Thread: Table Bowed on new H&F BP-305 [among other things]

I'll try opening the bottom door a crack. (Have to disable the safety switch, but that's easy enough.)

Incidentally, now I know I'm a little slow - the reason one lower guide is angled at 45° is to allow the table to tilt. Took a day to figure and it was staring me in the face.

I've got to race in and drop off the faulty Dremel battery, (will it never end?), then I'll come back and tackle it again.

I figure there are two choices for me right now - follow the (very good) advice to return this thing, or persevere and rebuild it into a decent saw.
If I return it and buy another elsewhere, with my budget I could well end up with another lemon, so I choose the second option. That's what I do with all second-hand equipment. I'll treat this thing the same.

I think those lower guides are a 'tack-on'. The whole machine is built using metric bolts and screws, yet the supplied 3mm allen key for the lower guides is really sloppy and tries to round the head. A 1/8" allen key is a perfect fit. Even the allen key head upper thrust bearing screw is metric and a metric allen key fits perfectly.

Originally Posted by Hermit

I'll try opening the bottom door a crack. (Have to disable the safety switch, but that's easy enough.)

Incidentally, now I know I'm a little slow - the reason one lower guide is angled at 45° is to allow the table to tilt. Took a day to figure and it was staring me in the face.

Ah! I knew they did it for a reason.

I figure there are two choices for me right now - follow the (very good) advice to return this thing, or persevere and rebuild it into a decent saw.
If I return it and buy another elsewhere, with my budget I could well end up with another lemon, so I choose the second option. That's what I do with all second-hand equipment. I'll treat this thing the same.

Only excepting that as a new item, the law is on your side re expectations for a reasonably workable machine. I love fixing things up - and when you buy secondhand that is always the possibility - sometimes even the advantage.

I think you should at least keep H&F abreast of developments, and maybe say that if it suits whatever procedures they have, that you are prepared to keep it on trial for another x days, but that otherwise it needs to go back and you are not happy at all overall. I know some people go right off - and probably get results - but personally I'm not really naturally inclined that way.

I haven't dealt with H&F, but responses here and elsewhere indicate that have a good name in general. I don't understand the economics of them selling stuff that is 'somewhat sloppy' and then having all the aftersales trouble and expense fixing up problems that ideally shouldn't come from their equipment in the first place.

Cheers,
Paul.

Originally Posted by pmcgee

Ah! I knew they did it for a reason.



Only excepting that as a new item, the law is on your side re expectations for a reasonably workable machine. I love fixing things up - and when you buy secondhand that is always the possibility - sometimes even the advantage.

I think you should at least keep H&F abreast of developments, and maybe say that if it suits whatever procedures they have, that you are prepared to keep it on trial for another x days, but that otherwise it needs to go back and you are not happy at all overall. I know some people go right off - and probably get results - but personally I'm not really naturally inclined that way.

I haven't dealt with H&F, but responses here and elsewhere indicate that have a good name in general. I don't understand the economics of them selling stuff that is 'somewhat sloppy' and then having all the aftersales trouble and expense fixing up problems that ideally shouldn't come from their equipment in the first place.

Cheers,
Paul.

I got it set up OK for small cuts again today, but haven't tried any re-sawing yet. Ran out of daylight. After cross-cutting a 4 x 2, the blade stayed back hard against the thrust bearings for about 30 seconds before returning, making a bit of noise in the meantime. Normal?

I discovered that I can't tilt the table to exactly 45 degrees without the blade hitting the table insert, too. If I undo the table top and slide it all the way to the left of the blade, it just clears the insert at 45 degrees but hits the insert at 90 degrees.
I guess I won't be tilting it to 45 often anyway, but whenever I do I'll have to move and re-align the table top, then move it back afterwards. The manual described 2 inserts, but the bandsaw only came with one. The manual is for a different bandsaw anyway. With all of the other crap, I totally forgot to try to get the real one for a BP-305. (I'll bet there's no such thing.)

A question. I see from YouTube videos that the blade thrust bearings should be about the thickness of a playing card away from the blade. The blade moves in and out 1/2mm as it turns. Should it be a playing card at the closest point so it never touches without load, or at the furthest point, so that the blade just touches the guide during the part of it's rotation when it moves back. I've tried both, but don't want excessive wear.

