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  1. #31
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    Default Continuing testing

    In post #18 I displayed the results of my preliminary tests to check my setup and techniques.
    Image 4 - Checked for parallel 73.40mm
    Image 5 - Other end - Oh Bugger 7.36 .Out by 0.04mm. Is that close enough for a pass mark?
    Aussiephil declared in
    post #21"In the spirit of competition and making you do it twice, that's a fail."
    Was Phil correct? In so far as the a single error of 0.04mm is concerned possibly not. But what if I took 6 successive passes over the same area -, is there a possibility for the error to compound and produce a significant error? Let's consider the implication of such compounding error on a critical part of the plane build - cutting and setting the plane bedding angle. As I pointed out in
    post #26 I am looking for a plane which will be optimized for Australian hardwood species where the aim is to emphasize the grain.
    Both Doug3030 and Simplicity agreed with my thoughts that this implied a 50o bedding angle (York Pitch) which is recommended for hardwoods with interlocking and highly figure grain. A small error dropping the pitch closer to the Normal Pitch of 45o could have significant impact on the ability of the plane to produce the results I am seeking on harder Australian Hardwoods, particularly where interlocking and curly grain is involved.

    The question now is how to rectify the cause of such a potential problem.
    Doug3030 in post #25 correctly pointed out the that I was wasting my time with the piece of pallet material I was using, but I am not sure that in respect to the tests I was conducting that it played a significant role. I now see how the problem is being caused by my technique and that only a small compensation in how I feed the billet into the jointer is required to resolve the issue.

    I said in post #22
    I'm sure If I apply a little more pressure I could get the 73.40 down to 73.36
    That was a start in the right direction, but what I really needed to do was to bring the 73.36 up to 73.40. When we use a hand plane, we commence the smoothing cut with slightly more downward pressure through our left hand (assuming you are right-handed) on the front of the body. As we move along the cut the downward pressure becomes more evenly distributed between the right hand on the tote and the left hand on the front of the plane, finally ending the cut with most of the downward pressure being exerted through the right hand. That's exactly what I did BUT I was not using a hand plane - I was using an 8" electric jointer. Here the application of downward pressure between the right and left hand is reversed. You start with more pressure on the back of the billet (in-feed end of the jointer) and gradually move through even pressure between the hands and finally end with most of the downward pressure being exerted thru the left hand over the out-feed table.

    Think about where the smoothed section of the billet is after it has been cut. On the plane it is under the tote and the area to be smoothed is to the left of the blade. However on the jointer, it is the area which has passed over the revolving cutter which is on the left supported by the out-feed table while the area still to be cut is supported by the in-feed table to the right of the cutter head.

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  3. #32
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    Default

    Received a gift in my mailbox yesterday - a piece of tool steel 38 x 8 . Thanks Matt.

    Looking at the width of the of the steel, I am thinking it may be too narrow for a #5 Jack plane. As I discussed with Matt, maybe I should revise to plan to something of the size of a #4 or even a #3. I would appreciate your comments and suggestions.

    I must have been pretty bored last night with all this lock-down restrictions. Anyhow opened up LibreCAD and started playing around withe some unconventional designs. What are your thoughts on this:

    Attachment 481048
    Note dimension in bottom right corner should be 140 not 14
    Attached Images Attached Images
    Last edited by Oldgreybeard; 15th Sep 2020 at 09:51 AM. Reason: corrected dimension

  4. #33
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Oldgreybeard View Post
    In post #18 I displayed the results of my preliminary tests to check my setup and techniques.
    Aussiephil declared in

    Was Phil correct? In so far as the a single error of 0.04mm is concerned possibly not.
    Hey Bob, in all normal woodworking days anything under .1mm would generally be a pass , there was multiple legitimate reasons you could measure a difference and 0.04mm has got to be in the insignificant it doesn't matter category over that length .

    But it is a competition........

    I am curious if you did remeasure after the wet weekend, didn't spot it, my initial thought was it could swell with some moisture but really the percentage change would be in measurement error range and maybe the original measurement was increased due to sun induced expansion from heat.....

    Maybe once we get into machinist measurement territory with wood we are also well into error ranges.

    Cheers
    Phil

  5. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aussiephil View Post

    I am curious if you did remeasure after the wet weekend, didn't spot it, my initial thought was it could swell with some moisture but really the percentage change would be in measurement error range and maybe the original measurement was increased due to sun induced expansion from heat.....

    Cheers
    Phil
    I must confess that I got carried away with sorting my technique and by the time I remembered to measure the billet again the measurement did show an increase of 0.01mm. But by this time the weather had changed and the sun had been out for about 2 hours, so in the end the test was meaningless.

    BTW changing my technique by increasing the the downward pressure exerted by my left hand over the out-feed table does give me more consistent results.

