Workbench Vises - all the different ones in the same thread - contributions please

[FenceFurniture]

Well, we seem to have covered a lot of vises now, so after this post I will put up the summaries of what we have so far, and then pester some people to have some input

[FenceFurniture]

MCW AUMINIUM VISE
$550 + delivery from NSW






From FF:
This may look like a traditional face vise, but there are some important differences, apart from the very pleasing visual treatment that Micheal has given it.

The screw is covered by the horizontal alum plate, so no rubbish gets into it. I presume too, that this can be used as a reference for settings boards parallel to the bench top (not sure how important that is though )

The handle is quite short so it has much less potential to get in the way. It only needs to be this long because of the incredibly smooth action of this vise (I've briefly used one).

Being aluminium, it is much lighter than steel/cast iron vises, and mounting it is a very simple task.

From DSEL74:
Saw this today at a Hand Tool Event in Melbourne, it was impressive


VERITAS QUICK RELEASE FRONT VISE
US$295 + freight








From FF:
It would be interesting to know how much thread jumping (if any) this vise does. Just thinking about the mechanics of Quick Release vises, I have difficulty seeing that thread jumping can be avoided, but Veritas are known for their great engineering, so maybe they have overcome it somehow.

It would appear that they are aiming this vise at people who have thinner workbenches, and certainly when mounted in a thin bench there is only potential to hold the workpiece by the bottom 50mm or so.

From Trav:
I've got the Veritas quick release face vise, retrofitted to an existing (but substantially modified) bench. Easy to install, including with a substantial front chop to hold the dog holes. Very good looking vise (if that kind of thing is important to you!).

Very solid, with no chance of movement whatsoever. Solid, all metal construction, with the substructure built from steel and aluminium for the front casting. The main screw is covered by an aluminium hood to stop stuff getting stuck in the screw.

Very smooth screw operation, it only takes a small turn to tighten the jaws rendering the work immobile. I've added a reasonably wide chop, so racking is a problem. I need to make up a set of chocks of common timber widths to use when clamping at one end.

Good opening depth for the jaws, certainly more than I've needed. Quick release is good, making it say to open and close the jaws. My only complaint is that it takes a fair bit of effort to move the chop by hand. It's could be my build though...



HOVARTER QUICK RELEASE FACE VISE
US$375 + freight






From FF:
This vise seems to have some real potential for clamping large workpieces such as drawers.

The handles can be spaced from 450-625mm apart, so that it can accommodate holding a job about 600mm wide, but more importantly there is nothing preventing the job going right down to the floor if necessary. The jaws open to about 250mm, which is surely ample. All this essentially means that you could hold a piece of timber (disregarding weight) that is 600x250mm by around a metre high. That's a pretty big workpiece!

There is also a slightly cheaper single handle version, and the reviewer (link on the site) stated that he went single handle because he needed three hands for the two handle jobbie. I think he may have missed the point entirely. You can operate either handle because they are linked.

That is a real bonus, and coupled with the general operation of "slide the jaws up to the job, and then a 1/4 turn to secure, this vise sounds like a real winner.

From Sawdust Maker:
I’ve got one of these but haven't finished the bench to put it in.

Seems to be well made and the instructions seem to be well written.


From FF:
General comment on Hovarter.
Overall Hovarter would appear to be excellent vises.

I wonder about the necessity for the big long handle and bulky hub though. Handles sure do get in the way of things, and there is potential to have four of them on a bench (two for the face vise, and one each for the leg vise and wagon vise).

Given that final tightening is only a quarter of a turn it would be better (for me, anyway) if these were operated by a steel wheel similar to the Benchcrafted wheel. You wouldn't need the handle/knob that BC incorporate because that is for speed (QR sorts that out bigtime). It would be pretty compact in terms of not much sticking out from the vise face (any of them) and no blasted handle to crack you knee on or get other stuff caught on.