I wish I knew a local bandsaw expert, first to help and then maybe to write a report on it's condition and usability for future proceedings before I possibly send it back.

Wanna hear something funny? I dropped off the Dremel battery today at Mitre 10 as arranged between them and Bosch, then shortly after getting home I received a very rude phone call from Mitre 10 telling me that they won't touch my battery, and that it will be left at the front desk. Went on to say that that is because I bought it online. He read over the receipt, saying where I bought it, when he accepted the battery from me.
I can't get in there again to retrieve it for a few days to post it while I'm waiting for deliveries, so another big f-up.
Both Bosch and My Tool Store have been great, but Mitre 10..... Guess where I won't be shopping any more? He's lost a long-term customer.

Steve,

The blade should only touch the thrust bearings while under load. You are correct about the playing card. I use that for the thrust bearings and a dollar bill to set the guides.

On the table tilting 45* I can't use my zci when tilted 45* I have to put the stock insert back in.

Sorry to hear abou the store issues. That's just one more reason to shop online. You don't have to deal with bad customer service. Though I prefer to buy locally sometimes your hand is forced.

Bret

Originally Posted by Hermit

I got it set up OK for small cuts again today, but haven't tried any re-sawing yet. Ran out of daylight. After cross-cutting a 4 x 2, the blade stayed back hard against the thrust bearings for about 30 seconds before returning, making a bit of noise in the meantime. Normal?

I discovered that I can't tilt the table to exactly 45 degrees without the blade hitting the table insert, too. If I undo the table top and slide it all the way to the left of the blade, it just clears the insert at 45 degrees but hits the insert at 90 degrees. ...

A question. I see from YouTube videos that the blade thrust bearings should be about the thickness of a playing card away from the blade. The blade moves in and out 1/2mm as it turns. Should it be a playing card at the closest point so it never touches without load, or at the furthest point, so that the blade just touches the guide during the part of it's rotation when it moves back. I've tried both, but don't want excessive wear.

Re table tilt, I've never used a bandsaw tilted - just tilted it up for the sake of it
If it was/is a keeper, then I'd probably just file the insert to create clearance at 45o, or make another insert just for that from mdf or aluminium or whatever.

Properly, the blade should track in the same position at all times. The blade on my old Barker bs doesn't because the tyres are flat, hard and (officially) cactus, but it works fine

If the blade moves it might indicate some tweaking could be done with the alignments of the upper and lower wheels, but I wouldn't worry too much about it at this point. Everything I've ever seen says to have them co-planar. The Carter vid is the only other opinion I've seen.

The blade should just clear the bearing at its closest point. Running without load it won't touch that bearing. I expect when you start cutting it will just sit back against the thrust bearing. Hopefully that would eliminate the 30 seconds on the bearing after cutting.

Progress?

Cheers,
Paul

Originally Posted by pmcgee

Re table tilt, I've never used a bandsaw tilted - just tilted it up for the sake of it
If it was/is a keeper, then I'd probably just file the insert to create clearance at 45o, or make another insert just for that from mdf or aluminium or whatever.

Properly, the blade should track in the same position at all times. The blade on my old Barker bs doesn't because the tyres are flat, hard and (officially) cactus, but it works fine

If the blade moves it might indicate some tweaking could be done with the alignments of the upper and lower wheels, but I wouldn't worry too much about it at this point. Everything I've ever seen says to have them co-planar. The Carter vid is the only other opinion I've seen.

The blade should just clear the bearing at its closest point. Running without load it won't touch that bearing. I expect when you start cutting it will just sit back against the thrust bearing. Hopefully that would eliminate the 30 seconds on the bearing after cutting.

Progress?

Cheers,
Paul

Thanks, Paul. I'll give it a good workout in the morning and see how it goes with re-sawing this Blackbutt down to 10mm. If I can get a few boards done without it screwing up again I'll try to cut a small sheet of veneer. If that works OK I'll be happy for now and can gradually work the other bugs out.

If it stuffs up during testing, I'll have to get someone to help me out and make guides etc that work properly. Don't know who yet. I'll cross that bridge when I come to it.

I'm sick of thinking about the thing at this point. My luck better change tomorrow.

I'm not sure if you have shown us your fence already ...

It should be reasonably high relative to the material you are resawing ... but I guess Mark Duginske already told you that

Under my Album on the forum called 'machinery' you can see my fence (I made) on the Barker bs.