    Cheers
    Bob

  6. #35
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    Default Support from UK

    The following words of support for our challenge was received today from English Woodworker Journal in response to my email seeking approval to use their copyright material. see post #2.

    Hi Bob,

    Many thanks for getting in touch and we're delighted you've found the
    plane build video useful for your challenge! No problem at all in
    sharing it

    We'd love to hear how you all get on.

    Kind regards,
    Helen

    Woodworking Videos & Blog |Hand Tool Woodworking | The English Woodworker

  7. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by Oldgreybeard View Post
    The following words of support for our challenge was received today from English Woodworker Journal in response to my email seeking approval to use their copyright material. see post #2.

    Bob

    Well chased up. We would not want Boris' mob (MI6?) chasing after us, although quarantining for two weeks should give us a heads up and a chance to flee the coop.

    Actually going to the link I see that the site is tailor made for Matt, not that I want to bring up favoritism or indeed any other heinous transgression of the rules:

    Made for Matt.png

    It should appeal to his macho image at the least.



    Regards
    Paul
    Bushmiller;

    "Power tends to corrupt. Absolute power corrupts, absolutely!"

  8. #37
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    Hi Guys

    Getting close to a final design. Just wish my memory was better so that I could member how to use Fusion 360 Drawing workspace Anyhow I think you will be able to get the gist of the design from this (took it into Photoshop and cleaned it up a bit)
    plane.jpg

    I appreciate your comments and suggestions.

  9. #38
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    Default

    maybe try again, invalid attachment.

  10. #39
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by doug3030 View Post
    maybe try again, invalid attachment.
    Try it now -don't know what went wrong
    Bob

  11. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by Oldgreybeard View Post
    Hi Guys

    Getting close to a final design. Just wish my memory was better so that I could member how to use Fusion 360 Drawing workspace Anyhow I think you will be able to get the gist of the design from this (took it into Photoshop and cleaned it up a bit)
    plane.jpg

    I appreciate your comments and suggestions.
    Bob,
    Have a look at the blade, an your mouth(No don’t go to the bathroom mirror).
    It looks like your going to really struggle to get a shaving out of that, unless you bring the blade down.

    I would draw my 50 degree bed angle, then draw your blade on that,
    Then do the rest of the plane.

    Cheers Matt.

  12. #41
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Simplicity View Post
    Bob,
    Have a look at the blade, an your mouth(No don’t go to the bathroom mirror).
    It looks like your going to really struggle to get a shaving out of that, unless you bring the blade down.

    I would draw my 50 degree bed angle, then draw your blade on that,
    Then do the rest of the plane.

    Cheers Matt.
    Ha ha you caught me out. I told you that my memory in terms of Fusion 360 was very rusty. The problem originated from the fact that I drew the blade bevel up instead of bevel down. I 100% agree with you
    I would draw my 50 degree bed angle, then draw your blade on that,
    Then do the rest of the plane.
    , but when I changed the bevel, I could find no way to spread the 2 body sections apart, short of starting the sketch all over again - all the dimensions and angles got all screwed up. Perhaps I need to get with the times and learn 3D Parametric modelling

    Cheers, Bob

  13. #42
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    Default

    Bob

    I prepared this about four hours ago but got distracted! In th meantime you and Matt have got it all sorted.

    "Bob

    I see that the plane is blue. What timber will you be using?

    Silly comments aside, the positioning of the blade will need some adjustment either forward or back as for the moment there is no effective mouth. Moving the blade bed back will give less room for blade adjustment bearing in mind you need "tap" room. Moving the blade forward may make it too far forward: The dilemma."

    However, there was clearly another and more simple solution.



    Regards
    Paul
    Bushmiller;

    "Power tends to corrupt. Absolute power corrupts, absolutely!"

  14. #43
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Oldgreybeard View Post
    Ha ha you caught me out. I told you that my memory in terms of Fusion 360 was very rusty. The problem originated from the fact that I drew the blade bevel up instead of bevel down. I 100% agree with you , but when I changed the bevel, I could find no way to spread the 2 body sections apart, short of starting the sketch all over again - all the dimensions and angles got all screwed up. Perhaps I need to get with the times and learn 3D Parametric modelling

    Cheers, Bob
    Or go old school,
    Pencil and paper lol

  15. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by Simplicity View Post
    Or go old school,
    Pencil and paper lol
    I can't draw a straight line let alone a curve! I think the last year that I did art at high school I got 2 out of 100 for my final Art exam. That was probably only because the teacher couldn't bring herself to give a score of zero.

    Cheers, Bob

  16. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bushmiller View Post
    Bob

    I prepared this about four hours ago but got distracted! In th meantime you and Matt have got it all sorted.

    "Bob

    I see that the plane is blue. What timber will you be using?



    Regards
    Paul
    Timber ?? Maybe blue gum
    Cheers,
    Bob

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