:45 AM #31
Good point Rob. What I loosely had in mind was to gather all the opinions (I'll send PMs to those I know have one vise or another), and when the discussion is fairly matured, post a poll with the collated info, to make it easy to get a high number of votes on the different options. Then once that's matured, turn it into a PDF of hopefully reasonably complete info.
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21st March 2013, 12:29 PM #32
Other than just the links with descriptions it would be great to have a photo. Especially for those of us newbies that don't know the names, we can quickly scan through the thread looking at the images untill we see what we are looking for.
On a side note I was wondering why all the default position for wood working vices are on the front left hand side. I see some times there is an end vice on the opposing end. Still this setup could be reversed. Reason I ask is the default position for an engineering vice in my experience is the front right hand side. This allows you to extend metal past the end of the bench and cut to the right hand side of the vice suiting the majority of right handed workers.
I am sure there will be a bevy of reasons, since I don't have a bench and have just started research it was a curious point of interest. The answer will undoubtedly be bound up in how hand tools are used.
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21st March 2013, 01:14 PM #33
Atm, I have two face vises on two different benches: one on the left, one on the right. Frankly I'm not sure that I care much which end they are on, as long as they don't get in the way of general activity in my small 5x3m barn. I'm not even sure that this convention has anything to do with left/right handed operators either.
When it comes to my benchbuild, the left end will be close to a wall, and the main front side will be parallel to the existing 3.6m long bench, which will be staying. There will be a runway between them about 800-900mm wide. It doesn't make any sense to put the leg vise on the left because the wall will restrict it too much, so I will put it on the right. The back side of the bench will have slightly restricted access to at least part of it at the wall end (machine storage when not in use).
This will mean that the HNT tail vise will be on the same end, but opposite side of the leg vise, and because I'm right handed this will mean that I'll be planing towards the tail vise from the variable positioned dog - can't see that it makes any difference.
I think it highly likely that I'll also add a Hovarter Face Vise (at least I'd like to). The positioning of this one is a bit of a conundrum. If I put it in the middle of the front side (leg vise side) it will be in the way of the sliding deadman (and that's a deal breaker), and hub/handle or wheel will be sticking out into the reasonably narrow runway - not a deal breaker, but not too good.
If i put on the other side I would have restricted access to it, but at least that could be solved by moving whatever it is the restricts the access. Perhaps I'll put it down the Tail Vise end - again, I can't see any conflict there, and I could even recess the HNT Tail Vise knob so that it within the bench length. Plus, the access would be more often available without moving anything.
Yeah I know - that all might be a bit hard to follow....
Oh to have a decent sized shed!
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21st March 2013, 02:10 PM #34
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21st March 2013, 03:14 PM #35
DSL74
I used to work in metal but changed over a few years ago and its all about which side you work on (being left handed or right handed). Yes for metal the vice is on the right - think of using a hacksaw. But for wood you reverse this - think of planing an edge with a hand plane - you don't work forward like the hacksaw but work along the long edge to the side and the timber being a long piece is often supported at one end in your vice and at the other end with a dog and clamp to the apron or some other form of rest. You body twists to the left. The same with using a chisel, the movement is to the left.______________
Mark
They only call it a rort if they're not in on it
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21st March 2013, 03:25 PM #36
Absolutely not. Whilst the vices have cost quite substantial dollars I would still use the same again albeit the tail vice would have been positioned a bit further out - I had to put a washer behind the jaw to space it out away from the bench. If anything I might have built the bench top structure slightly different using sub assemblies of laminated timbers then milling and assembling, rather than laminating pre-milled timbers all into one large slab. The later method ended up giving me a slight out of square condition right on the end with no easy remedy. This was where the tail vice jaw was binding.
My only disapontment was that the veritas tail vice doesn't have that look of being a real woodworkers vice like a tradional cabinet makers bench has - no dovetails on the moving vice jaw.______________
Mark
They only call it a rort if they're not in on it
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21st March 2013, 06:44 PM #37GOLD MEMBER
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Traditionally, a right hander had the vice at the left end of the bench. I, being a bit of a radical, felt that a second vice, positioned at the right end, would be quite handy for all sorts of things. This theory has proved correct, but at great expense to certain parts of my anatomy. My right hip and thigh have taken a belting only equalled by a rugby tour in NZ some years ago. Being a bit slow on the uptake, these injuries have had to be repeated until such time that my danger mechanism cut in and I now naturally, without thinking, pirouette around the offending projection without ill effect. I do find the extra vice handy, but pain does need to be your friend.
