Thread: breaking covid rules

Originally Posted by pippin88

Blaming individual cities does nothing.

Where did I even mention an individual city?

Originally Posted by GraemeCook

As to people trapped overseas we keep hearing monopoly numbers of those on the waiting list for repatriation. The blocking point is hotel space available for quarantine - cost about $3,000 per person after you arrive - and I cannot realistically see it abating this year. The best I can say for your situation, Ian, is that I would prefer to be trapped in Alberta than a lot of other places.

Maybe you will have to join the "in crowd" who seem to be able to travel internationally without restrictions.

Look as I've already said, even if I max out all my credit cards, I can't get close to the >$40,000 AUD I'd need to get my wife and myself back to AUS.
finding an additional $3,000 each for hotel quarantine is irrelevant in my situation.

Originally Posted by GraemeCook

Down here in Tasmania we have also raised the drawbridge and effectively closed Bass Strait, locking out "all those contaminated people from Sydney and Melbourne". Drastic, but it seems to be working. We have only had one covid case this calendar year. And restrictions here are relatively minor:

The fascinating thing is that Tasmania, according to last Fridays statistics in the Guardian (online) are leading the way on vaccinations. I can only assume that the "Burnie event" scared a lot of people - I suppose Tasmania is not very big, either geographically or in population, so people took more notice of the outbreak and acted in a more proactive way?

WA, from the same source, are lagging behind - presumably again the perceived low risk causing no motivation (as was the case in NSW and most other states until recently!).

Originally Posted by ian

Look as I've already said, even if I max out all my credit cards, I can't get close to the >$40,000 AUD I'd need to get my wife and myself back to AUS.
finding an additional $3,000 each for hotel quarantine is irrelevant in my situation.

Wondering if there is a sea-going skipper with a 40 footer who might like a bit of a sail?

Originally Posted by GraemeCook

Yep, the Pacific Ocean does make a reasonable moat, but given the credulity of the previous US administration, I then questioned whether it was adequate.

Down here in Tasmania we have also raised the drawbridge and effectively closed Bass Strait, locking out "all those contaminated people from Sydney and Melbourne". Drastic, but it seems to be working. We have only had one covid case this calendar year. And restrictions here are relatively minor:

• sign into any commercial premises (for tracing purposes),
• hand sanitisation,
• maintain social distancing - 1.5 metres,
• wear masks when visiting hospitals,
• that's it.

But we know other restrictions will be instantly rolled out if or when we have an outbreak.

This is issue of States being permitted to close their borders seemingly at will, is something I feel very strongly about.

All state governments and territories are sailing very close to, if not directly into, the wind when it comes to "border closures" and travel bans.


Up until the formal adoption of the Statute of Westminster on 9 October 1942, (although the Statute's adoption was made retrospective to the outbreak of WW2), certain sovereign powers -- including the ability to independently declare War, were "reserved" to the UK sovereign. I don't know how many on here can recall hearing a repeat of Menzies' "as a consequence Australia is also at War" speech.

So up until September 1939, not even the Commonwealth had full sovereign (i.e. independent) power, and the state parliaments which federated into the Australian Commonwealth on 1 January 1901 NEVER had those powers.


When Mr Palmer attempted to invoke s.92's "intercourse among the states ... shall be absolutely free" to challenge the validity of the Border Directions issued under WA's Emergency Management Act, the High Court held that the real constitutional question was whether the Border Directions exceeded the statutory powers conferred under WA's Emergency Management Act. And as Palmer had not argued that the Border Directions were outside the scope of that statutory power, the s.92 constitutional question did not arise.


It will be interesting to see if Palmer can succeed against WA should his proposed s.117 "no different treatment" challenge proceed.
As I understand the "facts" Premier McGowen is proposing to require people from other states, including people from WA who have been in another state, to prove they are NOT Covid positive before allowing them to enter WA.


What I find distressing is that Covid is thrusting a knife into the heart of Australia's guarantee of freedom of movement between the states.

Originally Posted by Lappa

Not true. These are the rules re Bunnings issued by the NSW Govt

“From Monday 23 August 2021 the following businesses cannot open to members of the public but can be open to trade or business customers

• garden centres and plant nurseries
• hardware and building supplies
• landscaping material supplies
• rural supplies
• timber supplies. “

I did not know that.
What I know is this statement from Bunnings
"With the new restrictions on retail spanning a large part of Sydney, Bunnings has made the decision to temporarily close all its stores across Greater Sydney to the general public," Bunnings managing director Mike Schneider said on the 20th August, 2021.
That's 3 days before the NSW government's order.

The decision was announced by the Premier at the 20th August press conference and was slated to come into effect from Monday 23rd together with the curfew laws. I suppose it was to give people a small space of time to get things in order. I, for one, would prefer to see these changes come into effect from midnight on the day they are announced.

Originally Posted by Warb

The fascinating thing is that Tasmania, according to last Fridays statistics in the Guardian (online) are leading the way on vaccinations. I can only assume that the "Burnie event" scared a lot of people - ?..