There are various wheels available from suppliers here such as this one from RCS Products in Melbourne



PATTERN MAKER’S WOODWORKING VISE (Emmert copy)
US$400 + freight for 30+ kilos!



From rustynail:
The pattern makers vise would have to be one of the handiest, multi purpose vises going. Provided they are quality units made to tight tolerances.



OTHER SIMPLE FACE VISES

From NCArcher: (see here for pics)
I have the carbatec large front vise on the left hand side and a record QR (different vise but I couldn't find my model. I got it from carbatec [IMG]file:///C:\DOCUME~1\BRETTG~1\LOCALS~1\Temp\msohtml1\01\clip_image004.gif[/IMG])on the opposite end as a tail vise. I have to say, having the additional vise on the right hand side is very handy. I use it as much as a tail vise as a face vise. Possibly because of the QR but I wouldn't like to have to make do without it now.
I will add that the record QR is an excellent vise and I haven't found it to suffer from thread jumping or whatever Brett called it.
The large face vise is basic but holds work very well after I tweeked it a bit after fitting. The castings were not to the finest tolerances and a bit of adjustment was needed to make it operate smoothly. I may swap it for a Veritas twin screw or a Horvater one day but it is doing a good job atm.


From orraloon: (see here for pics)
I have almost finished my bench build and had already got the Carbatec big front vise like NCArcher did. Just finished fitting it and it seems to do the job ok. I'll post pics soon. I have had the Groz QR on my current bench for about 10 years now and like some others have said it can sometimes be a PITA when it pops out and drops the work on the floor. You do get used to it and get to know how much pressure to put on the leaver when tightening. Also helps to clean the nut and thread from time to time.

Anyho after that I just wanted a good honest thread with nothing to go wrong. I have gone for a tail vise also as I had a unused 6'' laying around. Not sure it is essential in a split top bench but making use of what was laying around. I had to make a dog for it in wood.


From Berlin:
I have a Record 52 1/2 which doesn't get the pulse racing looks wise but it's reliable and easy to use.

There was an old Dawn out my Mum's that was harder than a coffin nail - stayed on an outdoor bench for my entire childhood and never saw any oil and just kept trucking... it disappeared while I was o/s or I would have rescued it.

I noticed a while ago that Dawn still make a range of bench vises in Oz (including a fancy pivoting face version for irregular shapes). LINK TO PIVOT FACE VISE. They are $239 for 175mm wide, and $325 for 250mm wide (prices from Sydney Tools)



From artme:
I have a permanently mounted Dawn QR face vise. Unfortunately it is now well
worn (Bought it at Tony Carr's Junkyard 42 years ago ) and suffers from annoying
thread jumping.

I have an idea for fixing this and will do so when the paw is in better nick:
There is small metal plate that rides in the thread and is concerned with the
quick release function. From What I can see it is worn and probably needs
replacing ( with a home made version ) so that it rides right down in the
grooves of the thread.

I originally thought the thread was an Acme but now I'm not so sure.

[FenceFurniture]

HNT GORDON TAIL VISE
They are available in two sizes:
100mm Travel $160 (March '13) +post from NSW
150mm Travel $195 ( " ") +post from NSW



These are quite a simple little number that are easy & quick to fit, can be fitted to thinner benches. They are a very reasonable price, especially in a Group Buy, and with the added advantage of being readily available for the cost of domestic postage, as they are made by Terry.

From FF:
I have been using the 100mm version for about 7-8 months and find them very good indeed. Had the 150mm been available at the time I think I would have purchased that because it means lee dog changing on the front end when planing different lengths.

When they first appeared about a year ago there was some discussion about them looking like they were slow to operate because the knob is small and has no momentum. However, I can do the full 100mm travel in just about 5 seconds by rolling the knob from the tip of my forefinger, through the V of my thumb down to it's tip in one movement.

When changing workpieces of the same length it is very rapid indeed. A very slight unscrewing, remove piece and replace, and then just a little flick of the knob is enough to secure the piece.

