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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Apr 2018
    Location
    Adelaide
    Posts
    13

    Default Shed Layout Advice

    Iím after some advice regarding my shed/workshop layout.


    The shed is a basic 6m x 3.5m steel shed with a concrete floor. I am currently renovating our house so using it as a base for that, and general storage.


    Below is the current layout. I built the bench a few years ago, it is just a basic pine frame with a formply top, 1800 x 1200 with my Dewalt table saw built in at one end and the mitre saw just sits on top.


    I have an old wood lathe that was given to me but I plan to sell that as it takes up a lot of room and I donít plan to do any wood turning anytime soon.

    Current Shed.PNG


    I would like to build some basic furniture for our house (bedside tables etc.) and expand my woodworking as my skills increase, using a combination of machines and hand tools where appropriate.


    I am about to build a fixed bench along the south eastern wall with cupboards and drawers, this will have a small sink, my bench grinder will be at one end and this will be used as a sharpening station. I may build overhead cupboards in the future.


    So the plan is to build seperate stands on lockable castors for the table saw, mitre saw and drill press, which will all have a workable height of 900mm, as will the fixed bench. If Iím cutting longer lengths of timber with the mitre saw the table saw top (minus the fence) can be used as support.


    I need to keep the storage shelves for my camping gear as well lawn mower etc, and no shed is complete without a bar (beer?) fridge. I am leaning towards option two as the storage shelves are already in place.


    Option 2.PNG
    Option 1.PNG


    If my woodworking continues as I hope it will there is room for more toys/tools (can you ever have too many tools! ) and dust extraction is planned outside next to the rainwater tank. And the old bench will go and a new hand tool bench built.


    Does anyone foresee any issues with either of the planned layouts? Or have any ideas for improvement?


    Any info is much appreciated.


    Cheers,


    Mark

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  3. #2
    Join Date
    May 2012
    Location
    Woodstock (Cowra)
    Age
    70
    Posts
    2,514

    Default

    Plan 3
    What size/type table saw, this makes a big difference where you put it.
    IO would suggest regardless of table saw type, I would put it at the end of your timber rack and garage door, it gives you a beter option for ripping long lengths and put the drill press where you originally had the table saw, allows for drilling longer lenths without the hassle of flipping material end for end.
    The person who never made a mistake never made anything

    Cheers
    Ray

  4. #3
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Towradgi
    Posts
    4,544

    Default

    Mark, is the shed insulated? How many electrical circuits are there? 10 Amp and 15 Amp?

    What I did, with my then new shed, insulated all surfaces, yes even the floor, lined the walls with 19mm melamine and laid 19mm yellow/orange tongue flooring. My back still loves me for that last bit.

    As to where to place toys, Table saw at the door, along with room for a Thicky and jointer. That way you breakdown your stock at the closest point of entry.

    No mention of dust collection, you better look into that.

    Hand tool area in the other half of the shed.

    For the "Household" storage, a cheap 3*3 tin shed is great.

    As much storage and lighting as possible and the most important, the bar fridge, has to be easily accessible for when you are "cleaning" the shed.
    Pat
    Work is a necessary evil to be avoided. Mark Twain

  5. #4
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    Perth
    Posts
    23,583

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by rwbuild View Post
    Plan 3
    What size/type table saw, this makes a big difference where you put it.
    IO would suggest regardless of table saw type, I would put it at the end of your timber rack and garage door, it gives you a beter option for ripping long lengths and put the drill press where you originally had the table saw, allows for drilling longer lenths without the hassle of flipping material end for end.
    I agree with this but as Mark says he's putting his machines on wheels he should be able to move things around to suit.

    FWIW Although I have several machines on wheels or plastic skids I'm not a fan of moving machines especially the disconnecting and reconnecting dust extraction. The machines I still occasional move around are; my planer thicknesser which about once every 3 months gets coated by the door to enable processing of longer lengths, and my Bandsaw gets moved about once a year for the same reason. I would really not want to be doing this with my TS which I managed to arrange to have a decent IN-OUT path.

    Despite this I can really appreciate the need to be able to move things in a small shed.

  6. #5
    Join Date
    Apr 2018
    Location
    Adelaide
    Posts
    13

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Pat View Post
    Mark, is the shed insulated? How many electrical circuits are there? 10 Amp and 15 Amp?

    What I did, with my then new shed, insulated all surfaces, yes even the floor, lined the walls with 19mm melamine and laid 19mm yellow/orange tongue flooring. My back still loves me for that last bit.

    As to where to place toys, Table saw at the door, along with room for a Thicky and jointer. That way you breakdown your stock at the closest point of entry.


    No mention of dust collection, you better look into that.

    Hand tool area in the other half of the shed.

    For the "Household" storage, a cheap 3*3 tin shed is great.

