Thread: Shed lights

Fluoros are good for even light, which is good for working

I'd be looking for similar even light from LEDs

From an electrician that's spent the last 4 years involved in energy efficient lighting trials for the WA state government...

Fluro lights are still the answer for you mate.

Good LED's are still very expensive. Think about $80 trade each for a downlight, about $110 each for a fluro tube replacement (that's without the fitting for the fluro replacement as well).

The newer electronically ballasted fluro fittings are very efficient. Not quite as efficient as LED's but getting there.

LED's still have problems dissipating heat from the junction so require large heatsinks to do the job. Something you just don't get in cheaper LED's hence the higher failure rate among the cheap stuff. Also a problem if they are near the roof in a poorly insulated shed.

Just to give you a bit of an idea of the difference between industrial LED's with decent heatsinks and the garden variety you buy from Bunnings. A 50w LED flood from Bunnings is around $100 and weights a couple of kilos. To do the same wattage in an industrial quality fitting you could put in a carpark or such, you're looking at a fitting that weighs upwards of 15kg which is pretty much all heatsink and costs over $1500.

Don't get me wrong, I LOVE LED's. I'm putting over 100 LED fittings in my renovation to the house at the moment. It's the way of the future but it's not there yet (unless you want to pay big bucks).

If you're set on LED's, try http://lumitex.com.au/ . Great company to deal with and reliable data from their products.

Hit me up if you've got any other questions. I'm up to my ears in this stuff at the moment.

Thanks for the info dalejw !!

Will let you know if I have any questions. Much appreciated.

Just thought I would add to this thread. I was always interested in led lighting, but to date it has been a little lacking.

A couple of years back, I decided to add some of that 5050 led stip to a 3x3m shade pop up oztrail shade tent that I use for camping. I bought 5 metres of it and stuck it to the frame. I was surprsied how bright it was. I had divided it into 4 lengths, and now I only ever power up 2 of those lengths because its too bright. So i decided after that to play with some led downlights for the house. Until recently, all attempts were fairly dissapointing, the problem being the typical LED having a narrow beam so only spot lighting and area.

Enter the new samsung 5630 led chip. On a whim, I decided to buy a pack of GU10 style LED bulbs made with the new 5630 samsung chip. I think they have about 8 leds in each bulb. I was surprised to find they outperformed the 50W 240V halogen in both light output and spread. I went back and bought more to replace all the halogens.

I think I am onto a winner. My new house is 2 story, built into a hill. Looks like a single story at the front. The front has a concrete deck to the boundary, and under that is some wasted space which I decided to turn into a workshop whilst I wait for the new shed to be approved. I bought two 5 metre rolls of the 5630 led strip from fleabay, and a 10A power supply to light the area up.. I glued one roll to the underneath of the concrete slab with silicon, and turns out thats all I need.

Needless to say, no more fluro for me. The new shed will be fitted out with 5630 led strips. They produce more light, its more even with a better spread. Cost is about $15 per 5m roll from an aussie seller on fleabay, and a 10A power supply which will power a couple of 5m lengths is also about $15 of fleabay (china supplier though).

A word of warning though, buy the warm white. The cool white is too harsh. I am going to do an experiment with a mix of both and see how it turns out. With LED's there is a middle of the road temperature called natural white which is good, but I could not source any in the 5630 chips.

Hey pearo,

Thanks heaps for the info !

Can you send me a link the the fleabay seller ?

Great info !

Originally Posted by dalejw

From an electrician that's spent the last 4 years involved in energy efficient lighting trials for the WA state government...

Fluro lights are still the answer for you mate.

Good LED's are still very expensive. Think about $80 trade each for a downlight, about $110 each for a fluro tube replacement (that's without the fitting for the fluro replacement as well).

The newer electronically ballasted fluro fittings are very efficient. Not quite as efficient as LED's but getting there.

LED's still have problems dissipating heat from the junction so require large heatsinks to do the job. Something you just don't get in cheaper LED's hence the higher failure rate among the cheap stuff. Also a problem if they are near the roof in a poorly insulated shed.

Just to give you a bit of an idea of the difference between industrial LED's with decent heatsinks and the garden variety you buy from Bunnings. A 50w LED flood from Bunnings is around $100 and weights a couple of kilos. To do the same wattage in an industrial quality fitting you could put in a carpark or such, you're looking at a fitting that weighs upwards of 15kg which is pretty much all heatsink and costs over $1500.

Don't get me wrong, I LOVE LED's. I'm putting over 100 LED fittings in my renovation to the house at the moment. It's the way of the future but it's not there yet (unless you want to pay big bucks).

If you're set on LED's, try http://lumitex.com.au/ . Great company to deal with and reliable data from their products.

Hit me up if you've got any other questions. I'm up to my ears in this stuff at the moment.

You've made some very good points there Dale.

Sorry to rub it in, but you prolly wish you Aldi stores over there. They regularly have LED globes (for batten holder fittings et al, and they are about $10 for a 10w. They also have 36w Flood lights for I think $25.and they are the duckz nutz for strong point source lighting. The floodies have pretty big heat sinks. The globes can be pulled out with a naked hand after being on for however long. They are both warm white ~2800 Kelvin. Some are just a wee bit too yellow so I use a blue marker pen on the glass to knock that back a bit.

To get a more even lighting (as Ian suggests) these flood lights can be pointed upwards to a white ceiling (like the bounce flash principle in photography) and this will result in an excellent even light, but it costs more light - where you have two lights, you might have three - just the same as bounce flash requires opening up the aperture on a camera.