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21st March 2013, 07:12 PM #38
Pardon me, but I think I'd actually like to see that
Anyway, you played 5/8, what happened to your sidestep of either foot?
A brief aside - I had the great fortune of seeing Steve Rogers play dozens of games, in his absolute prime. Speaking of pirouettes, he had this technique where he would have his right hand on the ground (in a crouching, dynamic position) and he would run in a circle using his hand as the balance/pivot point, and completely bamboozle the defence. Shortly after he was no where to be seen, and would reappear in a gap, last seen heading for an open tryline. Sensational stuff!
Yup, I'm a poor bloody Cronulla supporter.
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21st March 2013, 07:22 PM #39
I have the carbatec large front vice on the left hand side and a record QR (different vice but I couldn't find my model. I got it from carbatec )on the opposite end as a tail vice. I have to say, having the additional vice on the right hand side is very handy. I use it as much as a tail vice as a face vice. Possibly because of the QR but I wouldn't like to have to make do without it now.
I will add that the record QR is an excellent vice and I haven't found it to suffer from thread jumping or whatever Brett called it.
The large face vice is basic but holds work very well after I tweeked it a bit after fitting. The castings were not to the finest tolerances and a bit of adjustment was needed to make it operate smoothly. I may swap it for a Veritas twin screw or a Horvater one day but it is doing a good job atm.Those were the droids I was looking for.
https://autoblastgates.com.au
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21st March 2013, 07:57 PM #40
Now that is a good idea! I have the equivalent Groz vise, and you've prompted me to realise that the vastly annoying thread jumping (causing the job to be dropped to the floor) would not be an issue in the Tail Vise, because the job is sitting on the bench anyway. And I already have the vise.....
The Groz has a hideous plastic pop up dog, which could be changed to timber with the correct 2 degree face.
Then I could use the compact HNT Tail Vise in a Drill Deck that I have to make....
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21st March 2013, 08:05 PM #41GOLD MEMBER
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"Anyway, you played 5/8, what happened to your sidestep of either foot?"
Ah, you have a good memory Brett. Sixteen and a half stone five eights don't tend to use the side step much.
.
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21st March 2013, 10:37 PM #42
Workbench Vises - all the different ones in the same thread - contributions please
Brett
Good thread. I've got the Veritas quick release face vice, retrofitted than existing (but substantially modified) bench. Easy to install, including with a substantial front chop to hold the dog holes. Very good looking vice (if that kind of thing is important to you!).
Very solid, with no chance of movement whatsoever. Solid, all metal construction, with the substructure built from steel and aluminium for the front casting. The main screw is covered by an aluminium hood to stop stuff getting stuck in the screw.
Very smooth screw operation, it only takes a small turn to tighten the jaws rendering the work immobile. I've added a reasonably wide chop, so racking is a problem. I need to make up a set of chocks of common timber widths to use when clamping at one end.
Good opening depth for the jaws, certainly more than I've needed. Quick release is good, making it say to open and close the jaws. My only complaint is that it takes a fair bit of effort to move the chop by hand. It's could be my build though...
TravSome days we are the flies; some days we are the windscreen
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21st March 2013, 10:46 PM #43
Lake Erie Wood Vise screw
LAKE ERIE WOOD VISE SCREW
US$209 + freight
For those who like a wooden thread.
Btw, thanks Trav
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21st March 2013, 11:03 PM #44
Well, as far as I know, that's it for the Australian/American/Canadian vises.
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21st March 2013, 11:53 PM #45
This is a good thread but a pity it is a bit late for me as I have almost finished my bench build and had already got the carbatec big front vice like ncArcher did. Just finished fitting it and it seems to do the job ok. I'll post pics soon. I have had the Groz QR on my current bench for about 10 years now and like some others have said it can sometimes be a PITA when it pops out and drops the work on the floor. You do get used to it and get to know how much pressure to put on the leaver when tightening. Also helps to clean the nut and thread from time to time. Anyho after that I just wanted a good honest thread with nothing to go wrong. I have gone for a tail vice also as I had a unused 6'' laying around. Not sure it is essential in a split top bench but making use of what was laying around. I had to make a dog for it in wood.
My very first bench almost 40 years ago had a wood screw leg vice that was rescued from my grandfathers shop when he passed on. I could not bring it to Aus because of quaritine issues. It did have a few worm holes in it. It did the job but always having to bend down and move pins gets to be a chore and the bottom guide rail binds now and then and needs a tap with the mallet. Funny how it is back in fashon again.
Regards
John
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