    As much storage and lighting as possible and the most important, the bar fridge, has to be easily accessible for when you are "cleaning" the shed.
    Thanks Pat. The shed isn't insulated..... yet! I am about to line the shed walls with 12mm ply, and will insulate at least the northern side.

    I had my sparky install an electrical sub-board in the shed, there are currently about 10 double GPOs around the shed (10 Amp) and a separate 15 Amp socket.

    Dust collection is on the radar, just starting to investigate it now.

    Cheers.

  7. #6
    Join Date
    Apr 2018
    Location
    Adelaide
    Posts
    13

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by BobL View Post
    I agree with this but as Mark says he's putting his machines on wheels he should be able to move things around to suit.

    FWIW Although I have several machines on wheels or plastic skids I'm not a fan of moving machines especially the disconnecting and reconnecting dust extraction. The machines I still occasional move around are; my planer thicknesser which about once every 3 months gets coated by the door to enable processing of longer lengths, and my Bandsaw gets moved about once a year for the same reason. I would really not want to be doing this with my TS which I managed to arrange to have a decent IN-OUT path.

    Despite this I can really appreciate the need to be able to move things in a small shed.
    I'm sure I will be tapping into your vast knowledge of dust collection when I start to look into it Bob.

    Thanks for your input.

  8. #7
    Join Date
    Apr 2018
    Location
    Adelaide
    Posts
    13

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by rwbuild View Post
    Plan 3
    What size/type table saw, this makes a big difference where you put it.
    IO would suggest regardless of table saw type, I would put it at the end of your timber rack and garage door, it gives you a beter option for ripping long lengths and put the drill press where you originally had the table saw, allows for drilling longer lenths without the hassle of flipping material end for end.
    Hi Pat, my table saw is a DeWalt an older version of this one:

    Home - Products - Powertools - Saws - Table Saws - Table SawTable Saw - DEWALT

    I will take your advice onboard, thanks you your help.

    Cheers

  9. #8
    Join Date
    Jul 2015
    Location
    Hunter Valley
    Age
    52
    Posts
    879

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by MaIN2203 View Post
    Thanks Pat. The shed isn't insulated..... yet! I am about to line the shed walls with 12mm ply, and will insulate at least the northern side.
    A tip for you if I may - work out a condensation solution before you line the walls with anything. I'm assuming you have a Colorbond shed, with a profiled cladding panel, all on top of a concrete slab? We bought our place with a 10m x 7m version of one of these out back, and the previous owner had simply put Aircell insulation on the roof section, nowhere else, and then bolted 15mm ply onto the purlins holding the wall cladding.

    When we moved in, a few years after he'd done this, we investigated behind one of these sheets of ply. The condensation had started mould growing, and because there was no vermin/critter seal on the Colorbond, all sorts of creepy-crawlies had found homes in behind it all.

    What we did was to pull down all the lining, then pull off the cladding, and put in Kingspan Insulshed 50 to act as a condensation barrier. We then installed a vermin seal on the bottom, and are beginning the lining process (building frame walls to go between the structural supports which will have SoundScreen insulation in them, and be internally clad with 18mm plywood to provide walls we can hang much from.

    Of course, if this isn't a "forever" shed, you can choose to skip stuff, but I won't easily forget what we saw behind the original sheets of plywood...

  10. #9
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    Hobart
    Posts
    2,426

    Default

    Hi Mark

    The best advice that I can give is not to repeat the mistakes that I made thirty years ago. Now that My shed is full of treasures its a major removal to clear it to fix basic problems:
    • the concrete floor is neither level nor smooth - needs professional coat of smoothe level concrete, or yellow tongue.
    • Varnished pine VJ and pink primer bricks are light absorbers - should paint white or similar,
    • No insulation,
    • Insufficient storage.


    It is a real pain to work on a sh*t floor - things wobble, cannot easily drag benches, etc. So fix now, or never.

    Others have talked about insulation - here's a good reference:
    Insulation | YourHome

    As others have suggested, regard the roller door as an extension of your lead-in, tail-out space from table saw, etc. Plan accordingly.

    If camping/household storage must go in shed, then put on shelves 2.1 metres above floor, and higher. Useful stuff can go below.

    If you line the shed, the most versatile and amongst the most cost effective is yellow tongue flooring. You can hang anything on it.


    Wish I had thought properly, earlier.

    Graeme

  11. #10
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Location
    hobart
    Posts
    11

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Midnight Man View Post
    A tip for you if I may - work out a condensation solution before you line the walls with anything. I'm assuming you have a Colorbond shed, with a profiled cladding panel, all on top of a concrete slab? We bought our place with a 10m x 7m version of one of these out back, and the previous owner had simply put Aircell insulation on the roof section, nowhere else, and then bolted 15mm ply onto the purlins holding the wall cladding.