Yes, but The stats may be a little misleading in that Tas vax rates are only fractions of a percent ahead of other areas. Last night, 36% were fully vaccinated and a further 20% had received the first vax.

Where we are ahead is that the vax rats are quite uniform around the state; without the disparities of other states. For example, Brisbane has very high vax rates whilst Logan has amongst the lowest in the country. Last time I looked Logan was essentially a suburb of Brisbane.

We are all guilty of complacency.

Originally Posted by justonething

I did not know that.
What I know is this statement from Bunnings
"With the new restrictions on retail spanning a large part of Sydney, Bunnings has made the decision to temporarily close all its stores across Greater Sydney to the general public," Bunnings managing director Mike Schneider said on the 20th August, 2021.
That's 3 days before the NSW government's order.

It's confusing to say the least. I've just been to my local hardware which was open to anyone. I just checked the NSW covid site which says they can be open.
Screenshot 2021-08-23 162504.jpg

Originally Posted by GraemeCook

Yes, but The stats may be a little misleading in that Tas vax rates are only fractions of a percent ahead of other areas. Last night, 36% were fully vaccinated and a further 20% had received the first vax.

36% for Tasmania, only 26% for WA. The "predicted" time to 70% fully vaccinated (over 16's), based on a 7 day rolling average of daily doses, is 54 days for Tasmania, 62 days for NSW and 95 days for QLD. Interestingly it's 76 days for WA, so whilst they're lagging behind it looks like they're catching up! Nonetheless, Tasmania are doing well!

I wonder (assuming it's not politically incorrect, which when I think about it seems very likely!) if anyone has done any analysis on those differing rates within a state. It could be socio-economic, or perhaps religious, if the varying uptake is based on vaccine-hesitancy rather than availability. In western NSW apparently the vaccination numbers are shockingly low, but the rumour mill (it's too political for any official comment) is that the indigenous population have been very unwilling to get vaccinated.

Originally Posted by Picko

It's confusing to say the least. I've just been to my local hardware which was open to anyone. I just checked the NSW covid site which says they can be open.
Screenshot 2021-08-23 162504.jpg

There are two lists as such. The one I posted is for the 12 LGAs of concern. The one you posted is for LGAs in the Greater Sydney Area but not one of the 12 LGAs of concern To save confusion Bunnings decided to apply the rules to all their stores in the greater Sydney Area. Coles will be closing at 8:30pm in the LGSs of concern but it’s business as usual in the other LGAs but I’m not sure about Woolies.

This is a link to the opening page re Covid Restrictions

COVID-19 rules | NSW Government

A little further down it divides into Greater Sydney, Local Government Areas of Concern, Rural NSW etc.


887DBF07-F08D-44A8-A66A-A30837327A91.jpg

I agree it’s as clear as mud because when you do a search for restrictions in Google, you get a variety of links which can take you to the opening page, the page for the 12 LGAs of concern or the General Sydney Area or old rules and Regs.
My wife and I went for our usual walk today and 50% of people out there were not wearing masks when the rules state when outside your home you must wear a mask. The reason for not wearing a mask is if you are exercising and Barilaro said today walking or walking a dog is not exercise
so so you must wear a mask. Very confusing to say the least and is the information getting out to everyone. Unless you listen to the news or watch the 11am Gladys show, you have no idea of the rules. No adverts, nothing on social media from the Govt.

With Bunnings closed to public now except for Click'n'collect I was surprised that paint items can't be bought that way.

Was after some Scandi Oil, but their web site says no to it all.

Thankfully one of the paint shops carries Feast Watson and had a litre can and was willing to sell at the door.

Boy, this is getting to be a pain

But, as I keep reminding myself - first world problems Bob!

Originally Posted by ian

This is issue of States being permitted to close their borders seemingly at will, is something I feel very strongly about.

.....

What I find distressing is that Covid is thrusting a knife into the heart of Australia's guarantee of freedom of movement between the states.

I would have expected a lot of people to share your view, Ian, but that does not seem to be the case. There is a tremendous amount of debate on the matter and opinion seems to be overwhelmingly in support of the lockdowns and the drawbridge. Many more comments complaining that the government is too lax, especially where the are exemptions from the state border restrictions, and/or quarantine provisions.

Please note that my comments apply particularly to Tasmania which may be a little more insular than the mainland. I do not know of any surveys, but from discussions, my estimate is that at least 80%, possibly 90%, of people support the drawbridge.

Originally Posted by ian

What I find distressing is that Covid is thrusting a knife into the heart of Australia's guarantee of freedom of movement between the states.

Understandable Ian, especially as it seems increasingly pointless, judging by other countries experiences. Hard lockdowns, border closures, are only delaying the inevitable spread. The thing that puzzles me is, what do they think they will do if they do crush the virus #'s to zero? The way they talk in their daily briefings, I get the feeling they think something magical will happen when they get to xx% vaxxed.

It's almost as if Australia is now a victim of its own success over the past year.