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Thread: Shed Layout Advice
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14th February 2020, 11:48 PM #31Member
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Yep. A 25mm+ air gap between the Thermalbreak 8 and the batts would have been ideal but it didn't work with the space I had available. Compressing the 75mm batts to suit 65mm battens also wasn't ideal but it was better than not having them at all. A case of working with what I had and not being overly concerned as to whether it was optimal.
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15th February 2020, 01:50 PM #32
Hi Mark
I think you have got some more good advice from Moph.
What he and Kingspan do not say is that the foil will act as a vapour barrier and keep condensation to the outside of this barrier.
I am not so sure about his recommendations to use steel Top Hat battens as the steel would act as a heat sink and transfer outside heat direct to the inside cladding. But I do not know enough about the Perth climate to have a firm view. It might come down to a cost decision between top hats and pine studs.
If you decided to go with timber studs, then you could mount the 90x35 pine studs on their narrow edges then this would give you a lot more space for insulation. (90mm stud plus 34mm top hat; Total 124 mm. This would be quite easy to do - just predrill the studs and countersink a 90 mm self tapping screw through the stud into the purlin.
The Australian Government, through the Building Code of Australia, reccomends the following minimum levels of insulation in the ceilings and walls of houses in different cities. I believe that the original recommendations were based on work by the CSIRO. But I am a little puzzled that they should recommend the same levels of insulation for places with such disparate climates.
Insulation Levels.jpg
I wish I had put this much thought into setting up my shed !
Fair Winds
Graeme
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15th February 2020, 02:21 PM #33GOLD MEMBER
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Personally I would favour timber batterns over metal top hat. Timber is a better sound insulator and will help with the metal transmission of sound. Another alternative to ply lining would be to use HMR melamine sheets as they are pre finished and will reflect the light.
With you insulation depending on your circumstances you might consider acoustic batts if sound is going to be an issue
Keep in mind that unless you are going to be artificially controlling the internal temperature you won’t experience the level of condensation you might get in a domestic home situation
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15th February 2020, 05:08 PM #34Member
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Ugh, wrote a reply and hit the wrong button.
In brief:
- Don't get too caught up in the nitty gritty of timber vs steel battens if (like me) you also have unshaded windows and an uninsulated roller door with unenclosed gap at the top. Unless you can address major issues like that - and I will try, but it's going to be far from perfect - then there's little point worrying about lesser issues like thermal conductivity differences between wood vs timber battens. My intent is only to (1) keep moisture out and (2) reduce summer heat load to a point where I can reasonably air condition the space when I'm using it.
- Next time it's 35°C+ here, I'll take some thermal images at various points throughout the day to see what the differential between the battens and the insulation is.
- BCA requirements have changed a fair bit since the table that Graeme posted. E.g. BCA 2016 requirements for minimum total ceiling R-value range from R3.1 in the tropics to R6.3 in alpine regions. The provisions of BCA 2019 will come into effect as of May this year and require use of a heat load calculation method that I haven't had reason to get my head around yet.
- Acoustic batts are definitely worth the money IMO. I did some grinding on a steel plate at 9pm the other day. Wifey was working in the kitchen / playroom across the lawn and had no idea that I'd done so.
Don't get me wrong - things like air gap on both sides of the sisalation, thermal conductivity of battens, etc are all valid points for consideration. Just keep in mind the overall structure that you're dealing with, the limitations that apply and the usage you'll be giving it.
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15th February 2020, 11:15 PM #35
Might I (without trying to hijack the thread) ask if by "Accoustic batts" you mean these or similar please? Bradford SoundScreen, Australia's most trusted acoustic insulation
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15th February 2020, 11:29 PM #36
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15th February 2020, 11:31 PM #37Member
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I used Earthwool R2.0HD 75mm x 600mm acoustic batts. Couldn't tell you what the difference is between the thermal and acoustic batts but they sell both varieties so I assume there is some.
https://www.bunnings.com.au/earthwoo...-pack_p0810598
Here's the BCA 2016 Volume Two table for light coloured roofs ... varies between R3.1 and R6.3 depending on climate zone:
zMpJjQf.png
i.e. the table you posted showed Darwin & Marble Bar as R4.1 (both CZ1; should be R3.1) and Hobart as R4.1 (CZ7; should be R4.6). The CZ5 locations (Perth & Sydney) and the CZ8 location (Thredbo) were correct as shown.
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20th February 2020, 09:32 PM #38Novice
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20th February 2020, 10:23 PM #39Member
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Temperature is about 3°C higher where the ply is fixed to the metal tophat battens, as compared with the insulated plywood adjacent. Not too terrible IMO.
If you look closely, you can even see small hotspots where the screws are.
IR002577.jpg IR002578.jpg IR002579.jpg
IR002580.jpg IR002581.jpg IR002583.jpg
IR002582.jpg
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21st February 2020, 11:27 AM #40
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