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  1. #91
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    No progress to report on the plane but I have an admission to make, I started another project while I was stalled and needed to finish it first. In my defence, it gave me some riveting practise for the rivets in the plane, so I'm calling it R & D.
    The Bulloak was some left from the plane, the blade was cut from an old panel saw blade, the brass wear strips were from an old tile bar and the other brass (discs and rivets) came from my newly arrived stock.

    P1010033.jpg P1010032.jpg

    I need to get some photography lessons from Brad.

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  3. #92
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
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    Melbourne
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    Quote Originally Posted by Picko View Post
    No progress to report on the plane but I have an admission to make, I started another project while I was stalled and needed to finish it first. In my defence, it gave me some riveting practise for the rivets in the plane, so I'm calling it R & D.
    The Bulloak was some left from the plane, the blade was cut from an old panel saw blade, the brass wear strips were from an old tile bar and the other brass (discs and rivets) came from my newly arrived stock.

    P1010033.jpg P1010032.jpg

    I need to get some photography lessons from Brad.

    Your Shame doesn’t look to bad to me Picko,
    Actually it looks very good, now a technical question,because I’ve wanted to build a square for ages, but have been single mindlessly,been focusing on my Plane build [emoji6].
    How did get your square square,this is the point that’s been holding me back.
    Did you just reference of another square,or use a surface plate and dial gauges or something?
    Cheers Matt.

  4. #93
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    East of Melbourne Aus.
    Age
    72
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    1,219

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    Quote Originally Posted by Simplicity View Post
    Your Shame doesn’t look to bad to me Picko,
    Actually it looks very good, now a technical question,because I’ve wanted to build a square for ages, but have been single mindlessly,been focusing on my Plane build [emoji6].
    How did get your square square,this is the point that’s been holding me back.
    Did you just reference of another square,or use a surface plate and dial gauges or something?
    Cheers Matt.
    To square the square you just need an edge and a pencil, take a measurment from one side and flip the square over and see if it aligns with the other mark.
    I am learning, slowley.

  5. #94
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    Oct 2010
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    NSW
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    I used my usual method to get it square Matt, I made it up as I went along. My theory was that the stock and the blade needed to be as parallel as I could get them to start with, and according to my vernier callipers I'm within 1/100th of a mm on both of them. I have a nice old Toledo toolmakers square which has always shown that it was very good so I used it to set up the new one. I had no idea how I could hold them in the right spot and attach the two pieces together so I ended up gluing them with PU glue first, with them clamped square. I checked them when the glue had set and then drilled and riveted them (three rivets through the inlaid discs). I haven't got any fancy measuring equipment but one test I did do which seems a bit more high tech than Pagies old faithful method was to hold the stock in the four jaw chuck on my lathe (stock firmly against the front of the chuck and parallel to the bed and blade propped with a high tech stick to keep it parallel to the bed) and run a dial indicator, held in the tool block ,along the blade. This showed between 1 & 2 hundredths, far closer than any other square in the 'wood' end of my shed.

  6. #95
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pagie View Post
    To square the square you just need an edge and a pencil, take a measurment from one side and flip the square over and see if it aligns with the other mark.
    Ye I know the old faithful way,but just let’s assume you want to go a little bit further, say you want to be a bit more technical, just because.

    Cheers Matt.

  7. #96
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    Nov 2004
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    Millmerran,QLD
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pagie View Post
    To square the square you just need an edge and a pencil, take a measurment from one side and flip the square over and see if it aligns with the other mark.
    Pagie

    That is a tried and tested method. Probably for this purpose you should use a marking knife instead of a pencil. I think the accuracy would be well within the realms of acceptable then.

    Regards
    Paul
    Bushmiller;

    "Power tends to corrupt. Absolute power corrupts, absolutely!"

  8. #97
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    Quote Originally Posted by Simplicity View Post
    Ye I know the old faithful way,but just let’s assume you want to go a little bit further, say you want to be a bit more technical, just because.

    Cheers Matt.
    Matt you can't be more square than square. I'm old and faithful
    I am learning, slowley.

  9. #98
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    NSW
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    Quote Originally Posted by Simplicity View Post
    Ye I know the old faithful way,but just let’s assume you want to go a little bit further, say you want to be a bit more technical, just because.

    Cheers Matt.
    Don't know Matt, I assume you would need to use a master square which would be tested and known to be true.

  10. #99
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pagie View Post
    Matt you can't be more square than square. I'm old and faithful
    I've been told I'm square but I don't know which part of me is true enough to use as the master. Most parts that I can see are somewhat round/worn.

  11. #100
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bushmiller View Post
    Pagie

    That is a tried and tested method. Probably for this purpose you should use a marking knife instead of a pencil. I think the accuracy would be well within the realms of acceptable then.

    Regards
    Paul
    That's true Paul, I'll see if I can find a piece of straight aluminium that I can try it on.

  12. #101
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    Quote Originally Posted by Picko View Post
    Don't know Matt, I assume you would need to use a master square which would be tested and known to be true.
    A master square would work,
    Also a cylindrical square on a surface plate would also work,(something I want too make one day[emoji3064])
    But now I’m going way out of my comfort zone,

    I think for humble wood workers as suggested by Paige and Paul, maybe just the old faithful flip test.

    Cheers Matt.

  13. #102
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    Quote Originally Posted by Simplicity View Post
    A master square would work,
    Also a cylindrical square on a surface plate would also work,(something I want too make one day[emoji3064])
    But now I’m going way out of my comfort zone,

    I think for humble wood workers as suggested by Paige and Paul, maybe just the old faithful flip test.

    Cheers Matt.
    All true Matt, but the problem is clamping in position while testing. I've got a home made cylindrical square with no proven credentials and my surface plate is my bandsaw table.
    I did utilise all of the above at some time during construction.

  14. #103
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    Quote Originally Posted by Picko View Post
    All true Matt, but the problem is clamping in position while testing. I've got a home made cylindrical square with no proven credentials and my surface plate is my bandsaw table.
    I did utilise all of the above at some time during construction.

    I sense there is a handmade square in my future.

    Cheers Matt.

  15. #104
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    Mine too [emoji16]

    Sent from my SM-G950F using Tapatalk

  16. #105
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    Dec 2013
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    This discussion "how square is square" is all very interesting, but we are using woodworking tools - not tools with the precision of the lathes, mills , etc demanded by the precision engineering community. Suppose that you are able to measure / mark out your line to a tolerance of +/- 1/10,000 mm or even 1/1,000 mm- what then?

    • How many of us are able to measure, cut, plane, etc. to that level of precision using typical woodworking hand tools?
    • How many of us have precision saws or planes with which we are able to achieve that level of accuracy?
    • And let's not forget the wood-turner - can you get that level of accuracy using handheld chisels, skews or gouges?


    I know I can't.

    So my question is:
    Is there any practical reason to search for a level of precision greater than the "tried and proven" - draw a perpendicular line to an edge, flip the square and check that the line is still perpendicular to the edge? If a difference cannot be seen by the eye, then is it not acceptable to consider that it is "close enough" and proceed to the next task? Job done

    (Or is this only an attempt to cover up for my advancing age and declining manual dexterity? )

    Cheers,
    Bob

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