Aldi have also had LED tube replacements but i didn't take much notice of them. Trouble is they don't stock them as such (yet). They have them on special about 4 times per year.

Glenn: There are needs for different types of light sources for different things. For example, checking an sharp edge for dull highlights requires a point source light such as a globe or floody - not a bounced floody or fluoro. Furthermore, if you need to bring on that reluctant sneeze that you know is in the background, a fluoro won't work - must be a point source. Don't ask me why it is so, I just know it is. However, bringing on a reluctant sneeze may not be high on your lighting priority list of requirements .

Personally I hate fluorescent light - cool or warm, but that is just me. There is also the possibility of not seeing something that is moving (dangerously fast and sharp, that is) because of their stroboscopic effect - never experienced this myself, and there maybe two schools of thought there. They are also not the greatest for photography, but digital cameras may have solved that to at least some extent.

RayG has a thread running somewhere about installing LED strips into his hee-yuge sheds. Not sure if there's been any progress for a while, but he is going to run them off solar panels.

Hey FF.

Thanks for reply. My initial requirement is flood lighting, as the shed is currently like the black hole of Calcutta.

Once I get the shed set up a little more, then I can look at telescopic point sources etc.

Originally Posted by Glenn.Visca

Hey pearo,

Thanks heaps for the info !

Can you send me a link the the fleabay seller ?

Great info !

Yup, this is the stuff here: http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/5630-SMD-...item4d148d3ac8

Power supply here: http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/261420719...84.m1497.l2649

I lied about the power supply, they are actually $22. If you have a sparky friend and dont mind adding a box to the equation, these are a better power supply: http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Led-Strip...item33858e0cf4


FenceFurniture, I have checked out the aldi LED lighting and I think its way over priced.

The strips I use will outdo 2 fluro's, and I reckon its better on the eyes. Not as warm as halogen or incandescent, but much warmer than a fluro. They are DC too, so provided your power supply is half decent there is no flicker or strobing that you find with fluro's.

LEt me know if these pics are too big and I will try resize them. I host on google to save forum space. Being new to this forum, I am not sure if it automatically resizes or if there is an option to set the size.

This is the light from one 5 metre strip (building a new centreboard for my boat, which we broke racing 2 weeks ago!):



this pic shows the led strip, glued to the roof with wet area silicone.



There is two 4' fluro's on the wall, just the other side of the grey slats. This strip of led lights is much brighter. I would think to achieve the same light output with fluro lights I would need at least 4, and that is only on one side. So maybe 6-8 fluro's to light up the whole area. Another strip of LED on the other side of that space would give me plenty of light.

Also worth noting, is that the roof there is lucky to be 2m high, so in your typical 3+m shed height the light distribution would be even better.

Originally Posted by Pearo

FenceFurniture, I have checked out the aldi LED lighting and I think its way over priced.

To be clear, I'm not talking about the strips they were selling - just the globes and flood lights.

Originally Posted by FenceFurniture

To be clear, I'm not talking about the strips they were selling - just the globes and flood lights.

Yup yup.

I have played with the flood lights too. Bought some 10W ones, some 30W ones and a 50W one. Not from Aldi, just some cheapies from china. I used three 30W RGB units at the house I just sold. I reckon the aldi ones would be safe, but the chinese fleabay ones are outright dangerous and I recommend everyone stay clear from them. I gutted the 30W ones I bought because they were so dangerous. They need a 32V power supply, so I wired them for DC then used a decent 32V power supply to drive them.

Head over to my Picassa album for a look. https://picasaweb.google.com/1179078...LedFloodLight# yell out if the link does not work. The early photos show the controller, which was sitting under the primary mains input. For those who a unaware, the circuit on the left in those pics is a switch mode power supply (SMPS) (same thing as found in your computer). A SMPS rectifies the mains into DC, and the DC voltage is getting close to 400V, so is incredibly dangerous. The circuit board floating on the right is the LED controller/driver, which is sitting right under that 400VDC section. This thing is a fire hazard, and a shock hazard.

Furthermore, those photos show the earth connection (which in AU, is technically not needed for lighting fixtures above a certain height, unless the rules have changed since I went of the tools 15 year ago). That earth connection is a joke, dangerous and illegal.

I'm running 2 x 18W LED for wood carving, 120 degree cones of light. $45 each.
Each weighs approx 380g. Bright as old 150W incandescent. No, they do not get hot,
warm, but never hot. True, the heat sink must dissapate something but my shop is the room next
to the location of my HarmanPP38+ which runs 24/7 and heats my entire house 2 x 1200sqft.

They might be on for 8+hrs per day especially in our winters. At 18W, can't get concerned.
Does your sun set at the solstice at 1:52PM?

I like the variety of color temps. One neutral, one warm white.

There's no value in any recommended lighting if it is suspended so far away as to
not provide adequate illumination at the bench top. The inverse square rule
applies nicely (double the distance, you get 1/4 of the light intensity.)
Waste to light the far end of the shop.

Just to add to the mix, I have fluros in the shed but these are up at the ceiling. They give good light but not always exactly where I want or need it, especially as the roof height is 3.6m at the peak. To help out I use a couple of running or sliding lights which are hung at approx 2.4m.

Not sure how to pull the pix from an old thread so have added the link. This has worked very well for a lot of years, is relatively cheap and puts the light where I want it.

https://www.woodworkforums.com/f44/running-light-31181

Thanks bob .. nice idea !