Thread: Fixing the ribs/stringers

Hi,

Impossible to say. If the boat is traditionally built you must not use glue, just fasteners. If it is glued construction or plywood you can probably use glue and fasteners. If it is completely epoxy sealed it can be glued only with very few fasteners

MIK

Michael's correct, in that you have to offer what construction method is employed on your boat.

Most traditional methods don't have stringers glued to their frames, but a few do. Most modern methods do have glued stringers and depending on the method used for the build, they may use fasteners or may use them sparingly or they may use them only as temporary "hold downs" until the glue dries.

I just completed a 17' boat that has about 16 sheets of plywood in it and maybe a total of 12 fasteners across the whole boat. On the other side of the coin, I recently restored a traditional lapstrake cruiser. It had 3,500 clench nails, just in the planking alone (my elbow is still sore).

Yeah sorry guys I forgot that bit. It is a Hartley TS16. We will probably do the ply hull with temporary screws and epoxy. We want to keep it so that it can meets teh racing guidelines.

I don't know the TS16 build but I watched Glen build his Scamp and am guessing it's the same. It's just built up frames to which you glue big lumps of plywood isn't it?

Use epoxy mate. Use temporary fasteners where necessary, weights and clamps where they aren't (so you don't have holes to fill).

Glen's plans had a lot of fasteners left in because the plans were drawn pre-poxy - they usually aren't needed now.

Richard

These plank over frame boats really don't need epoxy. A good type 1 PVA will get the job done at a fraction of the cost and no mixing, at least the frame assemblies anyway.

Thanks guys. By the way can i make the frames out of ply or should I use timber? If I use timber will it still meet the Hartley racing guidelines?

Originally Posted by hereselmo1

Thanks guys. By the way can i make the frames out of ply or should I use timber? If I use timber will it still meet the Hartley racing guidelines?

If you have any desire at all to race it, talk to the local racing mob. There's no point building a boat to recreational standards only to find it's unsuitable for racing for some daft reason whereas building a racer and then backing off is generally easier. Similarly with kit - you might save a lot of money by putting a lower spec rig on the thing but that money's wasted if you then have to junk it to put on what the racing rules require.

A better move would be to get involved with the racing crowd now and offer yourself as a crew member (if you haven't already done so). This'll give you the experience you need to realise that this racing caper is stupidity on steroids and you'd rather relax and enjoy your boat. On the other hand, if the lunacy persists, you've got the experts on hand to ask questions like this of and to get proper answers - don't forget, local interpretation of rules can sometimes lead to changes. Besides, you'll have access to all the local solutions to problems.

Of course, this is just punishment for building a Hartley in the first place **pokes out tongue**

Richard
btw, I like Hartley's, I'm just teasing

Originally Posted by PAR

These plank over frame boats really don't need epoxy. A good type 1 PVA will get the job done at a fraction of the cost and no mixing, at least the frame assemblies anyway.

What is type 1 PVA? Is that different to polyurethane glue?

I have been told to use polyurethane glue. What are your thoughts on that guys?

If you are careful with fitting the joins and clamping then the polyurethane and exterior PVA glue will be OK.

Epoxy will be better if you cannot control those two variables.

Also epoxy sealing with three coats of a quality epoxy will cut so much maintenance out of the TS16 that it would be well and truly worth it after about 3 or 4 years. The boats don't seem to need much of a recoat over an 8 or 10 year period and it adds to the resell value too.

Up to what you want out of the boat though.

Best wishes
MIK

Here in the USA, I'd recommend Tite Bond III for your needs, but there I'm not sure if it's available. A type I adhesive is water/boil proof and PVA's are typically aliphatic resin type glues.

I agree that epoxy would be a better adhesive and that epoxy coating will save a lot of maintenance down the road.

If it is a racing one, it makes sense to go the extra 5 yards. Both for the racing itself, but also for the resale.

A good racing one will get you back about $7000+ a non racing one about half that or less.

So if you want a racing one ... have a chat with the racing guys and match their prejudices. Also if you plan to own the boat for a few years rather than sell it after a couple, epoxy will keep it looking much nicer with much, much less effort and also help ensure that it keeps its value.

MIK