The dogs for the vise are 1/2" diameter, and that seems to be plenty. You can use whatever you like on the front end, as that is in the bench. I have also been using these 1/2" dogs in the bench, and if you do that then you will need two of each size (height from bench).

Terry tells me that someone(s) have mounted two of these facing each other on each end of the bench - can't quite remember the logic behind it though.

If you wanted to you could recess the knob so that it doesn't protrude past the end of the bench.

They could also be incorporated into a timber drill deck or fence and used as an adjustable stop and/or quick clamping. I might have a play around with that one day.

BENCHCRAFTED WAGON VISE
US$369 (March '13), and has to be freighted to Oz (not cheap).



From FF:
As I look around the benchbuilds, this seems to be a very popular vise. It is far more complex to fit, requires an endcap for the bench to be dovetailed on. It obviously has far superior holding power, but I wonder if that is required. Certainly for thin stock there is only so much pressure can be applied before it bends.

It also means having a large wheel hanging off the end of the bench.

Rapid travel is possible by giving the large wheel a good spin - the momentum carries it through.

It's entirely possible that I'm missing something, but I'm struggling to see any advantage over the simpler, much less expensive, more readily available, and far easier to install HNT.


HOVARTER QUICK RELEASE WAGON VISE
US$240 +freight




This appears to be the similar to the Benchcrafted Wagon Vise, but with the Quick Release Mechanism, and no threaded rod.



VERITAS TWIN SCREW TAIL VISE
US$229 + extras + Freight



From Markw:
Despite my bench being built with a lot of accuracy (+/- 0.5mm), with the vise install as per Veritas instructions using the bench apron as the vise rear jaw (the simplest and most accurate method), the vise still starts to bind when opened up more than 100mm. It never binds to the point of stopping but the increased tension on the handles is a PITA. In time it would probably wear in.

On the plus side its a great vise and does hold the work well.

Whilst the vises have cost quite substantial dollars I would still use the same again albeit the tail vise would have been positioned a bit further out - I had to put a washer behind the jaw to space it out away from the bench. If anything I might have built the bench top structure slightly different using sub assemblies of laminated timbers then milling and assembling, rather than laminating pre-milled timbers all into one large slab. The later method ended up giving me a slight out of square condition right on the end with no easy remedy. This was where the tail vise jaw was binding.

My only disappointment was that the Veritas tail vise doesn't have that look of being a real woodworkers vise like a traditional cabinet makers bench has - no dovetails on the moving vise jaw.




VERITAS QUICK RELEASE SLIDING TAIL VISE
US$279 + freight





From MarkW:
The most important issue with this vise is the positioning of the fixing plate: its correct location is critical, as is the condition of the timber adjacent to it. The blurb from Veritas would have you believe that this vise can be easily retrofitted to an existing bench by just simply attaching the fixing plate. Well yes that is all you need to do but chances are the sliding timber block will bind against your bench top. If I were to fix this vise to an existing bench, I wouldn't attempt it without turning the bench up side down on its top. The instructions advise a 1/4" offset from the edge of the bench, but unless your bench top underside and edge are exactly square, straight and flat along the front bench edge, I would cut that down to around 1/8" or less. It’s not much but it will prevent the moving jaw binding to the front edge of the bench top.

Again, this is a great vise but pretty limited in what it does - it doesn't get used all that often but when you need it, its because nothing else works.


LEE VALLEY TAIL VISE
$US72.50 + handle + freight

Stock standard screw vise, with the advantage of being able to hold workpieces longer than the bench.






FACE VISES used as TAIL VISES
Refer to NCArcher’s notes in SIMPLE FACE VISES post #39



From auscab (in another thread):
The quick action release on the Dawn would be a very nice feature in a tail vise, never really though of it till now.

How about trimming the left and right sides of the Dawn's jaws back with a angle grinder ?
Or mounting it on it's side as well and you could then use long bench dogs which are handy as well some times.