    When we moved in, a few years after he'd done this, we investigated behind one of these sheets of ply. The condensation had started mould growing, and because there was no vermin/critter seal on the Colorbond, all sorts of creepy-crawlies had found homes in behind it all.

    What we did was to pull down all the lining, then pull off the cladding, and put in Kingspan Insulshed 50 to act as a condensation barrier. We then installed a vermin seal on the bottom, and are beginning the lining process (building frame walls to go between the structural supports which will have SoundScreen insulation in them, and be internally clad with 18mm plywood to provide walls we can hang much from.

    Of course, if this isn't a "forever" shed, you can choose to skip stuff, but I won't easily forget what we saw behind the original sheets of plywood...
    I'm interested in this as per my current Tassie 6x5 Shed build thread. I'm still keen on using 12mm ply for lining my walls and roof. I'm having the following insulation installed as part of my build. For the walls: FoamCell 3-in-1 multipurpose wrap: (insulation, thermal break, vapour barrier) and for the roof: R1.3 55mm Roof Builders Insulation Blanket + Support mesh.

    Do i need more insulation under the ply? if so what sort and do in need to leave an air gap? Can I the have the wall and ceiling effectively sealed or do i need to ensure ventilation behind the ply and insulation?

    p.s. I hope this isn't classed as a thread hijack. Hopefully any answers useful to the OP.

  12. #11
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    Hobart
    Posts
    2,426

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by farm_boy View Post
    ........ I'm having the following insulation installed as part of my build. For the walls: FoamCell 3-in-1 multipurpose wrap: (insulation, thermal break, vapour barrier) and for the roof: R1.3 55mm Roof Builders Insulation Blanket + Support mesh.......
    That insulation will be better than nothing, but not by much....

    Recommended insulation for Hobart is:
    • Roof: R = 4.1
    • Walls R = 2.8
    • And if you live in a colder part of Hobart such as Ferntree then you will need more.


    Check out the insulation reference in my previous post.

  13. #12
    Join Date
    Apr 2018
    Location
    Adelaide
    Posts
    13

    Default

    Thanks for you advice Midnight Man. Yep my shed is your standard "monument" colour Colourbond, the concrete was poured after the shed was erected so the floor is sealed.
    I installed foil backed insulation (not sure what it's called) when I put the roof on.
    My plan was to use 90 x 35 structural pine tek screwed on the flat to the metal purlins as a frame, I will rebate the screws so the head is not sticking out. I was then planning to screw 12mm ply to the timber frame. Are you saying that if I put normal wool insulation in the gap there is a chance that mould could develop over time?

    I'm not sure if this will be my "forever" shed, but I still want to do it right.

    Thanks for your help.

  14. #13
    Join Date
    Apr 2018
    Location
    Adelaide
    Posts
    13

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by GraemeCook View Post
    Hi Mark

    The best advice that I can give is not to repeat the mistakes that I made thirty years ago. Now that My shed is full of treasures its a major removal to clear it to fix basic problems:
    • the concrete floor is neither level nor smooth - needs professional coat of smoothe level concrete, or yellow tongue.
    • Varnished pine VJ and pink primer bricks are light absorbers - should paint white or similar,
    • No insulation,
    • Insufficient storage.


    It is a real pain to work on a sh*t floor - things wobble, cannot easily drag benches, etc. So fix now, or never.

    Others have talked about insulation - here's a good reference:
    Insulation | YourHome

    As others have suggested, regard the roller door as an extension of your lead-in, tail-out space from table saw, etc. Plan accordingly.

    If camping/household storage must go in shed, then put on shelves 2.1 metres above floor, and higher. Useful stuff can go below.

    If you line the shed, the most versatile and amongst the most cost effective is yellow tongue flooring. You can hang anything on it.


    Wish I had thought properly, earlier.

    Graeme

    Thanks Graeme, my shed floor is flat so no problems there. I was thinking of using 12mm structural ply but may rethink that. The ply sheets I am looking at are 2400mm in length which is the height of the walls so easy installation.
    If I use ply do you think I would need to paint or seal the bottom of the timber that is sitting on the concrete? The concrete isn't sealed so not sure if moisture would enter the timber and make it swell.
    I could paint the ply (or similar) white to make it lighter?

    Cheers

  15. #14
    Join Date
    Apr 2018
    Location
    Adelaide
    Posts
    13

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by farm_boy View Post

    p.s. I hope this isn't classed as a thread hijack. Hopefully any answers useful to the OP.
    No problem with your questions Farm Boy, any info is useful and appreciated.

    Cheers,

    Mark

  16. #15
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    Hobart
    Posts
    2,426

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by MaIN2203 View Post
    .....
    If I use ply do you think I would need to paint or seal the bottom of the timber that is sitting on the concrete? .....
    I would leave a small gap - say 5 mm - between the cladding and the concrete to stop wicking. Peace of mind, if nothing else.

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