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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    In the shed, Melbourne
    Age
    51
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    6,868

    Angry What gets up my goat!

    G'day,

    This is a bit of a rant to let off some steam.

    A client who has come in from the cold after about a year called me in for a briefing on some jobs. I supplied the quote and we agreed I'd proceed with conceptual layouts.

    This of course takes time. In all my quotes I allow for one set of client alterations, after that they pay based on an hourly fee, of which I charge at quarter hour blocks. Fair enough I think and is what all my clients have been educated to and some clients insist on this system without me raising the issue. (some clients will even insist I charge for parking)

    The client in question expect unlimited alterations at my quoted price. 90% of my clients are government and having said that, some will have multiple alterations on a particular job, some have none. I explained that maybe I could give some flexibility here, knowing too well that this client have too many people putting their 2 cents in and all want their own way.

    Now after spending 2 days working on concepts they want to get another quote in. I only expect a client to pay fair value for something, not for me to be a charity when umpteen alterations which is equivelant to the question of how long is a piece of string.

    Now it may be be that I loose the jobs, worse though is I have other work to do of more value and a tender to write - all of which could have been better spent on than a client who wants too much for no more than 2 cents. (I charge only for time taken, nothing more and this is how I add value for clients and transperancy)

    Now I'm two days down which I have to make up for.

    :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad:
    I make things, I just take a long time.

    www.brandhouse.net.au

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  3. #2
    Join Date
    Aug 2003
    Location
    Melbourne - Outer East Foothills
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    Default

    My dear old Dad was a retailer and self emplyed all his life. He used to say to me "No business is better than bad business". I use that a lot .
    If at first you don't succeed, give something else a go. Life is far too short to waste time trying.

  4. #3
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    In the shed, Melbourne
    Age
    51
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    Default

    G'day Gumby,

    True words. Sometimes there is other work on that pays better or a client might be more grief than they're worth. It's all money that pays the bills though, but there comes a point where you have to make a hard call.

    Still hope yet.
    I make things, I just take a long time.

    www.brandhouse.net.au

  5. #4
    Join Date
    May 2004
    Location
    here
    Posts
    815

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Waldo
    G'day,

    This is a bit of a rant to let off some steam.

    A client who has come in from the cold after about a year called me in for a briefing on some jobs. I supplied the quote and we agreed I'd proceed with conceptual layouts.

    sounds like a contract to me, a verbal contract is still bound by law under the trade practices act.

    Cheers Ian
    Some People are like slinky's,
    They serve no purpose at all,
    but they put a smile on your face when you throw them down the stairs.

  6. #5
    Join Date
    Jan 2003
    Location
    Melbourne, Australia
    Age
    52
    Posts
    706

    Default

    Bloody Freemasons keep getting my goat :mad:
    Great minds discuss ideas,
    average minds discuss events,
    small minds discuss people

  7. #6
    Join Date
    Aug 2003
    Location
    Melbourne - Outer East Foothills
    Posts
    6,792

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by DaveInOz
    Bloody Freemasons keep getting my goat :mad:
    You should charge them for the ride then
    I though they preferred sheep like the Kiwis do.

    (Shields Up)
    If at first you don't succeed, give something else a go. Life is far too short to waste time trying.

  8. #7
    Join Date
    Jan 2003
    Location
    Melbourne, Australia
    Age
    52
    Posts
    706

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Gumby
    You should charge them for the ride then
    I though they preferred sheep like the Kiwis do.

    (Shields Up)
    problem is the bastards only take the pretty ones
    Great minds discuss ideas,
    average minds discuss events,
    small minds discuss people

  9. #8
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    Port Sorell, TAS
    Age
    57
    Posts
    1,634

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by DaveInOz
    problem is the bastards only take the pretty ones
    Nah. Pretty ones don't give out. All virgins. Ugly ones rock!

    Waldo - i agree that you have a contract there; offer, acceptance, consideration. If you're wiling to burn bridges, have your lawyer send him a letter ($150?) informing him that you intend to sue him personally for the 2 days lost time, potential lost business etc. He may suddenly be your friend, and encourage the firm concerned that they don't really need another qoute after all.
    The only way to get rid of a [Domino] temptation is to yield to it. Oscar Wilde

    .....so go4it people!

  10. #9
    Join Date
    Aug 2003
    Location
    Melbourne - Outer East Foothills
    Posts
    6,792

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by TassieKiwi
    Nah. Pretty ones don't give out. All virgins. Ugly ones rock!

    .
    A few beers fixes the ugly problem too
    If at first you don't succeed, give something else a go. Life is far too short to waste time trying.

  11. #10
    Join Date
    Feb 2003
    Location
    Garvoc VIC AUSTRALIA
    Posts
    11,469

    Default

    I try follow the motto about the customer being right.... but some customers are so painfull they really deserve to do business with someone else instead of me.
    Painful customers generally don't have profitable jobs.
    Regards, Bob Thomas

    www.wombatsawmill.com

  12. #11
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    In the shed, Melbourne
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    51
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    6,868

    Default

    G'day Tassiekiwi,

    That's one avenue, but as all my clients have come by word of mouth I don't want to go down that road. They may come back tomorrow or next month - if not then so be it.
    I make things, I just take a long time.

    www.brandhouse.net.au

  13. #12
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    In the shed, Melbourne
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    51
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    6,868

    Default

    G'day Echidna,

    Yep to that one. Could have a beer or two to wash away the anger at client, but it's too cold that it might do damage to certain members of my body.
    I make things, I just take a long time.

    www.brandhouse.net.au

  14. #13
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Location
    Mackay Qld
    Age
    48
    Posts
    1,448

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Waldo
    The client in question expect unlimited alterations at my quoted price.
    Did you send him an offer that states the work you will do and that anything else will be charged on a time basis?
    Just send him an invoice if thats the case.
    Of course a verbal agreement is a contract.
    (O didn't make the bottom of your post before replying
    A very similar gripe of mine is clients changing layouts after I've been working on the design for a while then expecting the job to be finished and to council for approval when we'd originally stated,.. before changes.:mad:
    The last 2 big jobs I've done have been liike this and I dont get paid enough for the stress they cause.
    Luckily I get to work on roads mostly which dont often change.
    Mick

    avantguardian

  15. #14
    Join Date
    Aug 2003
    Location
    Brisbane - South
    Posts
    2,395

    Default

    Hey Waldo,

    I 've got a mate who does one off furniture for people & businesses. In the beginning I thought he was incredibly rude to his customers until I did some work for him & had to deal with the customers.

    He tells them up front he will design for them to their specifications & will SHOW them the output. They get no copies of drawings except hand drawn. Any changes will be charged for. They MUST pay 40% up front if the job is accepted based on the drawings & there will be NO changes. Any changes will be charged at full work rate. Full payment including cheque clearence time is made prior to final installation/delivery. But the client MUST come to the workshop & inspect the comission before installation/delivery.
    This is all told to them at the first client meeting VERBALLY as well as in written form.
    This guy has been bitten by a couple of the legal fraternity refusing to pay after installation & taking his designs to others to obtain cheaper quotes.

    He has more work than he can poke a stick at because of word of mouth & the up front limitations only affect those looking to rip him off. I'd say more than 40% of his work is repeat business because he REALLY looks after his customers with after sale service.
    Cheers

    Major Panic

  16. #15
    Join Date
    Jun 2003
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    ...
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    7,957

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Gingermick
    Of course a verbal agreement is a contract.

    Agreed, but try proving the terms of the contract in the absence of independant witnesses. :eek:


    Peter.

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