From FF:
Now that is a good idea! I have the equivalent Groz vise, and you've prompted me to realise that the vastly annoying thread jumping (causing the job to be dropped to the floor) would not be an issue in the Tail Vise, because the job is sitting on the bench anyway. And I already have the vise.....

The Groz has a hideous plastic pop up dog, which could be changed to timber with the correct 2 degree face.

[FenceFurniture]

BENCHCRAFTED LEG VISE (Traditional Pin, and Criss Cross or Scissor action)
US$359-439 (+freight)





From FF:
There is the previous Traditional Pin or Parallel Guide style still available as well, but for a saving of $40-80, and the remarkable improvement of the scissor action over the PG style, I doubt you'd buy anything else (wonder how long they'll keep the PG going). The advantages are a much simpler build, the parallel glide isn't in the way under the bench, but mainly the dramatic increase in operational speed of the scissor over the PG.

From Ray153:
The retro comes with a steel "box" that you mortise into the chop or the leg at the top of the cross assembly. That box is screwed to the timber and contains the pin that the cross pivots on. The solo has no steel box, instead you drill a hole through the width of the chop and a long steel rod goes though one side of the chop, though the pivot hole and then through the other side of the chop.

Each version requires a groove for the arm of the cross to sit in and travel up and down as you wind the vise in or out, the retro simply has a wider "socket" at the top of the groove to accept the steel box. It's so you don't have to drill through a wide structure by hand as I am told the hole must be drilled very accurately for it to work properly.



From orraloon – a general comment on Pinned Leg Vises:
My very first bench almost 40 years ago had a wood screw leg vise that was rescued from my grandfathers shop when he passed on. I could not bring it to Aus because of quarantine issues. It did have a few worm holes in it. It did the job but always having to bend down and move pins gets to be a chore and the bottom guide rail binds now and then and needs a tap with the mallet. Funny how it is back in fashion again.




HOVARTER QUICK RELEASE LEG VISE
US$345 + Freight






It operates on the same principle as the Face Vise, so there is no thread, therefore no thread jumping in the quick release.....

Video Demo of his Leg Vise and there's a few others there, including Timbernut (who created a very sexy little wheel get up for moving his bench around).

Have you seen Timbernut's video? I had another look this morning, and I noted that when he pushed the face vise in it jagged a couple of times (a problem brought about by two parallel rods). Just wondering if it would help if the rods were in a couple of brass bushes protruding to the inside of the leg - or maybe it might make it worse?



BIG WOOD VISE
US$135 + freight



Can be used as Leg, Face, Tail. Well, they say Tail, but you wouldn’t.

All timber construction, except for a few parts.

The web site pretty much says it all, but Jameel Abrahams constructed a bench using two of these as Leg Vises, and the second one slides along the bench. Interesting concept.

LAKE ERIE WOOD VISE SCREW
US$209 + freight




For those who like a wooden thread.


MAGUIRE PINLESS LEG VISE
GBP245 + Freight
Not including the Vise Face?



ANCORA LEG VISE – CHAIN ACCESSORY
US$115-170 + Freight
Hardware only for Chain Device

[FenceFurniture]

BENCHCRAFTED MOXON VISE
US$149 +freight (approx $55 for one member recently)
Hardware only, no timber bits.



I definitely need input from other people on this one.




ZYLISS or Z-VISE
$NZD 399.00 to get the full set to Melbourne.



From behai: (see pics here)
In the last 12 months or so, I have been using this vise for planing.

The top of my bench is 45 mm thick by 190 cm wide, so this vise clamps on very suitably. I dismount it and use the clamp for vertical clamping too -- very useful for gluing.

For planing, it is difficult to use this vise on narrow pieces -- that is, less than 10 cm wide or so. I feel that at least 5 cm on the right hand side (I am right handed) is not well supported it, too much pressure on this side, and the whole piece will fall down.