Very basic fence ... but again ... it worked ok.

Just like me ... except for the working ok part.

It wants to clamp goodly to the table, and be square to the table, as the blade should be.

Good luck. ... or the neighbours might end up with a bs in their wheely-bin

Cheers,
Paul.

I think that I've got to concede defeat.

I don't know what's me doing things wrong and what's the machine any more. I need someone experienced to help me, but don't know anyone.
I think I need to know bandsaws well before I can do this, but I can't get to know them well until I do. Cath 22.

I've already filed brackets and slightly altered things over the last 3 weeks to try to remedy things, so it's no longer returnable.

I've been reminded that without an accurate bandsaw I can't do the stuff I want to do, so all projects are on the shelf.

Thanks for the help, guys, especially Paul. I'm afraid it was a waste of time.
Back to watching TV to fill in the days.

I would have given up long ago and just told them to pick up the machine and refund my money.

Yesterday I finally got to start up MY bandsaw.
YEAH RIGHT.
Dead as a dodo.
Called H&F in Brisbane.
Took about 20 minuted to go through what I had tried to do to fix it.
No worries. Call an electrician and tell them to send us the bill.
I have had nothing but good customer service from H&F in Brisbane.

Considering your machine has never been right, has never been worked and is still under warranty I think it is time to tell them they have 4 choices:

1 replace the complete machine with one in satisfying working condition
2 pick up the thing and refund your money
3 send a mechanic out to fix it to satisfying standard
4 pay the bill from a mechanic of your choice.

If neither works, then it is a matter for Dept of Fair Trading or whatever it is called in your state.

Cheers
Wolffie

Originally Posted by Hermit

I think that I've got to concede defeat.

I don't know what's me doing things wrong and what's the machine any more. I need someone experienced to help me, but don't know anyone.
I think I need to know bandsaws well before I can do this, but I can't get to know them well until I do. Cath 22.

I've already filed brackets and slightly altered things over the last 3 weeks to try to remedy things, so it's no longer returnable.

I've been reminded that without an accurate bandsaw I can't do the stuff I want to do, so all projects are on the shelf.

Thanks for the help, guys, especially Paul. I'm afraid it was a waste of time.
Back to watching TV to fill in the days.

Bugger, it looks like you have voided your warranty.
With my old 14" BS from CT I think it was BAS40 something , I was never able to resaw anything, the largest blade it could take was simply too flexible to do a decent cut.
Unfortunately it is a fact that you get what you pay for.

regards
Wolffie

Wolffie,

I would talk to H&F about them supplying a new machine, don't mention the minor mods you have done ,, I doubt that they would be visible, and in any case all you have done is to allow the machine to operate as it was supposed to do in the first place.


I know that you are in FNQ At Tully, but you should not have to put up with a machine, which you have PAID GOOD MONEY for, and that does not meet basic standards or operate or cut accurately.

Jeff
vk4

Originally Posted by vk4

Wolffie,

I would talk to H&F about them supplying a new machine, don't mention the minor mods you have done ,, I doubt that they would be visible, and in any case all you have done is to allow the machine to operate as it was supposed to do in the first place.


I know that you are in FNQ At Tully, but you should not have to put up with a machine, which you have PAID GOOD MONEY for, and that does not meet basic standards or operate or cut accurately.

Jeff
vk4

Jeff
I think you have mistaken Wolfie with Hermit who has the problem with the bandsaw
Cheers Rod

Originally Posted by vk4

Wolffie,

I would talk to H&F about them supplying a new machine, don't mention the minor mods you have done ,, I doubt that they would be visible, and in any case all you have done is to allow the machine to operate as it was supposed to do in the first place.


I know that you are in FNQ At Tully, but you should not have to put up with a machine, which you have PAID GOOD MONEY for, and that does not meet basic standards or operate or cut accurately.

Jeff
vk4

Wasn't me that did the mods, it was Hermit.
I was the one with nothing but good response from H&F.
The Sparky is coming tomorrow and H&F is paying the bill.

Thanks anyway for the advice
Cheers
Wolffie

Sorry GUYS, a case of right topic wrong person, I must have had a seniors moment.


And yes H&F are very good, I have dealt with them before and always a good outcome.

Jeff