I have not used any other features of this vise. But what it is, I feel I got good value for money.

From artme:
I have a Zyliss and find it very versatile, but as it is not permanently attached
to anything it doesn't get used as often as it should and when I do use it I really
have to scratch the head to remember what to do!






VERITAS SURFACE VISE




From FF:
An even less expensive alternative (US$79) that can be placed anywhere on the bench (depending on your dog'ole pattern). Looks like it could be very slow to adjust because the knob has to be flipped over every half turn unless the whole thing is lifted up.




PRO GRIP BENCHTOP SYSTEM

US$VARIOUS +Freight



From Damian:
You can mount Progrips back to back or side by side. With 4 clamps of a suitable length they turn any bench into a clamp for doing face work like sanding or routing.

One of the big advantages is the plastic jaws won't marr the surface of the job or the table (table - Like the boss's furniture).

Clamping force is limited, but the system is relatively cheap and of course portable and versatile.

Youtube for videos and peachtree woodworking for pictures (see link in title above).

[FenceFurniture]

I've just sent out PMs to some people that have had experience with some of these vises.

Could I ask them please to consider the following, as it would be really useful for us all to know:

• Keep the comments to one vise per post, with the name of that vise as the post title
• What are the great things about the vise that you are commenting on
• What are the poor (if any) things - are there any deal-breakers (we'd really like to know that....)
• Would you buy it again?
• what made you buy it?
• what were the shipping costs?
• how difficult or easy was it to fit?
• perhaps add a picture or two

Thanks very much
Brett

[artme]

Excellent work by you FF!

Thank you for the time and effort you have put into this.

Perhaps it should go in the Library.

[michael_m]

Thank you FF, I'm getting geared up to make a workbench and this thread has been invaluable to me so far.

[DSEL74]

Great list.


What about home made (shop built) or drawings etc for traditional vices. Leg, tail, front, etc

So far it has focussed on commercially bought versions.

[FenceFurniture]

Great list.


What about home made (shop built) or drawings etc for traditional vices. Leg, tail, front, etc

So far it has focussed on commercially bought versions.

Cheers DSEL. I think shop made would be the subject of a different specific thread - I'd prefer to keep the focus on commercially available. I think by the time some of the 30 people I invited have some input then there'll already be plenty to digest in one thread.

Very good idea though - I hadn't considered it.

[FenceFurniture]

Cheers Art.

Perhaps it should go in the Library.

Said the Librarian to the fly....

[Andy Mac]

Interesting discussion, and some info!

What about home made (shop built) or drawings etc for traditional vices. Leg, tail, front, etc

Here's a couple of small ones I've made from scrap hardwood and steel bits. I have about a dozen, some with leather jaws, some with felt, and others I have cut the jaw away to suit different workpieces. The adjustment at the bottom, with pin, is the secret. I just screw one to the bench when I need it, works welll for small odd shaped carvings, with the advantage of lifting the work higher than the benchtop.

Cheers

[FenceFurniture]

Thank you FF, I'm getting geared up to make a workbench and this thread has been invaluable to me so far.

You're welcome Michael - it's as much for my benefit as anyone else. Reckon I'll have spent less time on assembling this than I would doing independent research (and still having to ask questions). Although my eyes are a little red this morning, and I had a particularly bizarre dream involving a vise, avocados, and screaming.

[derekcohen]

Nicely done Brett. I will come back and comment on the pros and cons of several when I can. There is a slightly similar thread on WoodNet forum, and I have linked this thread to that so some of their forum members may look in here.

Regards from Perth

Derek

p.s. my bench build is documented on my website. The first chapter discussed why I chose what vises: http://www.inthewoodshop.com/ShopMad...ngaBench1.html

[Trav]

Brett

It's is a great thread. Not sure if it breaks the rules or not, but perhaps you could list a few members who have each vice. That way, if anyone is considering a vice or has a specific question, it would be a simple matter to pm someone and ask.

Trav